Explainer because people seem to miss few things about Zac announcement

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

First, disclaimer: soon we will see first reveals about Q4 and then release of it and we will be able to judge FD work on ED for whole year, because we will have full picture. That is, if you are interested into evaluate it properly.

Ok, I am really not keen on doing this, but this grinds me a bit, so I feel I need to underline few things about Zac announcement. That's it, quite a few people seem to miss few beats from it. First of all, it is "nothing". That announcement and subsequent posts from Zac is quite enough to have full picture we can have at the moment - till we start to see Q4 reveals.

First, let's review facts:
* Carriers and ice planets improvements got moved to unknown date;
* Reason why it was done so was to free up development time;
* This development time was spent to improve and extend core gameplay, which is part of Q4. This includes new, unnanounced gameplay, which we can conclude is required for smooth sailing and moving on to next ED phase;

So let's assess some claims seen on forums:
* Half of content or all of content of Q4 gets cut - no, objectively. It might be subjectively though. No complains there. We all want something different from ED updates;
* Promises has been broken - they have. It seems company decided that it was worth it. Till we know where that dev time has gone (see above), it is hard to properly finalize my feelings about it;
* Q4 will be smaller - objectively it might not be the case. Again, it is hard to measure against well anything, but if people click with new feature FD has developed instead, it will be all worth it;

TLDR; FD had new things instead of things that got cut from Q4. Will it be worth it remains to be seen.

 

[Dommarraa]

* Promises has been broken - they have. It seems company decided that it was worth it. Till we know where that dev time has gone (see above), it is hard to properly finalize my feelings about it;

I think "Promises" is a bit strong. They planned to include them, but cant. Thats software development.

I know if my team managed to deliver everything, my manager would be furious "Not working them hard enough" - Yes, he is a scumbag.

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

I think "Promises" is a bit strong. They planned to include them, but cant. Thats software development.

I know if my team managed to deliver everything, my manager would be furious "Not working them hard enough" - Yes, he is a scumbag.

I seem them as promises, and they are broken. Thing is, sometimes promises have to be broken. Things change, and especially with software development

But I never think FD intentionally lied about anything. Just during FX2017 they had no idea they might need to re-plan Q4 release.

We always complain FD isn't flexible. This is FD demonstrating flexible decision making. Of course there will be salt. And it remains to be seen was it worth it.

 

[wrmiller]

I know if my team managed to deliver everything, my manager would be furious "Not working them hard enough" - Yes, he is a scumbag.

This is probably the biggest thing I DON'T miss about writing code for a living. My condolences.

 

[Traveler]

* Promises has been broken - they have. It seems company decided that it was worth it. Till we know where that dev time has gone (see above), it is hard to properly finalize my feelings about it;

Worth it is the key word for me here.
Since they, as a company, work on several projects now, indeed it might be worth it (literally for their pockets) for the company but not necessarily particularly for ED, or to extend it - for us, the community.

FD logic is beyond me from quite some time.
I'll reinstall for Q4 but my hopes are very modest.

 

[sewerratuk]

I seem them as promises, and they are broken. Thing is, sometimes promises have to be broken. Things change, and especially with software development

But I never think FD intentionally lied about anything. Just during FX2017 they had no idea they might need to re-plan Q4 release.

We always complain FD isn't flexible. This is FD demonstrating flexible decision making. Of course there will be salt. And it remains to be seen was it worth it.

The community are always asking for info on future releases and one of the few things we were given info/screenshots of was of icy worlds.
It's a little ironic that it's that very feature that has been cut

 

[BluStar]

i will believe it once i see it, to me it feels like sprinkling sweetener on pile of turd

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

Worth it is the key word for me here.
Since they, as a company, work on several projects now, indeed it might be worth it (literally for their pockets) for the company but not necessarily particularly for ED, or to extend it - for us, the community.

FD logic is beyond me from quite some time.
I'll reinstall for Q4 but my hopes are very modest.

Worth as foundation for future of ED, not company. Company still sees ED as huge asset and it would be stupid for them not to.

 

[Traveler]

Worth as foundation for future of ED, not company. Company still sees ED as huge asset and it would be stupid for them not to.

Sure, you're right and I get it.
But it's not like they haven't done stupid things in the past. In fact a few.

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

Sure, you're right and I get it.
But it's not like they haven't done stupid things in the past. In fact a few.

Yes, but that's unavoidable if you try to do something new. If they correct mistakes, and see it trough, I certainly don't view them less. That's for more perfect people to do.

 

[Dutchman141]

First, disclaimer: soon we will see first reveals about Q4 and then release of it and we will be able to judge FD work on ED for whole year, because we will have full picture. That is, if you are interested into evaluate it properly.

Ok, I am really not keen on doing this, but this grinds me a bit, so I feel I need to underline few things about Zac announcement. That's it, quite a few people seem to miss few beats from it. First of all, it is "nothing". That announcement and subsequent posts from Zac is quite enough to have full picture we can have at the moment - till we start to see Q4 reveals.

First, let's review facts:
* Carriers and ice planets improvements got moved to unknown date;
* Reason why it was done so was to free up development time;
* This development time was spent to improve and extend core gameplay, which is part of Q4. This includes new, unnanounced gameplay, which we can conclude is required for smooth sailing and moving on to next ED phase;

So let's assess some claims seen on forums:
* Half of content or all of content of Q4 gets cut - no, objectively. It might be subjectively though. No complains there. We all want something different from ED updates;
* Promises has been broken - they have. It seems company decided that it was worth it. Till we know where that dev time has gone (see above), it is hard to properly finalize my feelings about it;
* Q4 will be smaller - objectively it might not be the case. Again, it is hard to measure against well anything, but if people click with new feature FD has developed instead, it will be all worth it;

TLDR; FD had new things instead of things that got cut from Q4. Will it be worth it remains to be seen.

You're forgetting the canceled premium content and the stuff for LEP owners in Q4, or at least this year.

And I think the vague announcement of something great comming but we can't tell you what but not very soon is doing Zac's post more harm then good.
It's just a carrot on a long stick.
Just as mentioning that there are a 100+ people working on ED, it serves nothing but making people wonder what all those people have been doing all this time, especially now that features are being de-prioritized.

Lots of people had big expectations for Q4, the canceling of three features decreases those expectations considerably.
Other aspects in Q4 might get more attention this way but no one knows what that's gonna mean.
I hope they won't wait to long with revealing what actually is included in Q4, especially what is comming extra due to the cancellation of these three features.

 

[verminstar]

Talking of future content is only half the story though...I couldnt care less if thats delayed cos thats not the half Im most interested in. Thats not to say I aint looking forward to seeing that half...I am...but this year was supposed to be about fixing long standing bugs and QOL improvements. That was very strongly suggested last October...still waiting.

I see no mention of that aspect in Zacs comment...not really all that interested in hearing all the other fluff because its the bug fixing and QOL improvements that will decide whether or not I stick around past Q4 in the first place.

If thats not delivered on then its game over fer me personally...I really couldnt give a stale fart fer any more excuses Ive had it with their excuses and their words are just that...words. Results speak louder than words and on that note, FD is very quiet...in more ways than merely the obvious.

Which is a long winded way of saying Ill believe it when I see it and so far I dont see squat. The devs wanna restore confidence then deliever what they said they would deliver...no more delay, no more excuses and no more second third or more chances...show us the money shot or just stop trying to sell snow to an eskimo...the old wax lyrical simply no longer works on this old skeptic ^

 

[Traveler]

Yes, but that's unavoidable if you try to do something new. If they correct mistakes, and see it trough, I certainly don't view them less. That's for more perfect people to do.

True. Everyone makes mistakes. Ability to counteract quickly is golden.
I don't agree with many decisions they've made in this game across this years and straightening some essential things seems to take painfully long time. I know you just can't satisfy everyone but their sometimes strange decisions led many times to, lets call it great dissatisfaction of the crowd .
I simply fear that they'll mess things again, I just don't trust them anymore.
I love this game (almost 2k hours) and I'd love to return and play it daily like before. I just fear they've lost their initiative in the design process and just moved on to other things.

P.S.
Oh, and the babbling and smoke and mirrors about things to caome in their last post is just Beyond™ me. I hope they don't get squashed by other titles.

 

[Eymerich]

Dude, seriously, stop...

 

[Dutchman141]

Talking of future content is only half the story though...I couldnt care less if thats delayed cos thats not the half Im most interested in. Thats not to say I aint looking forward to seeing that half...I am...but this year was supposed to be about fixing long standing bugs and QOL improvements. That was very strongly suggested last October...still waiting.

I see no mention of that aspect in Zacs comment...not really all that interested in hearing all the other fluff because its the bug fixing and QOL improvements that will decide whether or not I stick around past Q4 in the first place.

If thats not delivered on then its game over fer me personally...I really couldnt give a stale fart fer any more excuses Ive had it with their excuses and their words are just that...words. Results speak louder than words and on that note, FD is very quiet...in more ways than merely the obvious.

Which is a long winded way of saying Ill believe it when I see it and so far I dont see squat. The devs wanna restore confidence then deliever what they said they would deliver...no more delay, no more excuses and no more second third or more chances...show us the money shot or just stop trying to sell snow to an eskimo...the old wax lyrical simply no longer works on this old skeptic ^

I'm right there with ya.

They realy need to show in Q4 that they mean business, especially after this last memo.
Vague expectations about something groundbreaking but not soon and not knowing what is rather insulting to be honest.
Did they realy think they could make me feel better about the cancellation of three major features that way?

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

I'm right there with ya.

They realy need to show in Q4 that they mean business, especially after this last memo.
Vague expectations about something groundbreaking but not soon and not knowing what is rather insulting to be honest.
Did they realy think they could make me feel better about the cancellation of three major features that way?

I think you again misunderstood what I am about. Cue quote:

As part of pre-production, the team investigate all areas of the content and scope them out thoroughly. It’s important to take the time to be clear on what the vision for this is and how we imagine the content working. During this process, we have made a decision to adjust the focus of content that were previously planned for the Chapter Four update, adding some significant new gameplay, but it also means some other aspects will have to change

 

[TheMegaTurnip]

Credit where credit's due.

They were advertising for a network programmer recently.

To me that seems like the borked mess that is instancing will soon be fixed, or at least I hope so, Potentially one of the best things they could do other than rebalance a fair few engineered modules.

FDev ave done well this year, and thats coming from a hyper critical git like myself.

The last update was'nt wonderful, but the others have been pretty solid, the game runs in a more stable manner now than I ave ever exerienced and the new systems work fairly well.

If they continue to keep going how they have been, we'll be looking at a very much mroe appealing game to play and enjoy.

I have hope for the future, I just hope they dont prioritise the absolutley ludicrous idea of space legs over things like rebalancing and Atmo's.

o7 FDev, o7 indeed.

(Ps I still want C1 plasmas though Hint hint..)

 

[verminstar]

I'm right there with ya.

They realy need to show in Q4 that they mean business, especially after this last memo.
Vague expectations about something groundbreaking but not soon and not knowing what is rather insulting to be honest.
Did they realy think they could make me feel better about the cancellation of three major features that way?

Its their last chance...to go back on what they promised last year now would be the final nail in the coffin...that means that despite having well over a year to prepare, they are either incapable of fixing them or unwilling.

Either way, it sure as hell dont look good and the statement itself is just woeful...its a carrot on a very very long stick...though it might not be a carrot either but it will still be great and you should all be excited...

Sometimes I wonder are they addressing the players whos age is in single figures...cos I stopped believing in Santa and the tooth fairy a long time ago ^

 

[Dutchman141]

I think you again misunderstood what I am about. Cue quote:

Imho, I'm not misunderstanding you.

You're focusing on the significant new gameplay being added in Q4 and other things that need a change.

For all I know you're right and Q4 could turn out better then how it was initially intended, I hope so.

But he honest here.
The only thing Zac was clear about were the features that are being cancelled, the rest is vague and only relies on people's willingness to believe it's gonna be good and all.

As I said in my first reply to you, I hope they won't wait to long with revealing what Q4 is actually going to deliver.

 

[Theodrid]

Absolutely zero disrespect is aimed at Zac here but the statement is what you would expect in terms of tone and spin from any half decent head of comms representing any company/organisation/individual. Simply put though the delay, and even possible dropping of features from the Q4 update is NOT good news no matter how it is spun. Frontier's problem is that they have already burned some of their bridges in terms of their 'what we want to do' statements and what they actually deliver. We've heard it all before, hell, from my personal point of view if some of the previous had been from any other developer I would have been out long ago but Frontier do - rightly or wrongly - have a special place in my heart.

I get and understand that things shift, I get that they may not be able to deliver everything they hoped - that's okay. What I don't get or believe though is that when they are obviously hungry for dev time and resources that somehow some mythical resources have been found in the midst of having to cut stuff to bring us unspecified, mythical super shinies as 'replacements'.