Do you remember the last time the Devs asked us what to do?No doubt, but that doesn’t make this discussion invalid. It may even come up with some good ideas that could be implemented to make the game better.
Crime and Punishment not fit for purpose - needs overhauling
- Thread starter rootsrat
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I'll take that as a yes.Might as well all delete our accounts then
Well, there have already been one or two(!) threads on the topic already. Criminal players (generally) want more risk/reward.No doubt, but that doesn’t make this discussion invalid. It may even come up with some good ideas that could be implemented to make the game better.
Realistically though, PP is still ideal for this. It gives players wanting to haul stuff or do whatever in a multiplayer environment with a crime and punishment system that can be tailored for PvP. Then leave the current C+P in its current PvE setting for everyone else.
And yet I have to wonder why on earth would you chose open mode if you want to be efficient at a hauling CG?
Personally I'd go solo for efficiency, and open if I was looking for a PvP challenge. A CG in open doesn't only come with gankers, remember how nice it is to wait around a mega ship because all the pads are occupied.. And after all these years I still don't understand why people complain about being ganked when they chosen to play in the PvP mode...
Fun fact, we've observed some of the usual SD gankers actually participating in CGs from the privacy of solo/pg.. So even some gankers know that it's better to haul in private instead of open..
That said chain interdictions can be quite annoying, be they from an actual commander or an NPC.
It would be logical, given that even as a Pilot Fed guy most people are loners, and that it would give impetus for players to join for protection.
So anyone who attacks and shoots down a (say) Imperial pledge in Imperial space would get a very high Imperial bounty, which could be negated or much lower in Federal / Alliance space, and the same in indy space (since any large power has sway).
It would bring nuance to where and who you attack, as well as make Delaine like C+P negation useful. It would require more planning but actually bring out the BGS' strengths.
Right now crime is quite monotone and dull because everything is treated locally. I should know, at one point I had multiple ships with billions of bounties on each (before I pushed them into a pit).
"'Got a few parking tickets, better push the Camry off the local cliff" (what town doesn't have a cliff overlooking a lake?)
Again, the issue with a CG is you only have one location for gankers to sit around in, whereas something done in PP could be set up so you could deliver to one of multiple places (although only benefitting the system you actually deliver to). So if one system is effectively blockaded, you can deliver to another (although if it was me I'd find a way of boosting rewards for anyone who did deliver something in a system with high levels of opposing players present).And yet I have to wonder why on earth would you chose open mode if you want to be efficient at a hauling CG?
Personally I'd go solo for efficiency, and open if I was looking for a PvP challenge. A CG in open doesn't only come with gankers, remember how nice it is to wait around a mega ship because all the pads are occupied.. And after all these years I still don't understand why people complain about being ganked when they chosen to play in the PvP mode...
Fun fact, we've observed some of the usual SD gankers actually participating in CGs from the privacy of solo/pg.. So even some gankers know that it's better to haul in private instead of open..
That said chain interdictions can be quite annoying, be they from an actual commander or an NPC.
What I find annoying is that the idea of hot ships is a good one, if you are not part of the Pilots Fed and that criminal systems have escalating costs for cleaning (perhaps to the point where they can't be cleaned, being so notorious).
Its why when I was BGS murdering I'd be using engineered Clippers and low cost vehicles that I could get rid of. I'd very much like something like this https://forums.frontier.co.uk/threa...sible-for-player-assets-such-as-ships.597257/ which uses the BGS properly and makes being a career criminal require planning and craft.
Crime & Punishment in ED is easily the single most messed up, illogical, bizarre, nonsensical element of the game.
Topped off with blatant software bugs to make it super great. Relog so you can see your invisible fines? What the heck???
Ya, there is a big history, blah blah blah. Its awful.
Topped off with blatant software bugs to make it super great. Relog so you can see your invisible fines? What the heck???
Ya, there is a big history, blah blah blah. Its awful.
What do I think? I think my post is useless and still, I feel the urge to make it. You hit ALL the nails on the head:
- bounties worth less than heat conduction wiring - CHECK
- billionaire murderhobos nuff said - CHECK
- notoriety being the thing that only newbs complain about on the forum - CHECK
- competitive CGs + interdiction gameplay = beer + milk - CHECK
- interdiction putting the target ship's gearbox in reverse is just absurd - CHECK
- capped bounties / no coop payments because "ze goldsellers" phobia is so 2015 - CHECK
- the reason Thargoids invaded was because they saw our police response - CHECK
- where muh Grand Theft Spaceship gameplay at - CHECK
I think Arthur exclaimed "We're back!" in the first Frontier Unlocked. I think I would start believing that... if at least some of OP's points would be addressed going into 2025. Otherwise, it's just the same game as before, with some minor improvements...
Actually I have lost a fair few interdictions against T7s, as they have excellent yaw. Hang my head in shame I guess ..
Claiming the game is set in a dystopian environment is not a "get out of jail free" card for a game developer. I have heard the same argument about the game's UI... it reflects the crumby dystopian future.... Well yes, sure to a certain degree.... but NO!, that isn't an excuse for poor design and obvious mistakes, game bugs, illogical elements, etc.
If Ridley Scott makes a movie set in a dystopian future... that isn't an excuse for giving the audience an illogical story filled with nonsense. And the audience shouldn't have to reboot their DvD player occasionally because it is a "dystopian movie".
From a pvp piracy perspective I agree with most of your points, especially the reward for bounty hunting.
However a high level of punishment for ganking should at least take into account that the destroyed ship was really a helpless victim or not: what if i as a pirate, interdict a shieldless T9 that fancies its chances and decides to make a fight of it? While trying to disable said T9 the pirate accidentally destroys it and receives the punishment you describe. It’s difficult to think of a fair system that wouldn’t be exploited. Any ideas?
I don't know what the solution is and from what I've read, i don't think the solutions people are suggesting would really solve issues either, just change them.
What I will say is I hate how notoriety was introduced due to PvP issues yet they made it apply to PvE as well. That really annoyed me. It wasn't needed for PvE at all and I wish they would at least undo that.
What I will say is I hate how notoriety was introduced due to PvP issues yet they made it apply to PvE as well. That really annoyed me. It wasn't needed for PvE at all and I wish they would at least undo that.
I am in favor of the topic, that is, I think changes should be made regarding gankers. Last time I flew in CG the gankers were literally hunting me.
When I added one it was the one going into the wing with another. Once it was so that I was pulled 4-5 times and each time instead of being closer to the station I was back to the starting point which to me is not understandable.
I would even be in favor of the possibility of synchronizing blocked players with other players or with the squadron. Because adding gankers to the blocked list is the only effective way to play peacefully. I don't see why I can't see other normal players and have to fly solo as gankers are probably less than normal players. So why does everyone else have to agonize over gankers?
In life there is imprisonment for years for murder, in the game what is? A fine on a dime? This is not balanced in any way.
So yes, the balance for crimes should be rethought but with PvP in mind because PvE is a different matter and there are also missions that sometimes have this and not that effect.
When I added one it was the one going into the wing with another. Once it was so that I was pulled 4-5 times and each time instead of being closer to the station I was back to the starting point which to me is not understandable.
I would even be in favor of the possibility of synchronizing blocked players with other players or with the squadron. Because adding gankers to the blocked list is the only effective way to play peacefully. I don't see why I can't see other normal players and have to fly solo as gankers are probably less than normal players. So why does everyone else have to agonize over gankers?
In life there is imprisonment for years for murder, in the game what is? A fine on a dime? This is not balanced in any way.
So yes, the balance for crimes should be rethought but with PvP in mind because PvE is a different matter and there are also missions that sometimes have this and not that effect.
If the pirate doesn't have the skill to disable without a kaboom, they get punished for the murder they committed. The pirate doesn't have to rob the trader, if they realize this fight isn't one they can end without an explosion, they could always back off and live to pirate another day.
I agree up to a point, but the whole negotiation “give me your stuff or I’ll boil you up” scenario depends on a threat of destruction. I would apply the high penalties, but only in high sec systems: at least that would encourage traders to plane their routes.
It definitely is an issue that notoriety is more of a problem for the player who accidentally hit a harmless sidewinder which then got blown up somehow. Me, I just keep playing as I still have access to the anarchy stations and settlements I visit or my carrier, which could be parked in an empty system is I got fed up of being shot at by sys sec.
As much as I wasn't a fan of the hot ships system in Horizons (it was the gun's fault I shot that person 9 times), at least it allowed you to use your weaponless T-9 to do a few trade runs.
Personally I think you could deal with some of this by making it so low notoriety made bounty hunters take more notice and you're more likely to get scanned when docking. Get to, say, 4 and you're in trouble as now you start getting locked out of places. Get to 8 and ATR actively hunt you in wanted systems.
Depends on your target. Try disabling the drives of a harmless T-6.
On a player who is most likely flying in a straight line? Strip shields + Sturdy seekers, easily done. But, if the pirate can't pull this off, they don't need to commit the theft, that's the entire point. If they don't want the time, don't do the crime. They're under no obligation to rob this T6.
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