Elite Dangerous has sold 3m copies, Horizons 1.3m (43% of basegame owners)

[orfeboy]

That this game was wholly complete in 2014 is ludicrously dishonest.

None of what Braben sold us was present then. (And most of it still is not).

If it was complete, why sell a lifetime pass (that they have since failed to deliver on) for upcoming content?

This game has never been completed. Not based on what was sold. Not based on what was promised.

THe game was 'complete' in the sense that the level of development coupled with the same schedule for completion had come to an end. the game was deemed fit for release ie. not Alpha or Beta phases. FDEV considered they had delivered on the product they had promised and said as much at the time. If there was any dishonesty in that then the dishonesty lies with them for saying as much. I don't believe they were dishonest in their intentions but the game was very much broken upon release and did not even have many of the key features functioning.

Further development was broken into two teams on a different completion schedule, one of which was working on Horizons while the other continued to de-bug and get basic features like the communicator working. Horizons was paid content and had it's own release schedule. The features we have seen for the last 4 years of development hardly compare to the amount of work put into launching the original game within it's time constraints. Horizons is a separate product and it is also considered complete and delivered upon.

 

[Blackcompany]

THe game was 'complete' in the sense that the level of development coupled with the same schedule for completion had come to an end. the game was deemed fit for release ie. not Alpha or Beta phases. FDEV considered they had delivered on the product they had promised and said as much at the time. If there was any dishonesty in that then the dishonesty lies with them for saying as much. I don't believe they were dishonest in their intentions but the game was very much broken upon release and did not even have many of the key features functioning.

I definitely agree with you here. To this day, the game lacks many of the things Braben used to sell it. And we are five years in, or near enough.

 

[StuartGT]

And we are five years in, or near enough.

Elite Dangerous was released on 16th December 2014 - 4 years and 1 month ago.

 

[Stigbob]

That this game was wholly complete in 2014 is ludicrously dishonest.

None of what Braben sold us was present then. (And most of it still is not).

If it was complete, why sell a lifetime pass (that they have since failed to deliver on) for upcoming content?

This game has never been completed. Not based on what was sold. Not based on what was promised.

Cobblers. They said they were making an updated version of elite with some extra MMO bells and whistles and releasing it with a view to adding and expanding as time went on and as circumstances and money allowed. They've done precisely that and there's more on the way.

Some peoples entirely imaginary notions of what ED would be didn't get delivered, but who cares about that. People should research before buying instead of whining afterwards.

 

[SpacialKatana]

Does it make you feel better to know 100% of Horizons owners also purchased the base game?

Ahhh, the lesser spotted 'spin doctor' #vomit

Mass Effect Andromeda sold over 2 million copies its first week of release.

That said, I do not own MEA, and I'm a big fan of ME2 and ME3. If you didn't know (ha), I don't like buggy games.

I couldn't easily find the numbers for No Man's Sky, and being a console gamer, I'm personally not interested in Eve or X4, though their sales numbers might also help put the OP into perspective.

X4 is absolute garbage, that's all you need to know.

 

[NeilF]

Define 'significant technical addition' to mean what you want it to mean and the answer is 'yes'.

IMHO, the last significant technical addition to the game was planetary landings. Not until multi-crew did I feel any other addition was much of a significant development, and multi-crew due to the fact we'd had years of mediocre self contained developments, had almost no mechanics to leverage of any depth to make it worthwhile. And that still remains mainly true to this day IMHO.

The next significant technical addition for me was the recent update, with the new exploration and mining additions. But for me, it only just qualifies.

Other people may weigh up things differently... But ultimately, if you take a look at planetary landings, and the scale and scope of what that introduces, what since then has matched it?

The 'go ahead' was to leave pre-production and move to full production. It didn't mean they just decided to start 4.0.

If we look at the past 3 years, does it feel like FD have had a significant development team forging ahead with new content year(s) ahead, to ensure significant new developments and content and additions are done? Or does it feel more like small self contained developments have been done almost hand to mouth?

Does the fact even the contents of 3.3 was reduced just a few months before its release, does that make you feel a huge group of people had been beavering away at it?

And given all of this, and the rather shallow history of additional gameplay content (typically art heavy and gameplay light), do you believe the announcement of this next significant development is the movement into full production of something that had significant resources ploughing away at it for significant time? Or maybe just proof of concepts have been done, designs, and now its all greenlit.

Who knows... Maybe 50 people have been working on planetary landings already for two years! BUT, it doesn't feel like that given the past three...

Opinions may vary, and I can only give you mine, based on the perceived quality and scale of development over the past X years.

 

[Ian Skippy]

Not sure if it has been posted: https://www.dsogaming.com/news/jura...n-copies-elite-dangerous-surpasses-3-million/

Both PC and JWE sold 2 million copies, ED base game 3 million and ED:H 1.3. That means 8.3 million sales in total, with JWE reaching 2 million sales within the first six months. Financially, FD is doing great. Now lets see what they've been cooking up.

Oh, and more info about the future of ED in the coming months, according to DB.

 

[NeilF]

Not sure if it has been posted: https://www.dsogaming.com/news/jura...n-copies-elite-dangerous-surpasses-3-million/

Both PC and JWE sold 2 million copies, ED base game 3 million and ED:H 1.3. That means 8.3 million sales in total, with JWE reaching 2 million sales within the first six months. Financially, FD is doing great. Now lets see what they've been cooking up.

Oh, and more info about the future of ED in the coming months, according to DB.

Can but hope financial stability and some long term belief/confidence = big development(s) for ED finally...

 

[VR Golgot]

Well no, if it doesn't give you any tangible advantage then it's not.

How does two pips per ship (potentially, if you have 2 crew) not give you an advantage? Are you seriously arguing this?

(And if so, why? Especially given your premise is that Horizons is more P2W than you'd like )

They can improve the proc-gen itself and they have introduced hand made places like the Guardian Ruins and some thargoid bases.

Yes we can discuss none P2W things they can add until the cows come home. But it's conveniently avoiding the reasons for the P2W aspects existing, as discussed above.

Again: If you think it's such a pragmatic and reasonable approach, then surely there'll be a track record of others doing it. How about proffering some examples from comparable games?

Rather than just listing things that are not P2W...

BTW, there are even less insidous bussiness models like subscriptions and in this particular case, the sale of both Horizons and ED as a single entity.

Can you clarify what you mean with the latter bit? You think they should have bundled the core game into Horizons?

I have Horizons since I have ED and for the record, I never expect to be listened by FD, I honestly doubt they do so with 99.9% of complains and suggestions, the only time I've seen FD implement a suggested feature/change was the names of the new sectors in 3.3

The only time? Could you be any more pouty?

There's clearly been a ton more examples of player input. From the infamous player influence on Supercruise and transit distances within systems, to the neutron highway, there's plenty of gameplay mechanics that the community have influenced or suggested, which FDev took on board. (And that's without adding the ton of other more minor responses with most patches, such as reacting to complaints about the new mining mechanics primarily leading to duff commodities etc etc).

So yeah of course they can take or leave input. But to say you've only ever seen them adopt one community suggestion sounds pretty histrionic

(PS it probably helps if the suggestion is kinda pragmatic too )

 

[VR Golgot]

Ooooooooooh, very good

I don't follow a lot of the minutia regarding this topic, so this next question may also have been "stated a number of times", forgive me if that's the case. This team of 100+, that's relatively recent, correct? In other words, didn't Frontier hire on a bunch of new personnel just this last year to reach that 100+ number?

Some bonus stuff for you Ducky. Make of it what you will


24 May 2017

Translation: we will transfer 80% of our guys to a different game, but the rest will work to improve a core gameplay after 2.4.

This isn't the case at all. The Elite team is just as big (if not bigger) than it ever has been. Please don't read things in to our statements that aren't intended to be there. If that were the case we'd communicate that to you. This post is meant to say 'there's still so much going on with Elite and we're committed to making an awesome experience taking into account all of the feedback that we see on a day to day basis on the forums.

---

28 June 2018

Yes, it is amazing, it's gone well. This has been its best year both in terms of players, and also in terms of how well it's doing for us, because these things aren't about money but we can spend more on development. There are a lot of dedicated people that just making it better and better, and we've got some exciting things to come - not just talking Beyond. We're in a really good place to be.

---

July 2018

What happened is we’ve become more visible, we’ve taken on around 50 people a year for the last few years, and that’s been really good for us. We’re in the new office which is really nice.

What it’s meant is we’ve continued to support and nurture the existing franchises. Elite Dangerous has continued to grow, the team size is actually getting bigger.

From a staff point of view as well it’s also really good too because people who have been on Elite for five or six years now might want to change and we can offer that change inside the studio. And what’s good for Elite is it brings in a lot of fresh blood and fresh ideas, which is always good for a game. It keeps it alive and keeps it positive.

 

[Shinji Ikari]

How does two pips per ship (potentially, if you have 2 crew) not give you an advantage? Are you seriously arguing this?

(And if so, why? Especially given your premise is that Horizons is more P2W than you'd like )

I'm talking about the other things I listed, BTW, if you use another person in your ship to combat a lone ship it's 2V1 so there'll always be an advantage.

Yes we can discuss none P2W things they can add until the cows come home. But it's conveniently avoiding the reasons for the P2W aspects existing, as discussed above.

Again: If you think it's such a pragmatic and reasonable approach, then surely there'll be a track record of others doing it. How about proffering some examples from comparable games?

Rather than just listing things that are not P2W...

ED is the first and to date only MMO-ish game I have played, I'm not interested in reading the update news of games that are irrelevant to me.

Can you clarify what you mean with the latter bit? You think they should have bundled the core game into Horizons?

Yes, after all, you guys talk about how little money it is and how weird you must be to not have Horizons.

The only time? Could you be any more pouty?

There's clearly been a ton more examples of player input. From the infamous player influence on Supercruise and transit distances within systems, to the neutron highway, there's plenty of gameplay mechanics that the community have influenced or suggested, which FDev took on board. (And that's without adding the ton of other more minor responses with most patches, such as reacting to complaints about the new mining mechanics primarily leading to duff commodities etc etc).

So yeah of course they can take or leave input. But to say you've only ever seen them adopt one community suggestion sounds pretty histrionic

(PS it probably helps if the suggestion is kinda pragmatic too )

Well yes you made me remember the neutron star boost thing, although I never heard it was implemented for the neutron superhighway. The other example I recall now is the ship transfer timer. So that's three, quite a huge number...

In all seriousness, list the times they have heard the provided feedback.

 

[Lightspeed]

In all seriousness, list the times they have heard the provided feedback.

Krait Phantom paint jobs before DW2;

Change to C&P (yes, I know ... it sucks, but we pleaded for it);

Fix to T-10 retractable wing logo display;

.....

 

[StuartGT]

Krait Phantom paint jobs before DW2;

Change to C&P (yes, I know ... it sucks, but we pleaded for it);

Fix to T-10 retractable wing logo display;

.....

Also, off the top of my head:

• All the balancing changes to weapons and equipment in 2.2.03 (it even had an open beta for extensive testing and feedback).
• Infinite probes, as a result of the feedback during the FDev Towers' visit by us lucky guests.
• Colonia.
• Increased material storage, and from tomorrow's 3.3.02 increased ship storage.
• Removal of commodities from Engineers' blueprints.

And as Ed Lewis stated here:

Those of you who participated in the beta have probably already seen most of the gameplay changes we’ve incorporated based on feedback you left on the forums. As a recap, we’d like to point out a few of the key changes below:

• We increased mining payouts
• We made it so probes would be infinite when using the FSS exploration mechanics
• We changed specific bindings for entering and exiting the FSS
• The Discovery Scanner became a free built-in module
• A ‘number of bodies’ message was added to the information message when using the energy pulse
• The ability to find ‘notable signals’ when using the FSS was added
• Made it so notable signals persist outside of Analysis Mode
• We derestricted passenger ship internal slots
• We added a HUD notification about ship lights being on

It looks like Flowey just hasn't been paying any attention to the game or its development [blah]

 

[Barking_Mad]

IMHO, the last significant technical addition to the game was planetary landings. Not until multi-crew did I feel any other addition was much of a significant development, and multi-crew due to the fact we'd had years of mediocre self contained developments, had almost no mechanics to leverage of any depth to make it worthwhile. And that still remains mainly true to this day IMHO.

The next significant technical addition for me was the recent update, with the new exploration and mining additions. But for me, it only just qualifies.

Other people may weigh up things differently... But ultimately, if you take a look at planetary landings, and the scale and scope of what that introduces, what since then has matched it?


If we look at the past 3 years, does it feel like FD have had a significant development team forging ahead with new content year(s) ahead, to ensure significant new developments and content and additions are done? Or does it feel more like small self contained developments have been done almost hand to mouth?

Does the fact even the contents of 3.3 was reduced just a few months before its release, does that make you feel a huge group of people had been beavering away at it?

And given all of this, and the rather shallow history of additional gameplay content (typically art heavy and gameplay light), do you believe the announcement of this next significant development is the movement into full production of something that had significant resources ploughing away at it for significant time? Or maybe just proof of concepts have been done, designs, and now its all greenlit.

Who knows... Maybe 50 people have been working on planetary landings already for two years! BUT, it doesn't feel like that given the past three...

Opinions may vary, and I can only give you mine, based on the perceived quality and scale of development over the past X years.

A watched pot never boils.

 

[Shinji Ikari]

Also, off the top of my head:

• All the balancing changes to weapons and equipment in 2.2.03 (it even had an open beta for extensive testing and feedback).
• Infinite probes, as a result of the feedback during the FDev Towers' visit by us lucky guests.
• Colonia.
• Increased material storage, and from tomorrow's 3.3.02 increased ship storage.
• Removal of commodities from Engineers' blueprints.

1º That's something that we aided, balance is not feedback on itself, it's a proper state of a given set of features.

2º That's not forum feedback, although I did not specify.

3º Colonia was there when I began playing, what's the deal with it?

4º Fair enough.

5º If I recall well, when that happened they said they'd reintroduce commondities after some changes to the engineers although that clearly never materialized.

• We increased mining payouts
• We made it so probes would be infinite when using the FSS exploration mechanics
• We changed specific bindings for entering and exiting the FSS
• The Discovery Scanner became a free built-in module
• A ‘number of bodies’ message was added to the information message when using the energy pulse
• The ability to find ‘notable signals’ when using the FSS was added
• Made it so notable signals persist outside of Analysis Mode
• We derestricted passenger ship internal slots
• We added a HUD notification about ship lights being on

1º I don't do mining so it's not surprising I didn't notice that, fair enough.

2º That was there since the beta was release, ergo, it wasn't influenced by feedback.

3º That's true, fair enough.

4º If I recall correctly, that was true since the beta release.

5º Same as 2.

6º Same as 4.

7º Same as 4.

8º Fair enough.

9º Same as 4.

It looks like Flowey just hasn't been paying any attention to the game or its development [blah]

I certainly don't put as much attention as you but then again, I have more important things to do than to register and remember patch notes.

 

[StuartGT]

I certainly don't put as much attention as you but then again, I have more important things to do than to register and remember patch notes.

...like fervently complaining that FDev don't listen to feedback when it is easily demonstrated that they do? It would probably take you less time and effort to just read and remember the patch notes.

 

[NeilF]

A watched pot never boils.

Umm... Apparently this one did? And I'll swear there's accounts of others too!

 

[Obsidian Ant]

We increased mining payouts
We made it so probes would be infinite when using the FSS exploration mechanics

1º I don't do mining so it's not surprising I didn't notice that, fair enough.

2º That was there since the beta was release, ergo, it wasn't influenced by feedback.

Number 2 was entirely influenced by feedback.

 

[Lightspeed]

And don't ever forget, the fix for the Beige Planets was entirely in response to repeated and fervent forum feedback.

 

[Shinji Ikari]

...like fervently complaining that FDev don't listen to feedback when it is easily demonstrated that they do? It would probably take you less time and effort to just read and remember the patch notes.

Yo, about half of the example you listed weren't actually feedback driven, I'm not living in a cave.