Do you think we'll ever get new ships, or reworked ships?

[Sera Scratch]

I've been looking over my fleet recently and came across some old reddit poll that was made. The most popular ship by far seems to be the Python, then the Cutter. When I was looking over all the ships in the game, I couldn't help but think that there was a pretty big disparity between the "best" ships and everything else. For example the Python. It takes a medium sized pad and of all of the medium ships has the most cargo space/optional internal slots. The Type - 6, a ship basically built for trade, doesn't have (Literally) half the cargo space available. It also has amazing hardpoints with 3x large and 2x Medium. The jump range is also exceptional. In the same vein, the Cutter beats out the Type-9 in cargo (By 4t but still) while having 4 medium hardpoints, 2 large and one huge. and more utility mounts.All the Type-X ships are basically terrible. The Type-7 in particular shouldn't even be a large ship. The Beluga and Dolphin share these issues too, as do most of the Fed ships.

So my point being, is there is little point to use most ships in the game because the other options are just so much better. It doesn't feel like there is a choice to debate which ship you'd like to use. Conda/Python/Krait/Cutter/FDL/AspX and some others are the only options you'd ever consider using. Sure, you can use which ever you'd like as preference, but the simple fact is they're all unbalanced with clear winners and losers.

Personally, I'd like to see FDev work on giving the ships their identity back. New ships would be exciting but I feel like they'd fall into the same black and white model. Multi-role ships are nice but when a multi-role ship out classes a ship designed for the job it seems like a problem.

 

[Far Beyond Driven]

I don't think you will ever see a ship rework. New ships are always welcome, but if its a case of we have three guys in a broom closet working on Elite Dangerous what should be prioritized? New ships wouldn't be my choice.

 

[metatheurgist]

There was plenty of point to using those ships when you couldn't buy a Anaconda in 2 hours. Now you just go straight to the Anaconda.

 

[Far Beyond Driven]

There was plenty of point to using those ships when you couldn't buy a Anaconda in 2 hours. Now you just go straight to the Anaconda.

As frustrating as it was at the time my most cherished and rewarding moments in this game was the slow struggle through ship progression. I was in each ship for so long it almost formed a bond. They were all special and finally getting a new ship was a huge moment.

The credit inflation and replacement of progression by engineering mats took away from best part of the game, the ships and the progression through them.

 

[Sera Scratch]

The credit inflation and replacement of progression by engineering mats took away from best part of the game, the ships and the progression through them.

True, I suppose the ships weren't designed around the ships intention, but the credit limit. The Python costs 56 million, compared to the Type-6's measly 1mil price. But with credits being meaningless even a Corvette at 190 mil is nothing. I understand prices being the limiting factor for ships but it just doesn't work in the present day. Fleet Carriers are possible in a week or two. This is why I think we desperately need the ships reworked.

 

[metatheurgist]

As frustrating as it was at the time my most cherished and rewarding moments in this game was the slow struggle through ship progression. I was in each ship for so long it almost formed a bond. They were all special and finally getting a new ship was a huge moment.

The credit inflation and replacement of progression by engineering mats took away from best part of the game, the ships and the progression through them.

Frontier are very adept at gutting their own game.

 

[CMDR Karrde Sun]

Nope. There's too many ships because when the first came out, they were made when ship progression was actually a part of the game. Specifically, it took weeks or months to get to large ships, longer to get to the top 3 (the type 10 wasn't even in the game).

No i can see why they would.

The only thing i can think of is to increase specialisation even more to give everyone a real point again.

Something i do very, very often is try to come up with reasons why i should use not the best... there's got to be some niche. I even managed to love the type 7. But it doesn't work.

Sadly... actually i know what happened.. one of the side consequences of enginnering was creating a real gear check for combat. This basically invalided most multipurpose and all non combat ships from even defending yourself in habited space. Even though in practice you can get away with alot.. you never really want to use anything else but a krait or a cutter.

A bit sad. All my combat before horizons was in an asp... i really missed that before getting over it because there was nothing i could ever do about it.

So the point is, they could just delete engineering and suddenly 30-50% of the ships would be viable for much more.

 

[Kira Goto]

Mildly on side note territory related to the subject - kinda wish there were feasible alternatives to the Python when it came to something like say, throwing passengers onto your ship for evacs in the Thargoid war(for those times only outposts are available).

I tried to come up with a Phantom built to that end. Ended up ditching it in the idea phase because I couldn’t seem to really get anything close unless I stripped everything out and built a paper boat that would fall apart from a few scout hits(aka terrible idea).

Even jump range was similar/the same with a lower passenger count. Maybe it had a little more boost speed. I like the Python(new player me liked using it for core mining as I went about getting some of the bigger ships, like three years ago) but I’m also getting a little tired of the ship at this point. Yet it seems like the medium alternatives wouldn’t feel particularly great.

Side note to the side note… thinking of a ship build that uses G3 engineering instead of going all out G5 on everything. What form will it take? That’s a good question.

 

[Sera Scratch]

kinda wish there were feasible alternatives to the Python

That's kinda what drove me to making this thread. The python is so far and above literally every other medium ship. There is not a single reason to choose something besides the Python for Medium and Small. I understand one ship may edge out some others in combat/trade/mining/passangers/exploring, but the python does every one of those better than the rest of the ships. I still use some other ships for my purposes but I admit I do so knowing I"m handicapping myself on jump range and cargo space.

 

[Riverside]

Firstly I think that Reddit post the OP describes might be outdated, the Python does have a competitor now, the Krait MkII. The FDL has a competitor in the Mamba too, both better in some respects, not as good in others but they are valid alternatives. Similarly the AspX has competition in the Krait Phantom and DBX. Frankly for exploration or regular NPC combat there are loads of ships that are good enough, you don't have to have the best to get by.

The Cutter/T-9 and Python/T-7/T-6 are fair comment but again, if you play without the benefit of community knowledge you can discover for yourself what you want out of a ship and what each ships strengths & weaknesses are.

If you take in community advice & try to play in an optimised way, it makes sense that you will tend to use the 'best' ships (for any given criteria) and tend to skip the rest.

I think until you get to really top-end stuff the game is designed around Cmdrs in ships like the Cobra MkIII. You can do the whole game in a ship like that but won't necessarily realise that at first, until you have tried the others & seen their strengths & weaknesses.

I'd like to see more ships too, the game will always benefit from more variety no matter how much we already have but the original intention was to have 30 and we have 38 now IIRC, so I think the OP's complaint was already addressed by FDev & it's just been a while since that happened. It's been a while since a lot of the game was tweaked

 

[Ian Doncaster]

The Python's good - and was even better on its original release when the fed bricks didn't have their military slots (so the Python could out-tank them with HRPs/SCBs), some of its other competitors weren't implemented yet, and without power plant and distributor engineering its native size 7s gave it a lot of flexibility that other mediums didn't get.

I think it's more nowadays that the Python/Krait2/Krait Phantom are between them a bit overpowered.
- Python: best internal volume and hauling speed
- Kraits (both): higher jump range (especially the Phantom), permaboost with 2 pips, more agile, faster, same combat attack power
- Krait 2: SLF capability

It depends on what you're doing but I think the Krait II will outclass the Python on most non-hauling roles (while only being 64t behind as a hauler)

Of course, both Kraits are essentially re-skinned Pythons already - identical core internals, virtually the same hardpoints and optionals - so that's not really countering the point.

 

[Ydiss]

That's kinda what drove me to making this thread. The python is so far and above literally every other medium ship. There is not a single reason to choose something besides the Python for Medium and Small. I understand one ship may edge out some others in combat/trade/mining/passangers/exploring, but the python does every one of those better than the rest of the ships. I still use some other ships for my purposes but I admit I do so knowing I"m handicapping myself on jump range and cargo space.

I disagree with the Python being the only option as I ditched mine years ago for the krait II, which is objectively better unless you want cargo space as a primary focus.

Still doesn't invalidate your point though. It indeed would have been mostly justified initially by the concept of ship progression and that's what I used to always say when this discussion came up, back then. But the game stopped being about ship progression a long time ago and engineers definitely had a lot to do with that.

The python was a premium medium option that got heavily nerfed in the first year of release (it was a premium combat option too originally). It somewhat made sense back then. The cheaper medium ships (and even the flawed T7) were stepping stones.

Fast forward to now and you basically only have 4 or 5 "essential options" and they were mostly in the game at launch.

But we're not getting a ship rework before we get engineers entirely removed so... Never

 

[Nekozji]

Mildly on side note territory related to the subject - kinda wish there were feasible alternatives to the Python when it came to something like say, throwing passengers onto your ship for evacs in the Thargoid war(for those times only outposts are available).

I can't help but notice that a Clipper would fit on a medium pad if parked diagonally...

But yeah, on topic, I'd love to see more spaceships in this game about spaceships. Everyone wants a Panther, of course, but otherwise just add some stuff. New ship at every pad size every paid expansion is not a lot to ask. Try things like a small ship where with a couple of size 3 slots, no 2s, and extra size 1s and see what people do with it. They don't even have to be unique in terms of internals, they just have to be visually different and collectible.

 

[zimms]

I'm not holding my breath. Seems like Frontier have all but moved on from Elite. At this point, they can't justify putting all those man hours into the game it would need imho.

 

[Felix DiCestria]

I prefer the T9 to the Cutter and I certainly wouldn't go through the rank grind for my Alts.

SLFs produced the last bout of ship designs so I was expecting Odyssey to have a similar effect.

 

[Crimson Kaim]

Doubt it. The next big point of the agenda is core gameplay improvements (which I highly look forward to) so that basically excludes new ships.
At the bare minimum, I can only imagine variants of ships similar to the dropship family. Corvette MK II anyone?

 

[Sera Scratch]

Fast forward to now and you basically only have 4 or 5 "essential options" and they were mostly in the game at launch.

Exactly. There's a handful of "good" ships to use. Using anything else is a handicap. There was a thread on here that mentioned something like 7 viable ships for AX in the Storm because of the lacking optinal slots. The game is a bit stale with the same ships being a "must." For example, you can't realistically compete in CG's unless you're using a python, simply because of the cargo and ability to land at outposts.

 

[TheRoninX]

Take a look at the fact the Anaconda is the only ship with an actual damage model and that should answer your reworked question. As for new ships doubtful.

 

[Ian Doncaster]

For example, you can't realistically compete in CG's unless you're using a python, simply because of the cargo and ability to land at outposts.

Cutter has over twice the cargo and almost as much jump range, and most travel time is in-system rather than hyperspace, so you'd have to have the large pads cleared out to quite some distance before the Python was better. I'd be surprised if many people in the top 10 used a Python; below that all of the large ships are pretty viable as well anyway.

If you have a carrier then the jump range doesn't matter - load it up from a large pad station safely away from CG, even if you can't get in-system you can certainly park the carrier one jump away and have private large pad access. (If you're really aiming for top 10, you need a pair of carriers: your colleagues load one while you unload the other - and definitely a Python won't work for that)

 

[Element Priest]

I've been looking over my fleet recently and came across some old reddit poll that was made. The most popular ship by far seems to be the Python, then the Cutter. When I was looking over all the ships in the game, I couldn't help but think that there was a pretty big disparity between the "best" ships and everything else. For example the Python. It takes a medium sized pad and of all of the medium ships has the most cargo space/optional internal slots. The Type - 6, a ship basically built for trade, doesn't have (Literally) half the cargo space available. It also has amazing hardpoints with 3x large and 2x Medium. The jump range is also exceptional. In the same vein, the Cutter beats out the Type-9 in cargo (By 4t but still) while having 4 medium hardpoints, 2 large and one huge. and more utility mounts.All the Type-X ships are basically terrible. The Type-7 in particular shouldn't even be a large ship. The Beluga and Dolphin share these issues too, as do most of the Fed ships.

So my point being, is there is little point to use most ships in the game because the other options are just so much better. It doesn't feel like there is a choice to debate which ship you'd like to use. Conda/Python/Krait/Cutter/FDL/AspX and some others are the only options you'd ever consider using. Sure, you can use which ever you'd like as preference, but the simple fact is they're all unbalanced with clear winners and losers.

Personally, I'd like to see FDev work on giving the ships their identity back. New ships would be exciting but I feel like they'd fall into the same black and white model. Multi-role ships are nice but when a multi-role ship out classes a ship designed for the job it seems like a problem.

That's what happens when you make the choice to learn to play by watching youtube instead of learning it yourself. Happens with every game.