CH Pro Throttle and . . . ?

[Bromley86]

Summary: What's the perfect twist-yaw joystick partner for the CH Pro Throttle?

When I first looked at HOTAS, I obviously landed on the Thrustmaster X. At £40, it's clearly what any sensible person would go for.

But then I got hit by the bug that kept me upping my KS pledge and landed on the Saitek X52 Pro. After all, it's the ED favourite (which may help explain why it's unavailable ), and it has pretty LEDs. Then I saw Ralfi's review ("I cannot stress how bad these sticks are").

So, after far too many reviews, I've landed on the CH Pro Throttle, thanks to brumster100. The thing that swung it was the lateral thruster control via the analog joystick (that and the obvious difference in quality control). But the Fighterstick has no twist yaw.

So what's the solution? The budget's around £70 for the stick (something around £150 total). Is it the Thrustmaster T.16000m? Or is twist-yaw just not that important in ED, in which case it looks like the Fighterstick is the winner.

(And yes, I tried to search. Clearly CH predates internet forums )

EDIT: Trying to avoid the pedals option. Intending to have EDtracker or TrackIR, so don't need a hat for POV.
So far, the options are Thrustmaster T16000M or the Defender Cobra M5.

EDIT2: Went for the T.16000M in the end. Price, for anyone interested, was £49 from Amazon, with the CH pro throttle costing £77 from Amazon US.

 

[adam]

I am using the Thrustmaster T16000M with my recently purchased pro throttle, and I love the joystick.

Reasons:

Hall Effect sensors
Smooooth Action
Weighted nicely (the pressure required on the stick, not the actual weight of it)
Cheap

 

[Severian]

...and CH Peddles, and CH Fighterstick. Done! Oh, TrackIR or DK2...

 

[huwthomas]

I have a t16000m and plan to add a CH Pro Throttle once they're in stock at a non-gouging price. The t16000m is a great stick, let down by the somewhat cheap-feeling base buttons and throttle slider ... two issues that become pretty much irrelevant once you add the CH Pro Throttle

 

[Helfix]

Well, I have the T16000M its a really good stick at a fair price. The only thing I dislike about it is the obvious lack of buttons/hats etc on the actual stick.

A good alternative I have been reading about was Cobra M5 joystick that also has twist capability, it's $65. It's available in Europe ( I am in U.S.) it was not worth it for me to get because by the time shipping is included its a $140 stick.

 

[Darkfyre99]

Summary: What's the perfect twist-yaw joystick partner for the CH Pro Throttle?

When I first looked at HOTAS, I obviously landed on the Thrustmaster X. At £40, it's clearly what any sensible person would go for.

But then I got hit by the bug that kept me upping my KS pledge and landed on the Saitek X52 Pro. After all, it's the ED favourite (which may help explain why it's unavailable ), and it has pretty LEDs. Then I saw Ralfi's review ("I cannot stress how bad these sticks are").

So, after far too many reviews, I've landed on the CH Pro Throttle, thanks to brumster100. The thing that swung it was the lateral thruster control via the analog joystick (that and the obvious difference in quality control). But the Fighterstick has no twist yaw.

So what's the solution? The budget's around £70 for the stick (something around £150 total). Is it the Thrustmaster T.16000m? Or is twist-yaw just not that important in ED, in which case it looks like the Fighterstick is the winner.

(And yes, I tried to search. Clearly CH predates internet forums )

I may be biased, but the best partners for a CH ProThrottle are the CH Fighterstick and CH Pro Pedals. Granted, it doesn't have twist yaw, but you can't used the advanced functionality available to CH's hardware if you mix in non-CH hardware.

The really cool thing about CH's hardware is that they communicate with each other. So you can do things like having a "shift" button on your throttle that will alter how the hats on the Fighterstick function, or use one of the throttle's hats to add trim your Pro Pedals. You can also add advanced controls like safeties, gun cameras that will turn off after a set period of time, or context sensitive controls.

(Disclaimer: Premium Beta 1 broke CH's Control Manager Devices, so such advanced functionality isn't currently available. The issue is currently ticketed and under investigation.)

When I didn't have the Pro Pedals, I used the bottom-most hat (the one that looks like a rocker) to control things like yaw in similar games. Worked pretty good, IMO.

 

[drakmaniso]

(Disclaimer: Premium Beta 1 broke CH's Control Manager Devices, so such advanced functionality isn't currently available. The issue is currently ticketed and under investigation.)

What exactly broke for you? I'm using the same CH setup with the Control Manager (map with CMS script), and it works fine.

@Bromley86: as the others I suggest you consider adding pedals to your setup. They have a learning curve, and I found them not as intuitive as a twist axis, but they are much more precise and satisfying to use. The only drawback for me is that they don't mix well with rotating office chairs...

 

[Bromley86]

Thanks guys. Should have said in the OP, but I'm trying to avoid pedals (dogs, twist chair, lotus position ).

@Helfix. Nice spot! The Cobra M5's an ugly looking stick. Funny thing is, because of the 21% VAT for EUites, it only costs Americans a couple of Euros more. Looks like the current price would be $106 inc. shipping etc (although you might get hit by local sales tax/import duty).

 

[Schnittertm]

Thanks guys. Should have said in the OP, but I'm trying to avoid pedals (dogs, twist chair, lotus position ).

@Helfix. Nice spot! The Cobra's an ugly looking stick. Funny thing is, because of the 21% VAT for EUites, it only costs Americans a couple of Euros more. Looks like the current price would be $106 inc. shipping etc (although you might get hit by local sales tax/import duty).

The look of the Cobra is different - ugly is a very subjective term - in looks as it is not styled after western style flight sticks but after the russian flight sticks.

 

[Darkfyre99]

What exactly broke for you? I'm using the same CH setup with the Control Manager (map with CMS script), and it works fine.

It's not recognizing any of the axis or buttons I have set up. As far as I can tell, none of them are recognized.

I'm running my HOTAS in DirectX mode right now, but I do miss things like having shift-next target being previous target, and being able to trim my roll during docking. Not to mention having "boost" on my right toe brake.

edit: Maybe I should try uninstalling E: D and then reinstalling it... probably should've tried that right away. :blush:

 

[Bromley86]

The look of the Cobra is different - ugly is a very subjective term - in looks as it is not styled after western style flight sticks but after the russian flight sticks.

True - I was going to expand on that when I found a good review (ugly, but . . .). Reviews in English on the Cobra M5 seem to be thin on the ground though. I think it's the placement of that far left thumb button that looks odd to me, but worst-case that's just one button that's useless.

I did find this on the Cobra M5 (and it's upgraded brother the King Cobra) which thumbs up the Cobra M5 for space sims. There are a couple of WarThunder posts on it, with a couple of guys saying it's better than the T160001 2. Anyone worried about the lack of hall effect on the yaw apparently doesn't need to be.

EDIT: Button diagram. Also, the Cobra M5 might not be too good in the long term (thread's mainly on the Mamba, but there's some Cobra stuff in it).

 

[Rog]

True - I was going to expand on that when I found a good review (ugly, but . . .). Reviews in English on the Cobra M5 seem to be thin on the ground though. I think it's the placement of that far left thumb button that looks odd to me, but worst-case that's just one button that's useless.

I did find this on the Cobra M5 (and it's upgraded brother the King Cobra) which thumbs up the Cobra M5 for space sims. There are a couple of WarThunder posts on it, with a couple of guys saying it's better than the T160001 2. Anyone worried about the lack of hall effect on the yaw apparently doesn't need to be.

EDIT: Button diagram. Also, the Cobra M5 might not be too good in the long term (thread's mainly on the Mamba, but there's some Cobra stuff in it).

It looks as thought the references there to the Cobra were for an earlier version, the newer current one has been beefed up I think.

It's big brother the Mamba looks like a real Warthog killer. The gimbal mechanism on it looks fantastic, hall sensors everywhere, and the handles are interchangeable too. I think it actually accepts the Warthog grip. Personally quite tempted.

 

[huwthomas]

So you can do things like having a "shift" button on your throttle that will alter how the hats on the Fighterstick function, or use one of the throttle's hats to add trim your Pro Pedals. You can also add advanced controls like safeties, gun cameras that will turn off after a set period of time, or context sensitive controls.

You can do much of this with any stick (or with general mixed'n'matched input device in fact) by using GlovePIE, plus a lot more such as detecting double clicks or responding differently to a tap and a sustained hold.

Clearly things like trimming the pedals from the throttle might not work, but if you're mixing and matching you probably won't worry about that lack

 

[Togg]

with the exception of a few (and they make a warthog look cheap) the vast majority of Sticks and HOTAS rigs , whether they have a metal handle or not, all suffer from the same weakness.. plastic gimbals. I have seen Warthogs destroyed alongside Saiteks.. all for the same weakness. in my opinion, the only HOTAS rig that's worth it and is classified in the Mass produced category is the CH HOTAS as they are actually designed first as Industrial controllers , and as game controllers second.

Example of a non-mass produced stick without plastic in its gimbals .

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Galactic-Pancakes/547722948631088

be prepared to drop a grand+ on a complete rig.

 

[Darkfyre99]

You can do much of this with any stick (or with general mixed'n'matched input device in fact) by using GlovePIE, plus a lot more such as detecting double clicks or responding differently to a tap and a sustained hold.

Clearly things like trimming the pedals from the throttle might not work, but if you're mixing and matching you probably won't worry about that lack

True. But one nice thing about CH hardware is that kind of functionality in inherent to the hardware, rather than being software dependent. An all CH HOTAS allows you to upload your map to the hardware, and let it do all the work.

For example, before premium beta, I had a script that put my HOTAS into docking mode. When in that mode, it disabled the boost controls, lowered landing gear, set pips to minimum engines and maximum shields, detected whether I was trimming my rotation, turned off rotation assist when it was trimmed, and "nerfed" thrusters to half power. The rotation trim would add the trim to my stick's axis.

Can't wait until I get home to see if that'll fix the detection problem.

 

[drakmaniso]

edit: Maybe I should try uninstalling E: D and then reinstalling it... probably should've tried that right away. :blush:

If that doesn't work, I think there is an option in the CH Control Manager to uninstall all CH devices drivers, then reinstall them. Maybe that could be useful.

 

[Darkfyre99]

If that doesn't work, I think there is an option in the CH Control Manager to uninstall all CH devices drivers, then reinstall them. Maybe that could be useful.

I've tested my HOTAS on other games, and it's working fine with them. Only E: D isn't working right. Worth a try anyways.

I've got an old machine still running Windows XP. I've been thinking about making a new one, since it's starting to get quirky. But then again, using my old machine is probably better for testing the game than a more modern one.

 

[Bromley86]

It's big brother the Mamba looks like a real Warthog killer. The gimbal mechanism on it looks fantastic, hall sensors everywhere, and the handles are interchangeable too. I think it actually accepts the Warthog grip. Personally quite tempted.

with the exception of a few (and they make a warthog look cheap) the vast majority of Sticks and HOTAS rigs , whether they have a metal handle or not, all suffer from the same weakness.. plastic gimbals. I have seen Warthogs destroyed alongside Saiteks.. all for the same weakness.

Yep, the metal gimbal is apparently one massive point in favour of the Black Mamba. You're right Rog, it can take a Warthog grip. You might not want to for ED though. From that first link:
Unfortunately the [Warthog stick that I replaced the] Mamba stick [with] is all metal which sounds amazing but the con is that an all metal stick is very heavy and does not move rapidly enough to make it ideal for a newtonian physics simulator. I tried it in Elite Dangerous Alpha and i was sorely disappionted to realize that its a bit top heavy for the kind of movement required, it fared better in diaspora but my verdict stands.

His final decision was for the King Cobra (i.e. the Cobra M5 with metal gimbal, hall effect yaw twist and more switches than you can shake a stick at). Mind you, he didn't consider the Fat Mamba (Black Mamba with more switches); not sure why he wouldn't have gone for that, other than cost of course.

Unfortunately, they don't price the metal gimbal on their website (you have to contact them). Not that I'll need it.

 

[Abacus]

I've tested my HOTAS on other games, and it's working fine with them. Only ED isn't working right. Worth a try anyways.

I've got an old machine still running Windows XP. I've been thinking about making a new one, since it's starting to get quirky. But then again, using my old machine is probably better for testing the game than a more modern one.

I have bought my first HOTAS for ED (CH Fighterstick + CH pro throttle) and must say it works really well (the throttle is especially great...all these functions for the left hand). Since I am new to the CH stuff I only use the control manager for calibration and making the response of the analog axis of the sticks a bit softer (CH Manager Software works fine with Windows 7 pro 64Bit).
Out of curiosity I just ordered the CH pro pedals...so...could you give me a hand for setting up the 3 devices? I guess you have much more experience with the CH products and already put a lot of thought into mapping the different ED-functions to them.

 

[timbow]

...and CH Peddles, and CH Fighterstick. Done! Oh, EDTracker or DK2...

Just edited the obvious mistake for you...