People have their own ways of defining things. Going by the term Pay to "Win", you don't win anything by getting a jumpstart no matter what anyone says.
Buying Fleet carrier with ARX
- Thread starter lysan
- Start date
That's the problem I do have a life and hence not the time to grind away hours to get stuff, when I play I do what I like for an hour or two and that is simply not enough in a game like Elite, then again maybe this is not for people like me I guess, or I should wait until I retire 100%
That being said some very kind Commander donated me the credit I need to get one so this discussion is more a general question regarding monetization in ED.
LOL Star Citizen I'm looking at you!!!
Couldn't have said it better myself I agree.
I don't care about your game play desires, this is not about you, you can continue to play as you like, I'm not taking your ball away babydoll I'm asking if I could buy one for real money instead of grinding hours away to get one, just like I bought the Mandalay ship
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But you didn't buy the mandalay. You bought early access to the mandalay which will be available to everyone for free ARX towards the end of Jan.
Since Fleet Carriers are already available for free ARX, you can't buy early access to them in the same way. Sorry.
if FDev did provide some way of buying a FC for ARX then it would also need to come with protections for those who paid for theirs via the most precious commodity of time. You need to have a strategy that means that I can't just go out and buy loads of accounts, buy loads on FCs and block access to parts of the game, which could be massively advantageous to PP for example.
So how do you square the pre-build ships? They’ve all been available for credits for years before they were put on the store.
I don’t think Carriers for ARX is a good idea, but saying they’re in game for credits simply isn’t a good argument.
As for time as a commodity, I spent longer getting my Anaconda than I did my Fleet Carrier. It’s a game, we play for entertainment not a wage.
I think because every player can buy a FC for credits - why not for arx?
I just wondering why every player needs his own FC. I mean it's a FLEET carrier. Can you fly a whole fleet at the same time by yourself? For my personal taste only squadrons should have acces for FC, but thats another story.
I would be very pleased, when FC could offer some gameplay, like attacks. Attacks should be possible open only. You as an owner can upgrade and manage your security measures, give the needed resources to stay alive, manage the faction who defending it and at the end it could be something like the war system between the factions. Like 3 battle won and 4 battles lost, so the FC needs to left the system or can not operate as normal. Or something like the HP of the titan where the owner also can work for restore or increase the HP. I think there is some potential.
And after that feature the FC owner will crying in the forum that this system s*ck because their FC always get blown up.
I just wondering why every player needs his own FC. I mean it's a FLEET carrier. Can you fly a whole fleet at the same time by yourself? For my personal taste only squadrons should have acces for FC, but thats another story.
I would be very pleased, when FC could offer some gameplay, like attacks. Attacks should be possible open only. You as an owner can upgrade and manage your security measures, give the needed resources to stay alive, manage the faction who defending it and at the end it could be something like the war system between the factions. Like 3 battle won and 4 battles lost, so the FC needs to left the system or can not operate as normal. Or something like the HP of the titan where the owner also can work for restore or increase the HP. I think there is some potential.
And after that feature the FC owner will crying in the forum that this system s*ck because their FC always get blown up.
I agree, but that ship sailed a long time ago.
I want access to my own FC because it's carrying my fleet. I can decide where it goes, when and for how long. What it stores, where it sells it and who buys from it. What it looks like, what it sounds like.
The only thing I can't choose is how that insolent caricature of a crew addresses me...
I hear you, though if we didn't do things because of the potential for things to go bad then we wouldn't begin anything. The boiling frog analogy works for when there is an undesirable end goal, ie; the one turning up the heat, for the other person, ie; the frog. I don't think having early access / jump start ships is equivalent to that, though if you bring in the slippery slope argument you could bolster the analogy to mean that. However, as I've wrote earlier, that's a fallacious argument. It's up to us to let Frontier know where the line is drawn on monetization, and I'm saying that as someone who supports the early access and am ok with the jump starts.
Boiling frog - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
The boiling frog is an apologue describing a frog being slowly boiled alive. The premise is that if a frog is put suddenly into boiling water, it will jump out, but if the frog is put in tepid water which is then brought to a boil slowly, it will not perceive the danger and will be cooked to death. The story is often used as a metaphor for the inability or unwillingness of people to react to or be aware of sinister threats that arise gradually rather than suddenly.
In other words: Resist the beginnings...
BTW; it should be mentioned that the Kickstarter had paid options to get a better start in the game, so by some looser definitions of pay to win as some are trying to use here, then Elite: Dangerous has been pay to win from the beginning... so why all of a sudden try to use it to paint Frontier in a negative light? Answers on a postcard to: Doomers Dooming Incorporated, 666 Doom Street, Doomtown, Doomland.
Nice, insult people who play the game and also falsely describe the requirements to get a Fleet Carrier at the same time, to make a false point about Frontier not having a good business model. Phew, I thought you were trolling there for a second.
A joke found after reading comment : it's because I'm single I can have a FC. (ok bad pun)
An idea for the discussion :
My own opinion, so obviously biaised, FC are a part of the end game, end game should never be sold for real money as it is the very thing people hate in P2W games. Arx pre builds are early access, a shortcut for average (not overpowered) "builds", and sales for those who want a ship kit and a skin. The idea behind, to me, feels really different.
regards
An idea for the discussion :
- Real life : I pay for drop point of DSL or fibre or sat then I pay each month to keep the Internet going on. I don't think I bought Internet access. I rent it and there are fees to start/install.
- E: D : replace that with FC access and usage. Access to FC really look like a rent service.
My own opinion, so obviously biaised, FC are a part of the end game, end game should never be sold for real money as it is the very thing people hate in P2W games. Arx pre builds are early access, a shortcut for average (not overpowered) "builds", and sales for those who want a ship kit and a skin. The idea behind, to me, feels really different.
regards
Of course I do. Every time I've taken part in a beta, for example, I've been granted a major advantage over others who did not have that opportunity to experience new mechanisms and learn new skills. I've won BGS wars (or dragged out losses) and had my CMDR shoot down plenty of others because I had a head start they did not.
Prior firsthand knowledge of the ship is an advantage over those lacking such experience and if the ship is materially better at anything one would use it for, having a head start in using it would also be an advantage. That's the 'win'. I am disadvantaged vs. players who have bought these vessels for Arx. It's not a major disadvantage, but it's quite a bit larger than something like a PP module or single Engineering grade.
If I choose to, I can buy experience and thus skill, with dollars and cents, from Frontier. It's one thing to have an advantage from circumstances beyond Frontier's direct control and quite another for Frontier to monetize those circumstances.
If 'pay-to-win' is taken strictly literally and must grant an automatic and indisputable victory condition in a direct conflict, then the phrase is useless, because it describes almost no actual situation.
I don't agree with the implication that one must not have a 'life' in order to devote more time than you've chosen to and, even without any grind at all, it's hardly unusual for more time spent on gameplay to be reflected in more in-game assets and opportunities.
Contextuality.
Credits are a CMDR asset acquired by an in-game character through in-game interactions. Arx are a player asset, bought with real money, or awarded for interacting with the game in ways Frontier wants to incentivize. An in-game character knows what credits are, but would have no concept of Arx.
I mean, i square the pre- built ships by calling them a blatant cash grab with no fit purpose within the game itself.
WRT "entertainment not a wage"... this is always the funny part... a common ask is being able to pay to "skip" the boring parts of the game (engineering grind, credits, whatever)... maybe... just maybe... the game shouldn't be boring?
Five of my ships made the trip to Deciat, for the Mass Manager experimental installation. That took a couple hours. Respecting my time, they are...
IMHO, key difference is that we own ships, but we are renting FC. And FCs' price is actually a downpayment (returnable deposit or whatever) for the right to rent it.
Early access? Exactly! Personally me would love to see a new, smaller, lighter FC, possibly with less services for early access to rent it in ARX store. By other words: some ARX + N bills of Creds + weekly upkeep in Crs as usual. After some time it in the game just for Crs.
Early access? Exactly! Personally me would love to see a new, smaller, lighter FC, possibly with less services for early access to rent it in ARX store. By other words: some ARX + N bills of Creds + weekly upkeep in Crs as usual. After some time it in the game just for Crs.
There's always Space Invaders to play instead.
While I don't like the idea as such, I'd like to see a very high price for a FC, if FDev ever decide to take this step. Like, 200 real-life euros at least.
I totally understand this. But maybe, just maybe, ED is not the kind of game for you then. It's not a casual 10-100 hours game.
It's also often used as a metaphor for an idea that's totally convincing at first glance, but really totally wrong. A frog will just jump out, like any sane animal.
There is something in game shop.
www.elitedangerous.com
Livery for a carrier costs 16800ARX. Imagine price for a carrier.
Nautilus-Class Carrier - Fleet Carrier Layouts - Elite Dangerous Gamestore
Become a Dreadnought in space with the Nautilus Class Carrier! For those who always want to be the bigger fish. Please Note: You must alrea...
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That would be nice, but the salt will flow no matter what, and as a LEP holder I could say it should only be for LEP players
Carriers impact every player. They're in every session regardless of session type. They impact economy and opportunities. I get wanting to have one, sure, but at the same time this is a bit different than someone buying a ship to go shoot unending NPC spawns. Carriers are such a force multiplier that ARX is not an appropriate method.
I knew that we'd see people posting "Since you can buy ships with cash, why not other things". Such disappointment.
Also, as a LEPer, I'm still frustrated about requests like these generally.
I knew that we'd see people posting "Since you can buy ships with cash, why not other things". Such disappointment.
Also, as a LEPer, I'm still frustrated about requests like these generally.
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