[Discussion] Planet Zoo DLC Subscription Pass

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A few days ago, Planet Coaster tweeted out an update. Surprising, right? This time it's in reference to a new "Subscription Pass" model. I think a few of you might have seen this, I put out a video on this a day or so ago, and I got some relatively positive response from my little congregation, but I'm curious to hear what the forums have to say about this.

Well, our side of the tracks that is! You can check out what the Planet Coaster response has been over on their blue site:

Now, it's been pretty brutal for Planet Coaster. Many people are relatively upset about this, specifically because it came out of nowhere with no supplemental update for QOL, framerate issues, etc.
This, I can agree with for the most part. It's a bit jarring to see that there are some things that haven't been addressed, but I'm not really too taken aback by it. It's an old game, it's made for older hardware, and they have the dichotomy between the Console and PC versions now. It'd be more difficult now more than ever to do a QOL update when you're trying to account for 3 different platforms.

Now, I wanted to know what the Planet Zoo community would react to this, if we are to get something along the lines of a Subscription Pass.

Ideally, it would give you access to for $4.99 (assuming it will be the same):

Arctic Pack, South America Pack, Australia Pack, Aquatic Pack, Southeast Asia Animal Pack, Africa Pack, North America Animal Pack, Europe Pack, Wetlands Animal Pack, Conservation Pack, Twilight Pack, and whatever comes next!

So far we have 11 DLC's, which at full price would total around $110.

Now, I'm curious as to how the community would respond to something like this. Obviously for many of us, it really doesn't affect us since we kinda buy the DLC like clockwork for the most part from what I've seen! However, how do you think this would affect casual players? Newcomers, etc? I'm hoping to hear from all of you and kindly talk about this before it descends to flamewars like on the Steam page :ROFLMAO:
 
I'm in the middle ground of this and can totally see why the coaster community is outraged at the idea of introducing no more than a quick cash grab to a pretty much dead game. Now I would actually support this idea for planet zoo because the dlc list keeps expanding and is a hefty fee for someone who wants to explore everything the game has to offer in one purchase. Did I buy all the dlc outside steam sales - yes at the time it was near $80 at once. A subscription pass for an actively developmented game I support and is a great way to introduce new players into the vast amount of content without having to pick and choose
 
Personally I do not have any problem with it, obviously it is not aimed at long-term players as that would be quite expensive over time, but for anyone wanting to try out the DLCs or for some youtubers that cover games in series then abandon them, it is an option.

It will surely find its uses, for example my boyfriend and I are both gamers, but while I tend to stick to my favourite games for a while, he likes to try many games then move to another big thing, he often use some kind of subscriptions like this, so he would be a potentional customer. It is not like it is forced to anyone.

I have a feeling that alot of the negativity comes from the fact that PlanetCoaster was silently abandoned and the fans are desperate for any kind of new content or sequel, so after so much silence from the devs, this might not have been the news they were waiting for.
 
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I'd personally not get a use out of it, because if I'm going to own a base game already and like it, I'm probably going to own the DLC as well. That's definitely the case for Planet Zoo.
I could see the logic of someone getting the base game on a deep sale (like 50/75%) off and not being sure if they like it, and trying the subscription for the DLC before going all the way in on it. I'd probably do the same but I'm so far into PZ already that there's no point.
 
🤔 might be useful for People that don't have much Money. They could do it like that then and buy them when they can afford it. I think there also shouldn't be any Problems with your Zoos if you cancel the Subscription because you can also open Zoos in Sandbox that have Content from DLCs you don't have👍
 
I think it's fine as long as the monthly subscription model doesn't replace bought dlc. My knee-jerk reaction was definitely negative because I'd worry that was the case, but as a way to try out the dlcs for short-term I can see it being useful.
Well that's one way to lose almost all regular financial support to the game if they completely remove the ability to buy dlc. As long as we can buy the dlc outright I have no problem with this service
 
I'm one of the many players who have both games and all the DLC.

My concern is for the people who dont. Short term subscription so that you can try all the packs and then decide which, if any you want to buy is a brilliant option.
But what happens for those who subscribe long term and then cancel? They'll be able to open saves and blueprints which they may have spent countless hours building that contain content from the DLCs, but if PlanZoo is the same as PlanCo, they won't be able to save their progress. As you can't save files that contain content you don't own, you'd not be able to progress with any of your work containing DLC.. That would be heartbreaking. If it was something you was really enjoying building in. And as us builders in these kinds of games know, in effect, losing your progress is unthinkable.

I think a really simple solution would be a couple of options if you cancel.

1: If you've paid less on subscription than the value of all the DLCs, you should have the option to make a one off payment of the remainder of the value and keep them.

2: If you've paid more on subscription than the value of all the DLCs, you should get to keep them anyway.

With options like these in place, everyone wins. And I'm sure no one would have any complaints about this service. People couldn't hate on Frontier and accuse them of being a corporate cash grab company like we've seen people accuse them when they're offering a really flexible, affordable way to own all this lovely content.
 
I'm one of the many players who have both games and all the DLC.

My concern is for the people who dont. Short term subscription so that you can try all the packs and then decide which, if any you want to buy is a brilliant option.
But what happens for those who subscribe long term and then cancel? They'll be able to open saves and blueprints which they may have spent countless hours building that contain content from the DLCs, but if PlanZoo is the same as PlanCo, they won't be able to save their progress. As you can't save files that contain content you don't own, you'd not be able to progress with any of your work containing DLC.. That would be heartbreaking. If it was something you was really enjoying building in. And as us builders in these kinds of games know, in effect, losing your progress is unthinkable.

I think a really simple solution would be a couple of options if you cancel.

1: If you've paid less on subscription than the value of all the DLCs, you should have the option to make a one off payment of the remainder of the value and keep them.

2: If you've paid more on subscription than the value of all the DLCs, you should get to keep them anyway.

With options like these in place, everyone wins. And I'm sure no one would have any complaints about this service. People couldn't hate on Frontier and accuse them of being a corporate cash grab company like we've seen people accuse them when they're offering a really flexible, affordable way to own all this lovely content.
 
People couldn't hate on Frontier and accuse them of being a corporate cash grab company
All companies are corporate cash-grabbers. That's just the nature of the game. Everything they do is in service of getting more money. I don't like the notion that just because this company happens to be producing something we love they should therefore be immune to the same criticism lobbed at any other capitalist invention.
 
There are far far worse companies in regards to their dlc policy and other methods of retaining players. I don't need to name any of these considering they are very well known in the gaming industry. There is a balance needed between optional purchases for a minority of the playerbase and forcing a service to access dlc content
 
I don't really have a problem with it as long as this format is an addition and not the substitute for purchasing DLCs normally. Planet Coaster has been done for quite a while. I believe it would be better if they just announced that the support is ending when the last update rolled out and the game is finished, but it has been more than 3 years since the last DLC so I don't believe anyone should still be expecting future content. I think it's a good model for new players who would like to try out all the content, and then decide what they like best, and if they'd like to purchase it. I understand the pain - for example I play Total War Warhammer series which is also notorious for having A LOT of DLCs (granted, some of those are free Lord packs, but a few of them add new campaings and factions, and they can be expensive + the base games cost like 60€ on Steam), and I'm someone who must have all the DLCs otherwise I know the game isn't complete, and I'm missing out. I'd feel the same way about PZ if I wouldn't have all the DLCs.

It's definitely a more affordable way of trying out extra content instead of just buying everything all at once. I wouldn't mind if something like this was implemented for PZ at the end of its development.
 
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Oh and I forgot to add - if building and simulation is the kind of thing a potential new player enjoys than in the long term it's much better to buy all the DLCs. In my opinion, these are the kind of games that have longevity, and you are limited only by your imagination (especially when we have so many wonderful ahem mods out there). Same with TW:W - before you go through all the campaings with all factions, and potentially with all Lords it could literally take you years, lol. That's why it's worth investing into DLCs, in my opinion.
 
@NZFanatic You're absolutely correct in that companies are there to make money. None of us are that naive to think that it's all for the love of it.
However, I don't think Frontier is that cold. And I'm saying this from a personal experience standpoint as in I've been to Frontier studios more than once and seen the guys at work and spoken to the devs on many occasions. The Planet games were a real passion project for some of the major players within the company.

Yes, they're there to make money, but I don't believe it's that cut and dry that they have no respect for the players and just want to rinse us of our cash.
 
My thoughts on what happens to their games if they've used DLC content and then cancel the subscription - I would think the majority of those who cancel the subscription would fall into one of two groups:
People who tried out the subscription to see if it was worth their interest in investing in a more permanent form of content (buying the DLC outright) in which case they will still be able to play those zoos.
People who tried out the subscription and ultimately decided that it was not worth investing in the DLC more permanently, and probably wouldn't be that bothered by the fact that they couldn't load their zoo with DLC.

oh sure, on the second scenario, there'd be that initial standard complaints and griping about how it wasn't fair, they paid for it, and so forth, but in the long run, they'd probably get over it just fine.

The idea that if they had signed up for the subscription and kept on with it for several years, at the point where the money they paid is equal to the DLC, they could then get the DLC for free has merit. If there ends up being 16 DLC (just to give an example), and they stayed with the subscription for long enough their expenditure was at least $160, I don't see the issue of them having the DLC available to them permanently.
 
I'm of the opinion that Coaster and Zoo have developed in such different ways, with such different player bases, that comparing the two is a dangerous form of "old think", and carries the risk (consciously or unconsciously) of biasing or privileging those elements that happen to be the same, as opposed to all the ways that Zoo is different and special. So with that huge caveat, (a reminder to myself of the pitfalls and the trap I'm about to enter), here are my initial thoughts on what subscriptions might mean for PZ:

I think "cash grab" is just customer-speak for "wise business decision", so I have no problem there.

As a post-development strategy, long after the hard-core fans have already gotten to enjoy the game, I think it's fine. I presume that Frontier has the statistics to back up the choice for Coaster (or they wouldn't have done it), such as how many new players at this late date only try the base game (so that even a month with the dlc subscription is a bonus), or how many new players at this point only come in for a limited time before moving on to another game. I also assume they factored in the numerous sales they have throughout the year too (another place where new customers are paying less than the veterans, but one that we all accept as normal and pay anyway because we want the content now, not x months from now).

Obviously, my hope is that PZ continues adding new animals in paid dlc forever. Meaning the post-development subscription model wouldn't come to PZ until forever plus x years from now! The idea of a subscription model while development is still occurring (which, again, I hope continues for a long time in PZ), gets a lot more tricky. I think they should stick to buying outright during the many, MANY years that PZ is still going to remain in development.

A few other things to consider:
1. Is the renewal process automatic, or do you opt in every month? This makes a big difference in how much Frontier will actually make (from people who maybe forget they are subscribed), and would also make a difference in whether I'd try it (in another game, of course. I'm ride or die for PZ).

2. Are there ways that the subscription model might actually HELP long-term players who already own the game outright, at no additional cost? For example, could the subscriptions from newbies help defray the cost of keeping the franchise servers working even longer after development than they might have otherwise? (Since unlike the other modes, we are reliant on a digital infrastructure that's outside of our own personal machines). These types of considerations change the equation and calculations for me, since it might mean that existing players are seeing a benefit, even if not formally announced. (ie. the free update is that the franchise servers would continue to exist for all players, precisely because the new subscriptions are making that possible).

3. Might subscription players transform the player base and help renew different game modes later in the game's life? After all, it's not merely a new purchasing model, but potentially a new style of players, and a chance to do new styles of advertising for a different set of players. For example, does it mean more players who are spending a month or two working through the career modes and scenario modes, as opposed to players who spend six months (or longer!) working to perfect a single sandbox zoo? Does it rejuvenate the franchise market, since you'll have new players trying things out, instead of just the old pros who have a million credits built up? Will we learn new tips and tricks from players who are seeing the game mechanics from different perspectives, instead of predominantly through the lens of Planet Coaster or Zoo Tycoon? (And will these forums be as open and engaging to people who bring perspectives and comparisons from other games, with the same energy and with the same enthusiasm that we are all responding to PC news right now? LOL!)

4. Does the prospect of eventual subscriptions (even if way in the distant future after development ends), nevertheless change player (buyer) behavior even while the game is still in development? Not so much for hardcore fans like all of us, but for casual folks who think "maybe I'll try it someday", for whom someday might come earlier if it's always going to be a buy situation, but who might wait and have someday come much later if they know it will change to subscriptions?

5. Does the prospect of eventual subscriptions (even if way in the distant future after development ends), nevertheless change dev behavior even while the game is still in development? I doubt this would happen overtly, but I can see it being a subtle influencer in a corporate culture sort of way. Is someone more likely to renew their subscription for another month because they haven't yet tried "flexicolor beam 2", or because they haven't built for a new animal? Will we see a subtle shift towards pieces and mechanics which may be either more basic or stylized-but easily-placeable, but which get people to renew their subscription who have only played for 1, 2 or 3 months, as opposed to more advanced tools, that take us 1, 2, or 3 years just to build and learn! Does it make it more likely that certain things might get fixed or updated (pathing difficulties, climbing difficulties, ease of management) because the devs are subtly encouraged to think of the player base as rolling waves of people with 1, 2, or 3 months of experience, as opposed to being told that they'll get better if they'd only practice for a decade.

6. Will reviewers, forum members, and content creators need to begin taking the possibility of future subscription players into account when reviewing new announcements, updates, and dlc? So in the same way that some reviewers will say "this will be helpful for franchise players" even if they themselves don't play in franchise, will we start seeing reviews that say "this will be great for eventual subscription players" or "this will be great for getting eventual subscription players to renew for more months" even if they themselves are going to own the game outright?

7. Similarly, might we see even more content creators engaging with the career and timed scenarios, as new waves of viewers come through who aren't intending (at least initially) to become long-term master builders in sandbox, but are looking for tips and tricks to get through the various goals and challenges? Subscriptions could lead more people to smash the subscribe button for creators too, and reward the ones who cater to their unique subscription-based play styles!

8. And finally, does the Bundling of all the dlc together make us think of them differently than when we're judging them one at a time? Is it more likely that someone who tries them for a month or two and decides they like the game is more likely to end up buying not merely specific dlc, but ALL of the dlc, because they have come to think of them as a package? Does it decrease the impact of historical decisions about the timing or roll-out of various elements, if they start to be seen as a collection? In 25 years, when subscribers are getting birds and fish and llamas and polar bears and kangaroos and binturong all in the same "package", will they even recognize the debates that we've all been having?
 
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