Discussions about Steam Charts

We all know that according to some the game is dying since a few years and most of the time they'll show us some numbers from Steam Charts as proof.

http://steamcharts.com/app/359320

Problem with Steam Charts is that the data is not really reliable:

- PS4, Xbox and customers of the Frontier Store are completely ignored (which should be the most loyal players)
- Steam Charts only shows concurrent players which tells us how many Steam Users are in game simultaneously rather than the active player base

Why doesn't concurrent players tell us much? If anything it tells us how much time people spend in game and not how many people are playing it. If 24 people are playing the game for one hour a day and everyone starts at a different time, Steam Charts will tell us that only 1 person is playing the game. If they play for 24 rather than 1 hour Steam Charts will tell us that 24 people are playing the game which is an entirely different number.

If you still want to know if the game is healthy it probably makes more sense to visit Steam Spy because they tell us about the audience (unique player in 2 weeks). Allegedly there are 80,404 players who played the game at least once in the last two weeks via Steam. Problem with that number is that it isn't stored over time so when I tell you that it didn't change much over the last 3 years (it goes up and down between 65k and 100k) you'll just have to believe me or search my post history because I pulled that number repeatedly over the last few years. Another problem is that these numbers are just estimates and highly unreliable. There is no way to know the exact active player base unless you work at Frontier Developments.

http://steamspy.com/app/359320

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But some people always argue that you could still see a trend when looking at concurrent players and post that link anyway. Now the worst part is that they will tell you to look at a graph that is at the top of Steam Charts and allegedly shows the performance of the game by comparing peak numbers.

There are two problems:

- Peak concurrent players are actually worse than average concurrent players simply because that number changes drastically on specific events (First Thargoid encounter, Planetary Landings released, etc.)
- The numbers the graph uses are wrong

I don't think I need to explain further why using peak numbers is a bad idea to judge the health status of a game, but why does the graph use the wrong numbers?

1. Go to Steam Charts and set the graph to one year.
2. Hover your mouse over the line and notice how many data points are used.
3. Count how many data points are in the first 3/4 and how many are in the last quarter of the graph.

It's 9 data points in the first 3/4 and 15 data points in the last quarter of the year. This means that the curve is flattened in favour of early peak numbers which makes it look like there would be a drastic decline in concurrent peak players.

In reality they just pick the best results of the first three quarters and put them next to the mixed results of the last few months, which is of course wrong:

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So I took the numbers from Steam Charts and created my own graph using just 12 data points and added average concurrent players. It still looks like there would be a decline in players but that's most likely down to the first Thargoid sightings in early 2017 (if you look closely you can actually see that the numbers didn't change from Dec 16 to Nov 17...).

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But how does the game perform since launch?

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With average concurrent players:

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(EDIT just noticed that there is something wrong with the months, give me some time to correct it looks like it's just the label, data should be correct ;) ...)

As said above, nothing of that really means anything. It doesn't matter how many concurrent players the game has on Steam. Is the game dying? Probably not. Is it normal that a game doesn't attract as many players as it did 3 years ago? Probably. Do we have any data about Xbox, PS4, Frontier Store or even about the actual player base on Steam rather than concurrent players? Nope.
 
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I think, OP, you are a little bit wrong.
It all depends on what question you want to answer from the figures.

If steam stats for E D, number of concurrent players is decreasing you can draw the conclusion from it, that overall numbers are also decreasing, if nothing else has changed.
The conclusion may be wrong when in the observed period of time something else has changed, e.g. Xbox version has been released.

But in most times correlation between "number of concurrent players" and "number of overall players currently playing" is 100%. You see in this sentence that the second number is not well defined, but it is what you are refer to!

Actually I would interprete steam stats currently as "player base is quite stable", as you did in your analysis.
 
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I think, OP, you are a little bit wrong.
It all depends on what question you want to answer from the figures.

If steam stats for E D, number of concurrent players is decreasing you can draw the conclusion from it, that overall numbers are also decreasing, if nothing else has changed.
The conclusion may be wrong when in the observed period of time something else has changed, e.g. Xbox version has been released.

But in most times correlation between "number of concurrent players" and "number of overall players currently playing" is 100%. You see in this sentence that the second number is not well defined, but it is what you are refer to!

No, not necessarily. See my example above for time spend in game. If people spend less time in game it doesn't mean that the player base gets smaller but concurrent players will decline.

Is it time for another one of these? Should I get the popcorn?

It's actually one of the other kind, but you may still get the popcorn! :)
 
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I think, OP, you are a little bit wrong.
It all depends on what question you want to answer from the figures.

If steam stats for E D, number of concurrent players is decreasing you can draw the conclusion from it, that overall numbers are also decreasing, if nothing else has changed.
The conclusion may be wrong when in the observed period of time something else has changed, e.g. Xbox version has been released.

But in most times correlation between "number of concurrent players" and "number of overall players currently playing" is 100%. You see in this sentence that the second number is not well defined, but it is what you are refer to!

Actually I would interprete steam stats currently as "player base is quite stable", as you did in your analysis.

I understand what he is saying though. You could have double the amount of players playing in the last two weeks and the concurrent players may not even change much, dependng on how long they play for each session.

Obvioulsy though, if concurrent players went down to 1, then there would only be a very small amount of players.

Look at it like this, if the average concurrent players in 24hr was 5000 players, the amount of people playing in that 24 hours could be anywhere between 5000 and 120,000 players (5000x24 for each hour). I know that the higher end is pretty unlikely as people generally play for more than 1 hour. obviously the lower the average is, the smaller the range of actual players in a day.

That is why it is pretty much useless trying to find out the active player base using concurrent players. You could maybe see a trend, that people are not playing as much as before, but that's about it. I also concur, that player numbers look perfectly fine at the moment. But obviously more the merrier.
 
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Reasons

Regardless of how the data is interpreted, if one assumes that say one to two thirds again are playing Elite via the elite launcher (like me, despite me having over 300 games on steam), those numbers feel fairly healthy to me.
 
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Good analysis OP,

I don't know why anyone bothers with the doom and gloom threads anyway. All games decline in popularity eventually, and so will ED.

One day, the shutdown of the servers will be announced and we will have to go our own separate ways, unless FD releases a way for hobbyists keeping it running. Even then, that will eventually end as well.

Until that announcement though, just keep playing if you want to play.

Regards

Meso
 
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Good analysis OP,

I don't know why anyone bothers with the doom and gloom threads anyway. All games decline in popularity eventually, and so will ED.

One day, the shutdown of the servers will be announced and we will have to go our own separate ways, unless FD releases a way for hobbyists keeping it running. Even then, that will eventually end as well.

Until that announcement though, just keep playing if you want to play.

Regards

Meso

Exactly, I don't think anyone cares except for the doom and gloom crowd. Doom threads are mildly amusing at best, Steam is a steaming pile off ........

From my own selfish point of view, whenever the devs decide to pull the plug, I hope they at least allow modding on the platform with an offline mode. So much potential with this platform, in the mean time I'll keep enjoying ED.
 
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You change values of two factors which contribute to the statistics. When one goes up the other goes down but sum/stats dont change.

This argument is misleading, because the assumption that average playing time is a constant is more reasonable. (just a statement, I don't have prove).

From steam stats you NEVER can estimate the REAL number of players which play E D, thats also true and trivial.

What you can say is: when steam stats/numbers decrease/increase the total number of players decrease/increase.

Necessary assumptions for this conclusion are:
1 the average playing time (over all players) is constant
2 nothing else changed which is not part of the stats (e.g. release of another platform, or mass exodus from steam to another gaming platform)
3 the base of numbers count didn't change (like some bug has been resolved which prevented russian players to be counted, just for example) (this is actually also in 2)

Thats typically all which is said here in the forum. The answers in those threads typically imply that the OP says something about the absolut numbers of players which they regularly did not.

But all this doesn't effect Forntier, they have to look at the sales numbers. Those are NOT so strongly correlated to the steam stats of concurrent players but would measure the death or life of the game for Fontier.
 
You change values of two factors which contribute to the statistics. When one goes up the other goes down but sum/stats dont change.

This argument is misleading, because the assumption that average playing time is a constant is more reasonable. (just a statement, I don't have prove).

From steam stats you NEVER can estimate the REAL number of players which play E D, thats also true and trivial.

What you can say is: when steam stats/numbers decrease/increase the total number of players decrease/increase.

Necessary assumptions for this conclusion are:
1 the average playing time (over all players) is constant
2 nothing else changed which is not part of the stats (e.g. release of another platform, or mass exodus from steam to another gaming platform)
3 the base of numbers count didn't change (like some bug has been resolved which prevented russian players to be counted, just for example) (this is actually also in 2)

Thats typically all which is said here in the forum. The answers in those threads typically imply that the OP says something about the absolut numbers of players which they regularly did not.

But all this doesn't effect Forntier, they have to look at the sales numbers. Those are NOT so strongly correlated to the steam stats of concurrent players but would measure the death or life of the game for Fontier.

Player numbers will be important to them. The reason being that they will want to sell the next expansion coming next year, so the more people playing the more will likely buy it and also the cosmetics.

I never understood why people go "they have your money and they don't need to do anything else know". Well that is a recipe for disaster for a games company, if they did that, then their reputation would be in the gutter and also nobody would spend on any DLC's.
 
Using steam is a perfectly valid method for evaluating a game's overall trajectory. Think of it like a poll or a survey. When trying to gauge the popularity of a brand or an idea, pollsters don't ask everyone on the planet. They ask a select group of a few hundred to a few thousand people. Statistically speaking a sample size of a thousand is enough to produce a meaningful result, depending on what you're trying ask. Here we have several thousand using steam and what looks to be a fairly stable but fluctuating population that currently only slightly smaller than when ED launched on steam in April 2015, which says to me that interest in the game is fairly healthy.
 
I never understood why people go "they have your money and they don't need to do anything else know". Well that is a recipe for disaster for a games company, if they did that, then their reputation would be in the gutter and also nobody would spend on any DLC's.

Yes, you are right. Frontier has surely a more nuanced view onto numbers.
 
Using steam is a perfectly valid method for evaluating a game's overall trajectory. Think of it like a poll or a survey. When trying to gauge the popularity of a brand or an idea, pollsters don't ask everyone on the planet. They ask a select group of a few hundred to a few thousand people. Statistically speaking a sample size of a thousand is enough to produce a meaningful result, depending on what you're trying ask. Here we have several thousand using steam and what looks to be a fairly stable but fluctuating population that currently only slightly smaller than when ED launched on steam in April 2015, which says to me that interest in the game is fairly healthy.

When you mean a few thousand that is at any one time, people that have played the game on steam is actually around the 80,000 mark in the last 2 weeks, which is the better stat to use.

But even that is far from perfect.
 
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Currently the 24h live stream for SpecialEffect also shows the general success of Frontier (with E D and PlanED BOster).

The total sum of raised money is quite good correlated with total number of satisfied customers :)
 
Elite dangerous came out in 2014 originally, and arrived on Steam in 2015.
Occulus Rift has people buy it from their own store, and there's people still buying direct from Frontier's store.
Far as I know, XBox and Playstation players have nothing to do with Steam.
And people like me who got it on Steam don't use Steam to launch it, because I don't want the thing running in the background.

So...wouldn't it be correct to say a sizable majority who play Elite don't register on Steam at all?
 
Using steam is a perfectly valid method for evaluating a game's overall trajectory. Think of it like a poll or a survey. When trying to gauge the popularity of a brand or an idea, pollsters don't ask everyone on the planet. They ask a select group of a few hundred to a few thousand people. Statistically speaking a sample size of a thousand is enough to produce a meaningful result, depending on what you're trying ask. Here we have several thousand using steam and what looks to be a fairly stable but fluctuating population that currently only slightly smaller than when ED launched on steam in April 2015, which says to me that interest in the game is fairly healthy.
I'm not disagreeing with your conclusion, but doesn't the sample have to be principled in that there is an attemt to make it representative of the broader population? That's the assumption underlying the repeated use of Steam stats.
 
Concurrent numbers are only really useful for a developer when trying to determine server loads, it means nothing when determining how many users are actively playing your product. Unique logins is the key factor there.
 
You change values of two factors which contribute to the statistics. When one goes up the other goes down but sum/stats dont change.

This argument is misleading, because the assumption that average playing time is a constant is more reasonable. (just a statement, I don't have prove).

From steam stats you NEVER can estimate the REAL number of players which play E D, thats also true and trivial.

What you can say is: when steam stats/numbers decrease/increase the total number of players decrease/increase.

Necessary assumptions for this conclusion are:
1 the average playing time (over all players) is constant
2 nothing else changed which is not part of the stats (e.g. release of another platform, or mass exodus from steam to another gaming platform)
3 the base of numbers count didn't change (like some bug has been resolved which prevented russian players to be counted, just for example) (this is actually also in 2)

Thats typically all which is said here in the forum. The answers in those threads typically imply that the OP says something about the absolut numbers of players which they regularly did not.

But all this doesn't effect Forntier, they have to look at the sales numbers. Those are NOT so strongly correlated to the steam stats of concurrent players but would measure the death or life of the game for Fontier.
Yes, good post ;)

The thing is, average play time per player did change from 15 to 24 hours in the last 2 weeks alone. Sadly the data for release isn't available anymore but it's clear that average play time isn't constant ;)

http://steamspy.com/app/359320
(click on audiende 2 weeks)
 
Regarding Steam vs the Frontier Store, back in early 2016 Steam represented about 45% of copies sold.
Since then the number of players on Steam has about doubled, but I seriously doubt the number of sales on the Frontier store for PC has. Steam is the dominant distribution platform on PC, and outside of the old timers from the previous games who got on board since before the Steam release, not too many people will have even heard of the Frontier store before buying Elite, and even fewer will care to buy through it or bother to play via the Frontier client when they can just play via Steam an let it download all the updates automatically and with better reliability than the Frontier launcher.

I think the Steamspy charts are more than good enough to not just spot trends, but also represent the majority of the PC playerbase as a whole.

Of course that's not taking into account the console release, but honestly I prefer not to think too hard I'm having to play a game that was designed with consoles in mind too.
 
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