EGP

Insane4un

I
While i am in reserve of EGP pilots (burnout after 5 years is strong in this one). I can still say that it is completely forbidden to use anything "soft like scam" that can help to achieve success in the "born dead" but still smh powerplay. Why? So no one can use anything that can backfire at EGP with the idea that EGP achivements could possibly done by whatever scam we have today. In fact it was even more than that. EGP all this time completely ignored anything that was suspicious or strange in some way, but keep doing their job no matter what was against them, cheats (not confirmed), bots(not confirmed), bugs (it's a FDev game ya know..) and whatever else. I always love such a view on this. The fact that they rarely talk to others. Rarely even join forum till it's really important. Sadly, the game killed me after all. But it always was and still is the reason why i even joined them in the past. EGP deserve this 1 place in powerplay o7.

You must be interested how EGP actually done it?

Dedication, Idea, Commitment, Very good (actually best i've seen so far) management of community. Also Yuri Grom.

Obviously that will not last for long.. the burnout is real in this game.. everyone have their limit. Or FD will kill it with fire, eventually.
 
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Misaniovent

Misaniovent
Insane4un said:
While i am in reserve of EGP pilots (burnout after 5 years is strong in this one). I can still say that it is completely forbidden to use anything "soft like scam" that can help to achieve success in the "born dead" but still smh powerplay. Why? So no one can use anything that can backfire at EGP with the idea that EGP achivements could possibly done by whatever scam we have today. In fact it was even more than that. EGP all this time completely ignored anything that was suspicious or strange in some way, but keep doing their job no matter what was against them, cheats (not confirmed), bots(not confirmed), bugs (it's a FDev game ya know..) and whatever else. I always love such a view on this. The fact that they rarely poopootalk to others. Rarely even join forum till it's really important. Sadly, the game killed me after all. But it always was and still is the reason why i even joined them in the past. EGP deserve this 1 place in powerplay o7.

You must be interested how EGP actually done it?

Dedication, Idea, Commitment, Very good (actually best i've seen so far) management of community. Also Yuri Grom.

Obviously that will not last for long.. the burnout is real in this game.. everyone have their limit. Or FD will kill it with fire, eventually.
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I believe you. It's been an honor to fly with and work with your pilots. You will be missed in the Empire — long live ZYADA.
 
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Valyn Arvis

Valyn Arvis
I have to add to Xanders post.
You have really become overly salty these last months Brantford, whining about how Valentine was only achieved through 5c, telling everybody the Empire has no internal sabotage at all and thus must be controlling it. [Edit: That got a bit to personal and was unfitting. Apologies] I might remind you that ALD is still cleaning up the mess the fed-sanctionned 5c-operation "Burn it down" created years ago and that AD has to haul hundreds of thousands of merits to topple unwanted preps, cause the numbers hauled by their internal sabotage are much higher. After years of focusing on the Empire and independent powers saboteurs finally started to attack the federation too. You should rather be happy that it took them so long until they went after you, folks. Winters has had a phenomenal control about what happens inside their power. Other powers couldn't even dream of that.

Additionally I know exactly that if for example ALD would be in a similar situation under attack by FUC we would get our loss makers forted by 5c too. Simply because whoever is at its origin seems to want to see it all burn. Or because randoms are trying to help and out of lazyness fortify only the spheres close to HQ. Probably a mix of both.

5c is not orchestrated by the Empire, even though it might be hard for these words to pass the fog of delusion that was built up over the years.
 
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XanderVekk

X
Andalyn said:
Valyn - Brantford knows that.... but it doesn't work as propaganda unless he sells it that way. :D
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Brantford isn't wrong about 5C happening a lot lately in Winters, and it's been a lot more organized for some reason. It's not propaganda. It's not Winters "mis-managing" anything.

What we are seeing is huge, organized effort by someone clearly hostile, and who badly out-numbers our small power. That doesn't leave a whole lot of candidates, if you get my drift.

We're dealing with vote sniping, followed by a full blanket fort (which NONE of us worked on, there are really THAT many crappy human beings working on this, because we have never been blanket forted before even when we DID work on it), then followed by three of the worst expansions I've ever seen.
 
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XanderVekk

X
Valyn Arvis said:
I have to add to Xanders post.
You have really become overly salty these last months Brantford, whining about how Valentine was only achieved through 5c, telling everybody the Empire has no internal sabotage at all and thus must be controlling it. I might remind you that ALD is still cleaning up the mess the fed-sanctionned 5c-operation "Burn it down" created years ago and that AD has to haul hundreds of thousands of merits to topple unwanted preps, cause the numbers hauled by their internal sabotage are much higher. After years of focusing on the Empire and independent powers saboteurs finally started to attack the federation too. You should rather be happy that it took them so long until they went after you, folks. Winters has had a phenomenal control about what happens inside their power. Other powers couldn't even dream of that.

Additionally I know exactly that if for example ALD would be in a similar situation under attack by FUC we would get our loss makers forted by 5c too. Simply because whoever is at its origin seems to want to see it all burn. Or because randoms are trying to help and out of lazyness fortify only the spheres close to HQ. Probably a mix of both.

5c is not orchestrated by the Empire, even though it might be hard for these words to pass the fog of delusion that was built up over the years.
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"Burn it down" was perpetrated years ago by people who left Winters, never returned, and most of them quit the game.

We need to get past that. We are not doing it. It's not Winters. Winters doesn't have the manpower to pull anything like that off.

Grom is gone.

Most of the hobos quit.

Can we all please play fair now, and in open?
 

Sethiest

Sethiest
Can someone explain briefly to an outsider of PP (I module shopped, didnt commit past that) as to whats going on here. I'm trying to read this thread and understand whats the deal.

So Yuri was a power created by the players not FDev? They used bots to win PP? Or Cheated? Original Yuri players are saying, "we're not bothering anymore"?

I am confusion.

Also what is 5C mean?
 
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XanderVekk

X
Sethiest said:
Can someone explain briefly to an outsider of PP (I module shopped, didnt commit past that) as to whats going on here. I'm trying to read this thread and understand whats the deal.

So Yuri was a power created by the players not FDev? They used bots to win PP? Or Cheated? Original Yuri players are saying, "we're not bothering anymore"?

I am confusion.

Also what is 5C mean?
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Yuri Grom was a power added by FDEV awhile back after an in-game event. The primary PLAYER supporters of that power (EGP) have decided to move on and do better things with their lives. Congrats on that, and best of luck.

5C is short for "fifth column", which means someone pledging to your power with the intent to do it deliberate harm. You can sabotage votes, prepare really bad expansions, and fortify horrible unprofitable systems. FDEV designed the PowerPlay game so that this is pretty much the only way to make any progress. Nobody likes it, because it's hard to stop and widely considered to be dishonorable. But it keeps happening to the same powers over and over for some reason.

As for whether the allegations of botting and 5C are true or not, who knows? Who cares? EGP is gone now, and its really not polite or relevant to the discussion.

I hope that helps your understanding.
 

Zaydin

Zaydin
So seems like the gist of what I've been able to grasp is that Grom supporters cheated their way to the top. If that's the case then I doubt anyone will cry to see them gone.
 

Starman 1966

S
It's not necessarily cheating by using bots or whatever what p**ses people most. PP is a war of attrition as the whole game is, e.g. farming engineering mats. Bots could make life easier but that's about it.

The real evil are 5C activities such as preparing and expanding terrible loss making systems or counteracting well planned system scraps by forting each and every system. FD has put those rubbish mechanics into the game and large parts of ZYADA have used them and will keep using them to fully extent. Of course their much larger player base compared to the Federal and independent powers comes in handy here.

The current Zorval scrap operation succeeded because it was both properly planned and the Federal powers don't use 5C activities. Doing 5C by an individual Fed CMDR would lead to his removal from the Federal discord etc. FD should rework PP mostly for taking 5C out of the game, which wouldn't be too difficult. Wait and see...
 

Screemonster

Screemonster
XanderVekk said:
5C is short for "fifth column", which means someone pledging to your power with the intent to do it deliberate harm. You can sabotage votes, prepare really bad expansions, and fortify horrible unprofitable systems. FDEV designed the PowerPlay game so that this is pretty much the only way to make any progress. Nobody likes it, because it's hard to stop and widely considered to be dishonorable. But it keeps happening to the same powers over and over for some reason.
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Which made me honestly baffled why they allowed such an obvious way to harm your own power in there. I can see them making certain actions less useful than others so that doing them is a waste of your time that'd be better spent elsewhere, that's perfectly fine. But actively harmful, more so than your opponents attacking directly? Nah. That's awful design.

Personally if it were me I'd make systems "useless" at worst, all other things considered. If some numpty fifth column group pushes an expansion into a bad system all you have to do is ignore it - much like a lot of BGS groups are doing with their uncontrolled expansions since 3.3 dropped and they don't have to worry about getting impeded by random conflicts in some backwater they don't care about. Let the 5th columns waste their time fortifying them, they literally do nothing.
Now, if those systems are undermined, let them be the first on the chopping block for the powers to lose. Worst thing that can happen from expanding somewhere useless is that it's easy to take it from you, which you don't care about anyway. Simples.
 

cmdr Ramius007

C
5c and a lot of other things in elite while completely unbalanced is fail save mechanic, without 5c under current PP system, it would be eternal stalemate at some point, but what I completely don't understand is giving 4 factions to empire at start of the game, it's hard to find explanation for this and is one of the reason why 5c is so OP, feds just not have enough numbers to counter it(module shoppers not help) and reward/afford+skill ratio skyrocket with it.
 

tiddymun

T
Personally I feel it is a shame that EG Pilots are withdrawing from PowerPlay - they are the only player group to earn the privilege of a power of their own, while all other Power communities built by the random assimilation of people to their Power's discord/slack. EG Pilots, therefore have much more attachment - and their notice of withdrawal is therefore much more powerful.... FDEV please notice! 5C mechanics are OP, and too difficult to oppose, even for such a large and well organised group as EG Pilots. All other Powers have also suffered, or are currently suffering from 5C tactics.

Anyway - EG Pilots, its been fun being your enemy for the past 3 years, and as I found out last night, you are still hostile to us :) . I just hope the Yuri Grom Power isn't just turned into another weaponised tool for the Imperials like Torval has been.... who am I kidding... Of course it will be used in that way. I'm sure that within 3 months Hudson will have been reduced to 35 terrible systems they can never lose. Wont matter - Hudsons community will still be there, and play hard and fair. Fact is PowerPlay is so broken currently that SuperPowers with a "win" agenda have to resort to all sorts of tactics to get that win. Simply putting in 1M undermining merits doesn't work on its own anymore. Especially seeing as all but 4 Powers now have a +ve CC start balance.. FDEV - take notice and pay PowerPlay some love. It should be dynamic, with systems being lost and won regularly - with Merits counting for your own power being far more effective than 5C merits against your enemy, and it being possible to "prize" systems from other Powers more easily - It is a Territory game, but unlike BGS, where it is reasonably easy to moving into a system and take control, in PowerPlay now, it is nigh on impossible to... as in many many thousands of CMDR hours week on week, and even then, it may not be possible. Clearly some changes have to be made to enable a more exciting galaxy for the players.

To whoever is doing the 5C... you are making a point. Make an anonymous video, statement or whatever, and tell us the reason at least.. even if it is "just for lols", "I'm bitter for losing the Dangerous games", "cos we are anarchists" or whatever... Do an interview with Sag Eye. I don't know. But you have driven too many players from PowerPlay IMO - and that's a shame. The more folks who leave the game, the less it will be updated, and everyone left loses out. Guess you win.
 
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