FA-Off while using M+K suggestions please

Madrax573

Madrax573
Well an update on my FA adventures.

I've gone back to my old keyboard bindings but tweaked the mouse sensitivity and settings etc. I have been full FA since getting my vulture and landing is still a PITA at rotating stations but everywhere else it's fine.

Not sure if it make combat easier or harder as I've come to conclusion that I suck at combat even though I seem to be pretty effective I've worked out that it boils down to me over tanking my fits and just blasting stuff in the face until they die. Manoeuvring is what the other guys do to try and get behind me!

I'm going to park my Vulture for a bit and pull out my trusty Keelback and see how it goes with FA-off. Being much slower it might be easier or harder....guess i'll find out shortly :)
 
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subhouse07

subhouse07
I'm pretty sure fa-off doesnt automatically turn off rotational correction. I know for a fact that it remains "on" in thr functions panel, but also upon approach my ship starts spinning with the station when i am just gliding straight at it and its super annoying! Im not convinced that explicitly turning rc off while fa is off actually does anything for me either. I seem to remember though when i first started using fa off that rc went off with it because docking in coriolis and orbis stations was significantly more difficult for me than docking at an outpost. I need to do more testing though to be sure.

Also kudos on actually being able to function with fa off using keyboard and mouse!
 
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Madrax573

Madrax573
Well I'm not sure how the whole FA-off RC thing works tbh. I still find docking at rotating stations a major PITA!

On a side note I'm not sure learning in a Vulture was wise as now every ship I fly feels like a slug with FA-off! :)

I've sold my KB, but not because of FA-off or anything just really cleaning house so to speak. And now I'm back in my trusty Cobra IV which is such a pig to fly! :p

Funny thing, the other night I switched FA-on and I hated that it 'does stuff' for me like braking and whatnot!! Seems more natural to fly FA-off now....

M+K seems ok actually I would like some analogue input into the different thruster but it's manageable with the keyboard. I still get confused sometimes and start spins when I should be sliding etc but not too bad most of the time.

I'm not sure that I am functioning with FA off since returning to my Cobra IV. The slower less agile ships are a pain with FA-off. Landing is almost impossible in my Cobra IV. Going to take a lot more work methinks.
 
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StiTch

StiTch
Madrax573 said:
I..... erm..... reset my save so I decided to go full FA-off from the start. Why I don't know?!?!?

It's hard!
Click to expand...

At first just keep it chill and stick to ships that handle their inertia (momentum) well. Ships like AspX are poor to learn it in because without a grasp of what's going on you'll spend a lot of your time spinning out following even a relatively small push of acceleration.

Remember that FA-Off increases acceleration in most axis but also in effect decreases your deceleration. So yes, keep your speeds low where possible until you get a grasp of redirecting your ship.

If you fly FA-Off 100% of the time I guarantee you'll develop a much greater understanding of it than most pilots. Docking is far more challenging than a FA-Off boost flip, and when it clicks how your momentum works, you'll realise why a FA-Off boost flip in a small ship is often exactly what NOT to do.
 
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Madrax573

Madrax573
Docking is a at rotating stations! I wonder if I need to switch RC off as well as I just can't seem to match the rotation correctly.

Atm I often have to flick the FA-on to stabilise me around the dock before dropping FA again to land.

Then again watch Isinona and his old videos is great inspiration :)
 
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StiTch

StiTch
Madrax573 said:
Docking is a at rotating stations! I wonder if I need to switch RC off as well as I just can't seem to match the rotation correctly.

Atm I often have to flick the FA-on to stabilise me around the dock before dropping FA again to land.

Then again watch Isinona and his old videos is great inspiration :)
Click to expand...

The vast majority of players that fly exclusively FA-Off will state that docking is the hardest part to get a grip of.

I am not "exclusively" FA Off, because some ships such as the iClipper simply require FA-On at moments to move how they should and so will tend to switch between regularly in fights, but will fly FA-Off for most of my casual endeavours. It's very much satisfying.
 
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StiTch

StiTch
CMDR_Cosmicspacehead said:
A tad off topic, but why not pick up a cheap gamepad?

Makes for a very comfortable traveling and gaming experience.
I have one in my laptop bag for work at all times.
Click to expand...

Repped and last comment here, honest.

Never feel obliged to move to HOTAS. Mouse is incredibly precise and the favoured weapon for many that prefer combat ability over immersion. But the keyboard part...not so cool. If I am using mouse I still use my throttle block, but gamepads are pretty awesome.

If you have the cash to drop on something by say Razer, do it. If you'll excuse the pun it's a game changer for literally any game you'll play on PC.
 

Madrax573

Madrax573
I already have an x-box style gamepad. it's getting a bit old now but that would feel really weird I reckon. Never been able to get away with them for sims previously....

Might give it a shot later though
 

XW_Ziggy

XW_Ziggy
I absolutely love FA-OFF with my keyboard+mouse config and I use a laptop and multiple machines in different locations so HOTAS is not an option for me really.
The important thing here is that I have full fire control, targetting control, and flight control without any shared fingers. Or, in technical terms, all six degrees of freedom are independently controlled from one hand position, without compromising your ability to target and shoot stuff.

  • Mouse X = Yaw
  • Mouse Y = Pitch
  • WASD = Throttle and roll
  • Q+E = Lateral Thrusters
  • LShift + LCtrl = Vertical Thrusters
  • L+R mouse = Fire groups 1 & 2
  • mousewheel click+roll+tilt = target ahead/cycle targets/cycle subsystems
  • thumb button = FA-OFF (I prefer hold rather than toggle)


I think that's quite a different setup to the defaults, so it may seem alien to you, but there are plenty of things you could experiment with (as I did)
You could easily swap vertical thrusters and throttle around,
If you find that Lshift and CTRL are a stretch, you can try R+F instead, you can move the WASD cluster across to the right by one so that you're using ESDF and use A+Z with your left pinky instead.
Failing that, you can bind the throttle to the mousewheel too.

Having pitch and yaw on the mouse is absolutely essential for FA-OFF.

It felt impossible to control if roll is on the mouse as per the defaults. It also makes the interdiction minigame even more trivial than it already is!
 
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X-Terminator

Banned
X-Terminator
I use M&K and use HOLD SHIFT for FA-OFF with Mouse Y-Axis centre over time (X-Axis is Roll constant).
This gives me limited control to keep straight only as I must juggle the Y-Axis always.
I don't care as it gets me to do what it needs when turning only.
 
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Madrax573

Madrax573
XW_Ziggy said:
I absolutely love FA-OFF with my keyboard+mouse config and I use a laptop and multiple machines in different locations so HOTAS is not an option for me really.
The important thing here is that I have full fire control, targetting control, and flight control without any shared fingers. Or, in technical terms, all six degrees of freedom are independently controlled from one hand position, without compromising your ability to target and shoot stuff.

  • Mouse X = Yaw
  • Mouse Y = Pitch
  • WASD = Throttle and roll
  • Q+E = Lateral Thrusters
  • LShift + LCtrl = Vertical Thrusters
  • L+R mouse = Fire groups 1 & 2
  • mousewheel click+roll+tilt = target ahead/cycle targets/cycle subsystems
  • thumb button = FA-OFF (I prefer hold rather than toggle)


I think that's quite a different setup to the defaults, so it may seem alien to you, but there are plenty of things you could experiment with (as I did)
You could easily swap vertical thrusters and throttle around,
If you find that Lshift and CTRL are a stretch, you can try R+F instead, you can move the WASD cluster across to the right by one so that you're using ESDF and use A+Z with your left pinky instead.
Failing that, you can bind the throttle to the mousewheel too.

Having pitch and yaw on the mouse is absolutely essential for FA-OFF.

It felt impossible to control if roll is on the mouse as per the defaults. It also makes the interdiction minigame even more trivial than it already is!
Click to expand...

Thats not too dissimilar to how I currently have mine setup.

Mouse - Pitch/Yaw. Relative mouse on (this is probably the most frustrating part tbh)
W/S - Vertical Thrusters
A/D - Roll
Q/E - Lateral Thrusters
Space/LShift - Forward/Reverse Thursters
Mouse wheel = throttle
Mouse wheel Click+movement for head look.
Mouse thumb button 1 - Next target
Mouse thumb button 2 - Next subsystem.
R - FA-toggle. I'm trying to go full FA-off and I can't work with a hold for FA-off setup.

Think I might have a play with my mouse settings to see if I can get something useful without using relative mouse. As you can't bind it to a key press or link it to FA-off it's a pain.

I've been thinking of trying more of a FPS shooter style setup with the keys but I guess i'm just too used to this setup currently.
 
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Madrax573

Madrax573
Does anyone have any links to good FA-off pilots using KMAB? I watch a few youtubers etc but most seem to be hotas or dual stick.
 

XW_Ziggy

XW_Ziggy
A good pilot using full-time, 100% FA-off with KB&M?

I doubt it, not unless FD sorts the relative-mouse sensitivities and adds some kind of gyro assist to help with relative-mouse input.

I use FA-off all the time *when turning* but I tap it back on to stabilise roll/pitch/yaw after the turn is complete. Part of me thinks that a bigger deadzone would stop the ship nose from wandering with FA-off using a mouse, but whenever I try it, it feels terrible for everything else :\
 

Spacecat

Spacecat
Underhook said:
The only issue I came accross is that ED forgets your throttle position. So that when you turn FA on it will set the throttle at your current heading and velocity. A slide throttle eliminates this issue. That said, i believe some CMDR have made a macro that turning FA on automatically sets their throttle to forward 50%
Click to expand...

AH, I've always thought this was stupid. That would help.
 

Madrax573

Madrax573
XW_Ziggy said:
A good pilot using full-time, 100% FA-off with KB&M?

I doubt it, not unless FD sorts the relative-mouse sensitivities and adds some kind of gyro assist to help with relative-mouse input.

I use FA-off all the time *when turning* but I tap it back on to stabilise roll/pitch/yaw after the turn is complete. Part of me thinks that a bigger deadzone would stop the ship nose from wandering with FA-off using a mouse, but whenever I try it, it feels terrible for everything else :\
Click to expand...

In all honesty I think 99% of the problem using FA off with kbam would be solved if we could just assign a key to relative mouse or link it to fa toggle.

I'm currently messing with various mouse settings to see if I can get to work while nit in relative control but haven't found a solution yet.

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Spacecat said:
AH, I've always thought this was stupid. That would help.
Click to expand...

I've never had much of an issue when swapping back to fa on. Probably as I generally control the throttle setting by keys so as soon as I switch fa back on I select 50% throttle straight away so.....
 

Madrax573

Madrax573
Still bombing around with FA-off.

SC is annoying but I've bound the directional movement inputs to my number pad so I don't break my wrist trying to to do full 180 in SC!

Still finding it difficult to land quickly at the rotaty stations but when you get it right man does it feel good!

Combat is still very much a mess for me. I can still handle myself in a RES ok but thats more to do with target selection than anything else. My little adder handles nicely enough but I won't even last 5 mins with a decent player in my sights!
 

Madrax573

Madrax573
Joe Akeem said:
This is the main alpha prime reason I can't/won't use FA-off with mouse. You are not alone, friend.
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it's a conspiracy I tell you! FD just want us KBAM users to wipe the floor with the HOTAS pilots all the time so they deliberately hamper us by forcing us to be one or the other!! :S:eek::x[alien][alien]:O
 
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