Why most of the people are always comparing these 2 games while talking about future devoloping, new features, marketing strategy, and such? They are different, they are not comparable. so all those eve/ed arguments i can read pretty everywhere are atleast pointless, maybe stupid (imo really stupid).
ED is not EVE. They are different type of games, dot
- Thread starter Resentina
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Ford is not Dodge either...
The same reason you made this thread, because they can.
There are comparisons to be drawn from how both were bare-frames on launch and the subsequent roll out of improvements over months and years.
There is also a comparison to be made regarding their customer service and launch issues as both are multiplayer online platforms.
The game play and mechanics may be different but a lot of the practical side is similar.
There are comparisons to be drawn from how both were bare-frames on launch and the subsequent roll out of improvements over months and years.
There is also a comparison to be made regarding their customer service and launch issues as both are multiplayer online platforms.
The game play and mechanics may be different but a lot of the practical side is similar.
They are extremely comparable, and it's certainly not pointless nor stupid to compare the two. EVE is one of the most successful MMO's of all time, chock-full of brilliant ideas and gameplay systems, and the only reason it isn't MORE successful is the terribly boring control system and combat, and massive mechanical learning curve.
ED could benefit greatly by taking a close look at some EVE systems. And there's nothing wrong with saying that.
ED could benefit greatly by taking a close look at some EVE systems. And there's nothing wrong with saying that.
'duh' is too short a reply. 
They're two different games but EVE is out in the market from so much time that lot of the changes that were done there could be done here in a positive way.
The real problem are the guys wich want too much, in one way or the other, not in the games itself.
Too much EVE into Elite and it becomes ugly.
BUT
Completely avoiding any feature of EVE just because it belongs to another game is plain stupid.
AND
Lot of guys were not able to succed or succeded too much there so they became haters/lovers of the EVE brand.
I think the debate comes more from passion than rationality.
The real problem are the guys wich want too much, in one way or the other, not in the games itself.
Too much EVE into Elite and it becomes ugly.
BUT
Completely avoiding any feature of EVE just because it belongs to another game is plain stupid.
AND
Lot of guys were not able to succed or succeded too much there so they became haters/lovers of the EVE brand.
I think the debate comes more from passion than rationality.
well its quite simple as we had before, a post explaining how Eve is Elite just taken to the next logical step, back in the 1980s what you got with elite was nothing more than a clever use of data compression from what i've read, now that isn't a problem, we aren't limited by what the computer can do or how much space is on a floppy disk.
Eve has had YEARS to mull over the aspects of a space sim/sandbox and incorporate features into its core that improves on what you can do lets just say this again YEARS and years and years of time to plan and create features that makes sense in such a world.
what it comes down to is, this game did it X many years ago, why hasn't the new game hinting at the same premise, not doing so?
if your happy playing elite as it was in 1984 thats great more power to you, although just because you are happy with watching paint dry that doesn't mean everyone else has the same standards.
so comparisons are made, personally i like to compare elite to X3 because to me that is the game its more akin to. except when i do, i see a polar opposite, X3 has a small world with tons of depth and elite and a large world with very little depth. X3 felt like a space sim to me, stations has limited supplies of everything, things were created over time, you could spend months trying to earn enough creds to buy your first station, when you did, you bought a trader and setup a route for it, then you added to your assets. eventually hitting the player HQ and collecting ships to break down so you could build your own, all taking tons of effort and time to do, i found fitting one ship in X3 with the weapons you wanted could take hours flying from system to system docking in every equipment dock trying to find another hept or whatever, it just had things that made you feel like it was going somewhere, even though in the end it becomes basically a never ending battle vs unlimited ai's everything upto that realization is fun. in the end i just had fun trying to crash my pc with X3 jumping loads of capitals into khaak sectors and watching the frame rate drop to 5 or so. lasers everywhere. or building frame destroying complexes where you have to aim the camera in a certain direction when you go into a system so your pc doesn't choke.
Eve has had YEARS to mull over the aspects of a space sim/sandbox and incorporate features into its core that improves on what you can do lets just say this again YEARS and years and years of time to plan and create features that makes sense in such a world.
what it comes down to is, this game did it X many years ago, why hasn't the new game hinting at the same premise, not doing so?
if your happy playing elite as it was in 1984 thats great more power to you, although just because you are happy with watching paint dry that doesn't mean everyone else has the same standards.
so comparisons are made, personally i like to compare elite to X3 because to me that is the game its more akin to. except when i do, i see a polar opposite, X3 has a small world with tons of depth and elite and a large world with very little depth. X3 felt like a space sim to me, stations has limited supplies of everything, things were created over time, you could spend months trying to earn enough creds to buy your first station, when you did, you bought a trader and setup a route for it, then you added to your assets. eventually hitting the player HQ and collecting ships to break down so you could build your own, all taking tons of effort and time to do, i found fitting one ship in X3 with the weapons you wanted could take hours flying from system to system docking in every equipment dock trying to find another hept or whatever, it just had things that made you feel like it was going somewhere, even though in the end it becomes basically a never ending battle vs unlimited ai's everything upto that realization is fun. in the end i just had fun trying to crash my pc with X3 jumping loads of capitals into khaak sectors and watching the frame rate drop to 5 or so. lasers everywhere. or building frame destroying complexes where you have to aim the camera in a certain direction when you go into a system so your pc doesn't choke.
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Every time I see someone say "don't turn the game into eve" when discussing basic features, I wonder if they ate paint chips as a child.
It still useless
over months and years? launch date 16th december. rofl. if there are similarities on the early developing it doesn't means that it follows the same path ov eve in the future.
So what? and the same about thousands other videogames, but maybe you didn't never playied, so tested them.
may be??!!?? rofl.
a lot??!!?? rofl.
So... as i wrote on the first post... all these arguments are useless.. pointeless... you demostrated it clearly
Meh, they aren't arguments, they're observations. You are the only one attempting to argue.
They are fundamentally different games, yes. But you'd have to be, I dunno, 8 years old to not grasp the concept that *some* of the systems in EVE are extraordinary and would work extremely well in ED. I have zero doubt this will happen in the future because, as much as I disapprove of the launch state of ED, I think Frontier has a lot of clever people in it. And clever people aren't afraid to borrow good systems from other games.
I do think that one major consideration has to be made in the sense that EVE is designed entirely around the concept of player cooperation, on a massive scale. Literally, the game does not function without it. ED requires zero cooperation for a pilot to be successful. Which personally I find to be a huge bummer but hey, that's the game they wanted to design.
They are fundamentally different games, yes. But you'd have to be, I dunno, 8 years old to not grasp the concept that *some* of the systems in EVE are extraordinary and would work extremely well in ED. I have zero doubt this will happen in the future because, as much as I disapprove of the launch state of ED, I think Frontier has a lot of clever people in it. And clever people aren't afraid to borrow good systems from other games.
I do think that one major consideration has to be made in the sense that EVE is designed entirely around the concept of player cooperation, on a massive scale. Literally, the game does not function without it. ED requires zero cooperation for a pilot to be successful. Which personally I find to be a huge bummer but hey, that's the game they wanted to design.
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Ofc comparison are made, and as you agree, comparing ED to X3, you can't compare two things of different genre. I am not saying you shouldn't compare ED with everything else. I mostly agree with you with ED/X3 things. But it's different.
Comparing ED to EVE is illogical, is like comparing a lawn tractor to a go kart, a motor parglider. completley different things maded for completly different activity.
maybe most of the player are not looking at ED like ED+EVE but looking just for ED and Braben vision. I don't know the Braben vision, ofc, but i have zero doubt FD isn't afraid to borrow good systems by other games, only if it fits to the Braben vision.
I'm not saying the game is perfect now. I am saying i am not looking at EVE as the future of ED, because it is illogical. And because EVE may looks as a nice game it doesn't mean ED should follow EVE mechanics.
I think what it mostly comes down to is they will have a hard time incorperating any new features without it in some way resembling something you can do in Eve, thats the point on one hand you have ppl that are entirely happy with how the game is now, ppl have been equally open about that as have the ppl whining about it not meeting expectations. except you can't please both crowds, and you can't pull players from other games if you have a game that doesn't exactly innovate on what they already play. yes they are different games, in various ways, but they are both set in space, so they both look at the same aspects of space to see how you could interact in space with objects / players / ai's in the end they have had plenty of time to see what fits the style of the game and what doesn't. so when Fdev get around to layering the game with depth then ppl are going to be saying 'well that feature is in eve, omg ED is becoming eve .. sky=falling etc'
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Completely agree.
I Played EVE from day one and you were limited in the things you could do if you didn't have contacts or have contact with other players so FD should look at and probably are, at implementing more interaction between players. Overall EVE has evolved to be a really IMPRESSIVE game that CCP created that was far ahead of its time and FD could do worse by looking at some of the things it has done.
All good companies/people use others ideas or systems and expand on them sometimes for better and sometimes for worse and that will continue if you or me like it or not. If they don't and stick to their idea I will still play the game as I'm personally having a blast but understand why some people would like to see some functions from EVE be adopted by Elite.
I played EVE for a long time, but like many these days I just enjoy watching it from the sidelines at this point. The fact that the player-driven, emergent political and economical landscape of that game is rich enough to *actually watch as a non-player* is a testament to the game's achievements. That game only gives you what you put in, and I consider it a point in ED's favor that I can get enjoyment out of it at the drop of a hat, rather than have to treat it like a fulltime job (I kid you not, I actually took college-level math and economics courses to prepare for my IPO in Eve Online. Never once needed that kind of math for real life).
I don't think the games are as as different as the OP is suggesting, to boot. Outside of my previously mentioned difference in levels of player interaction, the only other MAJOR difference I'm seeing is the basic control methods. Boiling it down to simple terms, EVE is an over-the-shoulder point-and-click game while ED is a first-person shooter. Other than those two major principles the basic concepts of the game are, in my mind, fairly similar.
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I have never played Eve, but do agree with your assessment. This game, once multiplayer is enhanced, could very much be like Eve. There will be player backed systems, that will have a lot of personal investment in them, that could be affected by other players. The impetus behind this will be how invested players become to local and galaxy wide factions, and how rewarding these affiliations will be. This will provide engaging conflict between players, IF the player investment becomes strong (think DAOC RvR strong).
Which is understandable seeing as Eve have said previously that it was influenced by Elite and Frontier
I don't see possible issue with either game existing. People like different things.
At present Elite Dangerous is not even a month past launch. Eve has been evolving for over 10 years.
I really don't see how you can compare the two game apart from they are based in space.
Eve has it good point and people wouldn't play it if they didn't enjoy it so I won't know it.
But then again ED has a lot of developing to do and will do.
I love this game and really get a lot out of it but I admit it will need further updates, development and further content.
but it will get there so please all be patient.
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Ofc yes, i am not saying that you have not to improve your product. But I hope FD are not looking at EVE gameplay at all. I don't want to be forced to only cooperate. Corporation life is funny, is really incredible about socializing, doing things together, but sometimes, often in the last period, is stressing. sometimes is frustrating you only need cooperation to proceed. For Example: on EVE I need corp help to do high end 1on1 pvp, because i need assets. ofc i want pvp on ED, but maybe not that much corp dependent.
Another general example: i want an improved resourcees collecting (mining, trading etch)/economic system/logistics, but i am not looking at FD to achive that using EVE mechanics.
Because the genre is so different
Maybe i would look at X world. Much more close genre.
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