FGS vs FDL vs Mamba

[NCFCpaul]

I've been experimenting with combat ships recently. I find that my Corvette is very clearly OP- I only play against NPC's as I have no doubt any human will laugh at my pitiful combat lack of skills and my Corvette with a safety conscious 5100+ mj shields helps me win. Every time.

That being said and moving away from that I've been practicing and come to the following conclusions:

1) The FDL when engineered is great and you can get some awesome shields
2) The FGS when engineered is even better and you can get some mad hull tanking
3) The Mamba when engineered is quite fun and can go really fast, especially when running (bravely) away
4) all three ships work best with a full multicannon loadout-
5) all three ships are much more fun with a mix of PA and frag-cannons

My conclusion is that the best, the most fun, combat ship is the FGS loaded with three PA's engineered for long range and oversized. The frags are all high capacity with a mix of incendiary x2, corrosive and drag.

This is surely the best combat ship in the game, don't know why everyone loves the FDL?!

 

[Bob Lighthouse]

I love the FGS but it's painfully slow.

5x PAs works great!

 

[Garand1987]

Currently playing with a Mamba myself. Quick charge biweaves, 2 large Rapid Fire autoloading MC’s, 2 small Rapid Fire corrosive MC’s, 1 Huge PA. G5 DD’s and optimal mass experimental. Getting most of it to the G5 level and it’s been a lot of fun to fly in and pew pew stuff. And yeah it does Brave Sir Robin well
It’s basically a cooler looking FDL with better cockpit view, faster straight line speed but slower turn. Some people don’t like the turning but with G5 DD’s and the higher OM experimental it’ll turn inside of most Viper 3’s in my experience.

 

[Hanerib]

Fer-de-lance is the rail gun boat. Mamba has strange hardpoints. FGS is the prettiest of them all, and sounds like metal pipes rolling on a concrete floor.

 

[Garand1987]

Fer-de-lance is the rail gun boat. Mamba has strange hardpoints. FGS is the prettiest of them all, and sounds like metal pipes rolling on a concrete floor.

The mambas placements are a bit odd. The FDL is the better ship but I’ve been having fun with the Mamba for now. Haven’t owned a FGS Myself. Personally don’t like the look of it but that’s purely subjective. In your experience how does the FGS stack up against the perennial FLD.

 

[CMDR Harada]

If you want fun, try a Vulture. Engineered, and with two L Beams, it is a lot of fun. Out turns just about anything, great view, and packs a punch.

I take it out for laughs when I'm tired of my 'Vette, Cutter, or Annie.

 

[Garand1987]

If you want fun, try a Vulture. Engineered, and with two L Beams, it is a lot of fun. Out turns just about anything, great view, and packs a punch.

I take it out for laughs when I'm tired of my 'Vette, Cutter, or Annie.

Yeah the Vulture is lots of fun and not too expensive to boot. Only issue I had with mine was it would slag itself running 2 beams. But with engineering available now that can be fixed in quick order.

 

[Old Duck]

Yeah the Vulture is lots of fun and not too expensive to boot. Only issue I had with mine was it would slag itself running 2 beams. But with engineering available now that can be fixed in quick order.

Another Vulture fan here. Efficient beams with thermal vent will not only run all day long (4 pips to weapons), but it will also turn your bird ice cold. In fact, I think that's my callsign - ICE-T

 

[60mm]

FGS has poor maneuverability compared to FDL. If pilot skill were even, FDL will wipe the floor with the FGS. FGS is probably the least maneuverable Medium Combat ship.

As for fun, the small ships are where it is at. The rebuy is low, maneuverability is high and little room for slacking.

The ship I have the most fun with is a shieldless DBS w/twin PA. Can take down Elite NPC Corvettes without getting hit, but certainly requires staying on my toes! Can take on two simultaneously and come out the winner w/>= 80% hull. Big fun! The only Missions she can't tackle are Wing Missions.

 

[Garand1987]

Another Vulture fan here. Efficient beams with thermal vent will not only run all day long (4 pips to weapons), but it will also turn your bird ice cold. In fact, I think that's my callsign - ICE-T

Nice lol. After I finish my mamba I was thinking about doing up another vulture beam boat, I had heard that you can get it really cool with efficient vented beams which sounds ideal for that ship.
Was also thinking that might be the answer (a bit off topic) for surviving the planet of death. Have a really cool running ship to begin with, pop heat syncs, and have G5 efficient vented beams firing at all times to keep it cool.

 

[60mm]

Was also thinking that might be the answer (a bit off topic) for surviving the planet of death. Have a really cool running ship to begin with, pop heat syncs, and have G5 efficient vented beams firing at all times to keep it cool.

If you're talking about surviving a hot planet, this would kill you quicker. Thermal Vent only discharges heat while you are hitting an opponent. When you are not hitting an opponent, the Thermal Load is actually increased.

 

[Garand1987]

FGS has poor maneuverability compared to FDL. If pilot skill were even, FDL will wipe the floor with the FGS. FGS is probably the least maneuverable Medium Combat ship.

As for fun, the small ships are where it is at. The rebuy is low, maneuverability is high and little room for slacking.

The ship I have the most fun with is a shieldless DBS w/twin PA. Can take down Elite NPC Corvettes without getting hit, but certainly requires staying on my toes! Can take on two simultaneously and come out the winner w/>= 80% hull. Big fun! The only Missions she can't tackle are Wing Missions.

That does sound fun. Haven’t built up a shieldless hulltank yet myself but wanna give it a go sometime. Been getting back into small and medium ships myself because, as you say, they’re fun and cheap not that i imagine it’ll do much, but I’ve wondered just what a fully G5 rated Sidey build could do.

 

[Aekero]

I've been experimenting with combat ships recently. I find that my Corvette is very clearly OP- I only play against NPC's as I have no doubt any human will laugh at my pitiful combat lack of skills and my Corvette with a safety conscious 5100+ mj shields helps me win. Every time.

That being said and moving away from that I've been practicing and come to the following conclusions:

1) The FDL when engineered is great and you can get some awesome shields
2) The FGS when engineered is even better and you can get some mad hull tanking
3) The Mamba when engineered is quite fun and can go really fast, especially when running (bravely) away
4) all three ships work best with a full multicannon loadout-
5) all three ships are much more fun with a mix of PA and frag-cannons

My conclusion is that the best, the most fun, combat ship is the FGS loaded with three PA's engineered for long range and oversized. The frags are all high capacity with a mix of incendiary x2, corrosive and drag.

This is surely the best combat ship in the game, don't know why everyone loves the FDL?!

FGS is beefy and I think used quite effectively by some of the better pvpers...but I think agility is very important and all things equal at high level the fdl would have a higher time on target?

Mamba is good for running away....but it's hot and has terrible convergence aside from that wonderful class 4 on top.

 

[Garand1987]

If you're talking about surviving a hot planet, this would kill you quicker. Thermal Vent only discharges heat while you are hitting an opponent. When you are not hitting an opponent, the Thermal Load is actually increased.

Ah. Hmmm. Maybe have some buddies come along for the ride as sacrificial targets?

 

[Feros-da-Grundig]

don't know why everyone loves the FDL?!

The FDL gets nearly twice as much of an acceleration bonus when boosting as every other ship (except vipers). It also has two more utility slots than any other medium ship (except Mamba).

These are colossal factors and a large part of "why everyone loves the FdL". They make the FdL much harder to hit & more able get into a good firing position, and also allow for great shield boosting without sacrifice of chaff and/or heat sinks.

In your case, the fact that NPCs are easier to hit & evade than (sufficiently skilled) CMDRs decreases the importance of those factors. The FGS has a better power distro than FdL with more hardpoints, so in that particular case it may seem more effective as it will be able to output damage more quickly.

But it's unusual to discard the use case that benefits most from FdL's strengths, then ask why folks like it. I don't really use markets much, but I understand why the t-9 can come in handy.

Some people don’t like the turning but with G5 DD’s and the higher OM experimental it’ll turn inside of most Viper 3’s in my experience.

The only real world use case in which the optimal mass experimental (drive distributors) will result in better performance than drag drives is Enhanced Performance Thrusters on small ships. You can check the results on Coriolis or EDShipyard. You are simply giving up performance equipping DD experimental instead of drag on the Mamba. If the ship is so heavy it benefits more from OM it probably would benefit more from reducing its mass and using drag.

A Mamba will never turn inside a similarly engineered and piloted Viper 3, especially factoring in lateral/vertical thrust into account. See: https://www.reddit.com/r/EliteDange...lite_dangerous_ship_acceleration_and_agility/ and https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1UKvWx-Po1erSwAFomEpSJvB5vRbYn_A2t0T9lNhMst0

 

[60mm]

That does sound fun. Haven’t built up a shieldless hulltank yet myself but wanna give it a go sometime. Been getting back into small and medium ships myself because, as you say, they’re fun and cheap not that i imagine it’ll do much, but I’ve wondered just what a fully G5 rated Sidey build could do.

Could be fun in RES sites, but would be next to impossible for Combat Missions because of the Hardpoints. While you could technically wear a target down, the primary issue is you won't be able to keep them from waking out. Using one of the Sidewinder's Hardpoints for FSD Interrupt would leave you with 1 Small . . . yeah. For Small Combat, I would go with iCourier, Viper, Vulture, Cobra or DBS. Taking some time to whittle down your opponent is fine and can be fun, but there is a balance if you want to actually kill them. NPCs do like to wake out. Good look finishing off an Anaconda at 20% with a Small Hardpoint or two before it's FSD charges.

 

[Garand1987]

The FDL gets nearly twice as much of an acceleration bonus when boosting as every other ship (except vipers). It also has two more utility slots than any other medium ship (except Mamba).

These are colossal factors and a large part of "why everyone loves the FdL". They make the FdL much harder to hit & more able get into a good firing position, and also allow for great shield boosting without sacrifice of chaff and/or heat sinks.

In your case, the fact that NPCs are easier to hit & evade than (sufficiently skilled) CMDRs decreases the importance of those factors. The FGS has a better power distro than FdL with more hardpoints, so in that particular case it may seem more effective as it will be able to output damage more quickly.

But it's unusual to discard the use case that benefits most from FdL's strengths, then ask why folks like it. I don't really use markets much, but I understand why the t-9 can come in handy.





The only real world use case in which the optimal mass experimental (drive distributors) will result in better performance than drag drives are for Enhanced Performance Thrusters on small ships. You can check the results on Coriolis or EDShipyard. You are simply giving up performance equipping DD experimental instead of drag on the Mamba. If the ship is so heavy it benefits more from OM it probably would benefit more from reducing its mass and using drag.

A Mamba will never turn inside a similarly engineered and piloted Viper 3, especially factoring in lateral/vertical thrust into account. See: https://www.reddit.com/r/EliteDange...lite_dangerous_ship_acceleration_and_agility/ and https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1UKvWx-Po1erSwAFomEpSJvB5vRbYn_A2t0T9lNhMst0

Huh. I’ll have to give drag drives a shot maybe. It comes with a pretty big heat increase tho over DD mod tho no?
Absolutely, a well engineered Viper 3 will out turn it. Just so far a lot of Viper 3’s I’ve ended up facing haven’t been fully done up, so many I can out turn. But all things being equal yeah, the V3 has the advantage in turning over the mamba.

 

[Hanerib]

FGS does turn, pay some attention to your speed and do a "rolling yaw-turn". Then have multicannons, of course.

 

[Feros-da-Grundig]

Huh. I’ll have to give drag drives a shot maybe. It comes with a pretty big heat increase tho over DD mod tho no?
Absolutely, a well engineered Viper 3 will out turn it. Just so far a lot of Viper 3’s I’ve ended up facing haven’t been fully done up, so many I can out turn. But all things being equal yeah, the V3 has the advantage in turning over the mamba.

Marginally hotter but when rebuy is on the line I want every last bit of maneuverability I can get.

This is all with the mindset of having the absolute best chance to defeat enemy CMDR(s). (Also good for the tougher NPC based challenges, like those spec ops wings in CZs).

For mowing down typical NPCs, it's not as critical. One might even intentionally choose a different sort of build or ship for more fun, rather than absolute best chance to win. Killing NPCs with G5'ed murder machines is a bit like hammering a cold red puddle in the dirt.

 

[Krash]

The best of those 3 ships is whatever you have the most fun with. For me the FDL is both shield tank and hull tank which makes it the most survivable.