CV1 Glare - It looks pretty bad, anyone seeing this?

[Obsidian Ant]

I've seen a lot of people around the Internet mentioning some pretty bad glare on the CV1 that isn't present with the DK2, here is an example:

[video]http://webmshare.com/play/a79A6[/video]

I appreciate that the camera will 'add' it's own glare effect, but apparently this video clip is close to what it looks like to the naked eye. It is apparent on scenes that have bright content on a dark background; in other words space sims.

Clip from here: https://www.reddit.com/r/oculus/comments/4cdntm/webm_cellphone_video_capture_of_the_halo_effect/

Anyone else able to verify this?

EDIT: I don't actually have a CV1 myself - which is why I'm asking other people about this. It will clearly have an effect on my decision to buy one...

 

[simphe]

I don't have a CV1 so I can only go by the clip but it looks like the camera's moving slightly independently of the lens it's pointing through. This could exaggerate it maybe? Surely it can't be that bad.

 

[VR andysonofbob]

Mate

Soz for hijacking your thread. :/

But I know you are a man who enjoys exploring and knows the DK2 very well! Fancy a mission?

If so I would like your impression of screen door compared to DK2. I would be really grateful if you could find and fly about 500m up over a featureless planet, ideally at night. What is this like? This is the only time I notice the screendoor effect with the DK2, what is it like with the CV1?

Thanks!

 

[simphe]

Mate

Soz for hijacking your thread. :/

But I know you are a man who enjoys exploring and knows the DK2 very well! Fancy a mission?

If so I would like your impression of screen door compared to DK2. I would be really grateful if you could find and fly about 500m up over a featureless planet, ideally at night. What is this like? This is the only time I notice the screendoor effect with the DK2, what is it like with the CV1?

Thanks!

I don't think he has a CV1 which is why he was asking that question.

 

[Monk]

Could there be a plastic film people are not removing?

Could these be folks cleaning their lenses with anything abrasive? (I'd bet there is an anti-glare coating that can be removed by the likes of Windex)

If none of the above, I imagine Oculus is going to have to send out some new lenses to people. Glare is unacceptable and trivial to avoid.

 

[Arithon]

Mate

Soz for hijacking your thread. :/

But I know you are a man who enjoys exploring and knows the DK2 very well! Fancy a mission?

If so I would like your impression of screen door compared to DK2. I would be really grateful if you could find and fly about 500m up over a featureless planet, ideally at night. What is this like? This is the only time I notice the screendoor effect with the DK2, what is it like with the CV1?

Thanks!

Having used the Vive (same resolution as CV1) I can say at 2160x1200 there is no "screen door" (visible gaps between pixels). The pixels themselves are visible, but it's more like viewing a game in 1280x1024 on a 1080p monitor. Chunky, not mesh-like.

 

[catanonia]

Could there be a plastic film people are not removing?

Could these be folks cleaning their lenses with anything abrasive? (I'd bet there is an anti-glare coating that can be removed by the likes of Windex)

If none of the above, I imagine Oculus is going to have to send out some new lenses to people. Glare is unacceptable and trivial to avoid.

You could be right as I am sure I saw a plastic film that needed removing on the CV1 lenses in an unboxing video. Would be so funny if this was the case

 

[Xebec]

I've seen a lot of people around the Internet mentioning some pretty bad glare on the CV1 that isn't present with the DK2, here is an example:

<snip>

Anyone else able to verify this?

CMDR 'Ant - I can confirm there is some of this going on with the CV1 (and I didn't see or notice it on the DK2 or DK1 previously).

I *think* it's because the CV1 lens is more sensitive to any kind of contaminant than the previous lenses were. As silly as it sounds, if I clean the lens with a dry cloth and do it in the circle pattern starting from the center like their FAQ states (I checked because I'd like to find a proper chemical to clean with), the glare seems to disappear (90-100%).

The glare almost feels like a JJ Abrams Star Trek movie when it happens.. . I observed it in Elite and Defense Grid 2 in VR.

UPDATE - it's also more obvious if you swing your eyes around the headset - it doesn't really appear (to my eyes atleast) if I keep my eyes locked forward and move my head around)...

 

[Obsidian Ant]

CMDR 'Ant - I can confirm there is some of this going on with the CV1 (and I didn't see or notice it on the DK2 or DK1 previously).

I *think* it's because the CV1 lens is more sensitive to any kind of contaminant than the previous lenses were. As silly as it sounds, if I clean the lens with a dry cloth and do it in the circle pattern starting from the center like their FAQ states (I checked because I'd like to find a proper chemical to clean with), the glare seems to disappear (90-100%).

The glare almost feels like a JJ Abrams Star Trek movie when it happens.. . I observed it in Elite and Defense Grid 2 in VR.

UPDATE - it's also more obvious if you swing your eyes around the headset - it doesn't really appear (to my eyes atleast) if I keep my eyes locked forward and move my head around)...

Thanks for this. If cleaning the lenses fixes the problem, that is a pretty good sign.

Moving my eyes around in VR is a huge part of the experience, it would be a bit weird to not be able to do that. But it would suggest that the problem comes from the edges of the lenses rather than the center.

 

[Monk]

I *think* it's because the CV1 lens is more sensitive to any kind of contaminant than the previous lenses were. As silly as it sounds, if I clean the lens with a dry cloth and do it in the circle pattern starting from the center like their FAQ states (I checked because I'd like to find a proper chemical to clean with), the glare seems to disappear (90-100%).

Some residue left over from manufacturing, perhaps?

 

[Obsidian Ant]

Mate

Soz for hijacking your thread. :/

But I know you are a man who enjoys exploring and knows the DK2 very well! Fancy a mission?

If so I would like your impression of screen door compared to DK2. I would be really grateful if you could find and fly about 500m up over a featureless planet, ideally at night. What is this like? This is the only time I notice the screendoor effect with the DK2, what is it like with the CV1?

Thanks!

I don't actually have the CV1, which is why I want to know how this all is working.

 

[ghcannon]

while there is a bit more of this "sunshaft bleeding" effect in the periphery of the lens, when the headset is properly centered on your head, there is no issue on and around the center of projection.

The screenshot is very much exagerrated.

 

[Eggplant!]

Hey Ant!

I have a CV1, and I finally got Elite working with it last night. The lens flare effect/glare is very real and quite pronounced. It's not due to grime on the lenses either. It's due to the Fresnel type lenses used. The Crescent Bay had this issue too. Vive will also have this problem.

The picture you posted is pretty accurate. Take that pic, and make it less blurry, but keep the glare trails. That's what it looks like. Fortunately, it only really shows on dark scenes with white or bright objects. (Which is only 90% of Elite... haha)

 

[Xebec]

Hey Ant!

I have a CV1, and I finally got Elite working with it last night. The lens flare effect/glare is very real and quite pronounced. It's not due to grime on the lenses either. It's due to the Fresnel type lenses used. The Crescent Bay had this issue too. Vive will also have this problem.

The picture you posted is pretty accurate. Take that pic, and make it less blurry, but keep the glare trails. That's what it looks like. Fortunately, it only really shows on dark scenes with white or bright objects. (Which is only 90% of Elite... haha)

See above - ghcannon's post; try recentering and readjusting the IPD - that should help minimize it... Cleaning it a couple of times definitely helped me -- i'd say it didn't completely fix it but it reduced it substantially. I do agree the fresnel-hybrid lens makes it more likely to occur than previous headsets though.

I am wondering if there is some residue left on the lens from the plastic you have to pull off.

 

[Eggplant!]

I've spent about 6 hours in CV1 at this point. Not being centered makes it worse for sure, but the glare is there and is it significant. The lenses are clean.

Like I said, it's due to the rings in the Fresnel lenses. CV1, Crescent Bay and Vive share this flaw.

 

[Monk]

I've spent about 6 hours in CV1 at this point. Not being centered makes it worse for sure, but the glare is there and is it significant. The lenses are clean.

Like I said, it's due to the rings in the Fresnel lenses. CV1, Crescent Bay and Vive share this flaw.

Well shoot...that is one of the best reason's I've heard for waiting out the early adoption period.

 

[Obsidian Ant]

Well shoot...that is one of the best reason's I've heard for waiting out the early adoption period.

I agree. I'm starting to think I will keep hold of my DK2 for the rest of this year and see what happens later...

 

[Apostle]

I've spent about 6 hours in CV1 at this point. Not being centered makes it worse for sure, but the glare is there and is it significant. The lenses are clean.

Like I said, it's due to the rings in the Fresnel lenses. CV1, Crescent Bay and Vive share this flaw.

If the DK2 did not have the issue, how long until someone starts selling lens upgrades. Along those lines are the lenses removable like the DK2's?

 

[Eggplant!]

I agree. I'm starting to think I will keep hold of my DK2 for the rest of this year and see what happens later...

Now don't get me wrong. The CV1+1.3 comes with some extremely significant plusses too.

The 90Hz+ATW is amazing. With ATW tweening lost frames, judder is essentially gone even if your fps drops to 45. Which is amazing. Things are generally sharper due to the increased res and ability to bump up quality without getting judder.

The glare is annoying, but it's not a deal breaker.

 

[CptSiddy]

Also, the Vive has less of this problem because it has about half as many fresnel segments as rift.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NCBEYaC876A

Here is a quick video to to help you understand this phenomena.

The Vive went for the less sharp rout because it has slightly bigger FoV and has chromatic aberration compensated for in software. The bigger FOV result in less pixel density which is ironically masked by the slight blur that the choice of their lens makes.

In short. Oculus, most likely went for the "experience" oriented route, trying to reach audience wider than just gamers. And for this, sharper image at the center and higher pixel density at the cost of slightly smaller FOV.
However, the "lost light" that the video mentioned is the cause of the flare effects. Vive has roughly half of this problem.

Hope this helps.