Feel like ship crew (NOT multi crew) is a really missing feature of the game (lore included)

[CapuchinSeven]

Many ED ships are very big and actually from a lore standpoint require crew to function. Even small ships like the Courier have a crew (see below).

It feels like not having any crew (I'm ignoring multi crew fighter pilots here) really does miss out on adding both flavor and game play to the game, I wouldn't expect anything as detailed or personal as multi crew but I really like the idea of needing crew in the same way you need ammo and fuel (and gaining bonuses from having decent crew as well as suffering if many of your crew are killed during battle or from damage).

This is something that EVE totally did away with because of how pod systems work in their lore but with ED's more hands on feel to flying I really miss not feeling like I have a crew.

From ED lore, the Imperial Courier -

"Considering the Empire's love for clones compared to the Federation's preference for mechanical artificial intelligence, a general surprise of Imperial designs is the high level of automation. When being designed, the Imperial Courier (first of its class, the Trader being second) was to have been extensively reliant on the use of genetically-designed slave crew. It was found, however, that the level of automation required to keep the two drives perfectly synchronised to the precision required by a hyperspace jump meant that it was simpler to just add the extra robotics.

Most ships of this size require a significant crew, but the Courier makes do with only three crew members, nominally a Captain (who is also an experienced pilot), a pilot First Officer and an engineer. Although most spaceports will not allow a ship to launch without the proper number of crew, the Courier can easily be flown single-pilot on a "milk run", however most commanders will find their job significantly easier with at least a pilot First Officer on board. Although highly automated, the ship is large and complex and should not be used for a prolonged period of time without an engineer on the crew."

Quick video of the old skool Courier -

[video=youtube;HbegNmKRZUM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HbegNmKRZUM[/video]

 

[Friedenreich Xante]

Oh no I don't want to rank up another guy eating away 2% or more of my income who starts to assume an air of importance as soon as he hits Elite.

Although I totally undestand it from an Immersion Point of view. I can only wonder how an Anaconda fly itself. But not with current mechanics, please.

 

[CapuchinSeven]

Oh no I don't want to rank up another guy eating away 2% or more of my income who starts to assume an air of importance as soon as he hits Elite.

Although I totally undestand it from an Immersion Point of view. I can only wonder how an Anaconda fly itself. But not with current mechanics, please.

DEFIANTLY not with MC mechanics.

I was thinking much more simple (we're talking more bulk crew here). Big ships like the 'conder need something like (if I remember right) 200 people to get it to fly. I feel ships like this could use a extra module slot where crew can be slotted (A rated crew being better and given a boost to performance, or C or D rated giving baseline with the module suffering damage which reduces the crew number).

I get it, the horse is out of the gate, people don't like changes like this late into a game (myself I'm just a sucker for punishment if it adds to game play immersion).

 

[Sylow]

What would this additional crew do for the game?
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On the "positive", you could say that it adds to the flavour. Having some "crew" stored away somewhere could give the bigger ships the feeling of a being a bigger ship. Unfortunately it would still boil down to the crew being stored somewhere, not being active. I mean, how would players react if a bigger ship would come with a pilot and engineer NPC? So the one does the flying for you, the other one handles energy and uses the AFMU to repair systems. So your Interface is reduced to "travel to system X", "dock at station Y" or "destroy target ship Z". The NPCs would do the rest.
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I don't think that this would really help the game. The strong part is flying the ships, so i doubt anybody would let the game take that away from them just for the sake of "big ships have to feel bigger". So if nothing changes in how the game plays, the "crew" is just a kind of commodity which doesn't use cargo space but also doesn't add anything to how the game plays.
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So far, we're still at the -positive-. It would affect the game not at all, except being a number somewhere for lore reasons. But also note that different ships are for different tasks. Many people own a number of ships and switch between them, depending on what they just want to do. So when you switch to your Eagle, you fire all your crew and when you switch back to your Clipper you sit in the starport for a while, trying to find a new engineer and navigator?
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For the sake of how the game plays, i think it's actually better to take a look at the in-game timescale. The example you posted was for a much older version of the iCourier, which is not built any more. The never version, which we have in this game, comes with more automatisation and can easily be operated by one person. It's not unlogical that automatisation eliminated the need for extra crew.
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So while needing a crew would add some fluff and flavour, the current state gives us more flexibility and thus in my eyes is preferable.
.

 

[CapuchinSeven]

What would this additional crew do for the game?

With an A rated crew. Faster boost recharge, faster shield recharge, very slow out of combat passive system repair, faster scanning times, more efficient mining refinery.

Then, very much later into the game a few years from now it opens up many more options, such as Marine boarding parties.

 

[Deleted member 38366]

If anything, our current hired NPCs and the MultiCrew concepts offer themselves for a crapton of improvements and fleshing out.

Until then, we're playing the V0.7alpha they've released for public use with their inherent placeholder mechanics.

V3.x I guess is when we might see those amongst the things that are scheduled to get some of the urgently needed foundation repair and then maybe something nice built onto them.

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

its in the DDF, it was talked about back in the day and it was a large part of the reason i backed... or more accurately increased my initial backer amount

given a choice i would swap all the multiplayer carp in the game for the npc wingmates and crew in the DDF.

(tho obviously i want both )

 

[CapuchinSeven]

its in the DDF, it was talked about back in the day and it was a large part of the reason i backed... or more accurately increased my initial backer amount

given a choice i would swap all the multiplayer carp in the game for the npc wingmates and crew in the DDF.

(tho obviously i want both )

THANK you! I was sure it was but couldn't remember properly, I remembered it being a reason I'd got interested in the first place.
I was going to put that in my OP but couldn't remember for sure.

 

[DWorth]

I'd quite like NPC crew members, to add a bit of colour mainly. I think it'll be more important if we ever are given the chance to walk around inside our ships. Walking around a ship the size of a Cutter with no other crew would be a bit wierd.

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

THANK you! I was sure it was but couldn't remember properly, I remembered it being a reason I'd got interested in the first place.
I was going to put that in my OP but couldn't remember for sure.

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...na-come-out-dead-”-Ship-Crews-Elite-Dangerous
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...-a-thing-quot-Revised-Wingmen-Elite-Dangerous

 

[Jack Schitt]

The problem with NPC crew is that no matter how much immersion they add, or how many ship features and behaviours their presence can modify, you will never be in the position of encouraging them to go out and buy their own copy of the game so they can join you on the flight deck.

The same is not true for player crew.

I believe this has been a strong motivator for FD to concentrate on multiplayer aspects, rather than the NPCs talked about in the DDF, in the updates we've seen so far.

 

[Commandeur_Brin]

its in the DDF, it was talked about back in the day and it was a large part of the reason i backed... or more accurately increased my initial backer amount

given a choice i would swap all the multiplayer crap in the game for the npc wingmates and crew in the DDF.

(tho obviously i want both )

+1 ! This would give a lot more depth to the game's experience !

 

[CMDR BlackHogg]

Agree with OP. I'd love to see NPC crew system taken further, having a module could definitely be an option and it could just be a crew quarters. You could then look at your crew in their quarters and assign them simple tasks or leave them performing their base tasks ie providing simple bonuses as you suggest. You could assign one to SLF and one to turrets (providing passive boost) and they could all level up as they currently do. You could choose crew to join you on the bridge in holo form. Like you say they could take casualties in combat and larger ships could have a med bay. Obviously the percentage commission NPC crews currently charge would have to drop considerably (way too high at the moment) . On entering into Multiplayer Multicrew your crew simply go back to their quarters.

 

[h347h]

It should require a crew cabin and not really give combat bonuses. Especially flat math bonuses.

Maybe it could add convince and quality of life improvements. Like adding a navigator who could 'save' routes for trading.(Navigator) Improved limpet speeds and AI as well as adding a filter for what to collect.(Limpet engineer) Scanning things in super cruise and calling out what they are to you. As well as monitoring hostile NPCs who might be interested in interdicting you.(Co pilot) Maintenance crew could repair modules on your ship up to a total of 85% to represent the fact they can maintain things but they can't keep in top shape with out landing at a repair facility. They could then flesh out some better module damage. Like having them radio in over coms that we received malfunction x,y, or z and it's going to cause issues a,b, and c until we can repair it. Then add in hi wake jumps having a chance to cause problems.

This could give exploration a slight survival type of gameplay element. Perhaps even require a cargo hold with food and luxury/rare items to keep your crew happy on long voyages.

 

[Commandeur_Brin]

The problem with NPC crew is that no matter how much immersion they add, or how many ship features and behaviours their presence can modify, you will never be in the position of encouraging them to go out and buy their own copy of the game so they can join you on the flight deck.

The same is not true for player crew.

I'm sorry but this argument is lame at best. If you want to show the game to a friend through multi-crew he HAS to buy the game first.

 

[SP_Predicador]

I really like to have NPC crew in game. I feel the large ships so empty. But for a while, I only need a snub fighter in my clipper (one day...I hope) to hire an npc pilot, and that can be used by a friend. When the core game finally gets more love, then I really ask for a more complex NPC crew.

 

[Jack Schitt]

I'm sorry but this argument is lame at best. If you want to show the game to a friend through multi-crew he HAS to buy the game first.

You may have missed the point. Your friends are a potential revenue steam. Your virtual friends, not so much.

 

[Iskariot]

Many ED ships are very big and actually from a lore standpoint require crew to function. Even small ships like the Courier have a crew (see below).

It feels like not having any crew (I'm ignoring multi crew fighter pilots here) really does miss out on adding both flavor and game play to the game, I wouldn't expect anything as detailed or personal as multi crew but I really like the idea of needing crew in the same way you need ammo and fuel (and gaining bonuses from having decent crew as well as suffering if many of your crew are killed during battle or from damage).

This is something that EVE totally did away with because of how pod systems work in their lore but with ED's more hands on feel to flying I really miss not feeling like I have a crew.

From ED lore, the Imperial Courier -

"Considering the Empire's love for clones compared to the Federation's preference for mechanical artificial intelligence, a general surprise of Imperial designs is the high level of automation. When being designed, the Imperial Courier (first of its class, the Trader being second) was to have been extensively reliant on the use of genetically-designed slave crew. It was found, however, that the level of automation required to keep the two drives perfectly synchronised to the precision required by a hyperspace jump meant that it was simpler to just add the extra robotics.

Most ships of this size require a significant crew, but the Courier makes do with only three crew members, nominally a Captain (who is also an experienced pilot), a pilot First Officer and an engineer. Although most spaceports will not allow a ship to launch without the proper number of crew, the Courier can easily be flown single-pilot on a "milk run", however most commanders will find their job significantly easier with at least a pilot First Officer on board. Although highly automated, the ship is large and complex and should not be used for a prolonged period of time without an engineer on the crew."

Quick video of the old skool Courier -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HbegNmKRZUM

I agree.
I would like to have a simple npc crew system, like in Frontier Elite II.
It could be a bit more complex than that.
Crew could give you interesting and desirable perks.
An engineer on board could enable a slow auto-repair feature for internal modules for example.
A navigator on board could enable the ability to auto jump to the next system in a route or enable autobreaking when approaching a target station in supercruise.
Simple convenient stuff like that.

Of course the crew payment should be changed. The current percentages the pilots get would bleed you dry with a crew of 3 or 4 people.
Currently even just one pilot is too expensive afaic because even if you don't use him he still takes part of all you profits.
That is why I sacked my trained pilot, stopped training new pilots and currently don't use pilots at all.
It should be possible to deactivate a crewmember, but still keep him on call.

 

[h347h]

I agree.
I would like to have a simple npc crew system, like in Frontier Elite II.
It could be a bit more complex than that.
An engineer on board could enable a slow auto-repair feature for example.
A navigator on board could enable the ability to auto jump to the next system in a route.

Stuff like that.
Of course the crew payment should be changed. The current percentages the pilots get would bleed you dry with a crew of 3 or 4 people.
Currently even just one pilot is too expensive afaic because even if you don't use him he still takes part of all you profits.
That is why I stopped training pilots and currently don't use pilots at all.

Yeah just said some of the same but I disagree about the profit share with crew. I think the total if all maxed out should be 25% of earnings.

 

[Iskariot]

Yeah just said some of the same but I disagree about the profit share with crew. I think the total if all maxed out should be 25% of earnings.

You too think it should change. We agree on that then .

The exact manner in which it should change has not fully crystallized in my mind yet.
I tend to think that a crew member should earn a maximum of 5% of profits. If you have 4 npc crew then this would amount to 20%.
I feel that is more than enough. They will all become millionaires after a while anyway if you are a good earner.

I think crew should be very affordable, but still take a meaningful percentage of your profits.
This is a game after all and having crew should be stimulated and be a positive experience and not an annoyance.
I think 5 % per person is meaningful, but not such a burden that you would want to get rid of them.

I also feel that it should be possible to give crew shore leave so to speak. This is necessary because many people also fly small crew-less ships for extended times.
To many cmdrs it is very irritating that crew members who are not active and not on your ship still eat part of the profits.
Perhaps this is not entirely realistic, but it will make having and keeping crew much more digestible. It will also make it possible to hang on to them for as long as you play the game and they will become meaningful and when we can walk around we will actually see them in our ships and become more and more attached to them.

For this reason I think that there should not always be permadeath for npc crew either.
Instead when your ship gets blown up every crew member has a chance of becoming wounded and disabled for a variable amount of time.
Perhaps you can shorten their sick leave by paying medical costs, special medical treatments for example.
When people are attached to their crew they will want to invest in them.
There could also be a small chance that a crew member really dies. In that case he/she is lost forever and you need to hire someone new.
Perhaps you might choose to pay for their burial and this would add to your rep and make it easier to find a good replacement.

All this would add to gameplay and make crew management interesting.