Community Event / Creation FREE science consultation for fiction authors :)
- Thread starter Dr Wookie
- Start date
Yes, it does, but far less efficiently than in an atmosphere. In an atmosphere gasses (air) conduct heat increasing the efficiency of the cooling system. You can increase the efficiency further by using fans to increase the air flow. In space it works by heat radiation (IR radiation) which is far less efficient. That is why you have quite large radiator panels on the ISS (that second set of what looks like solar panels closer to the main hull inside the solar panels are in fact heat radiation panels). To disperse heat quickly venting gas would work, but you would need to replace the gas. Anyway, Elite: Dangerous is a game, so I assume there is some handwavium cooling technology that solves the problem.
Last edited:
'I love the smell of handwavium in the morning!'
A possible non-handwaveium explanation for Elite's starship engines of the future? Known also as, Nano-particle field extraction thruster or NanoFET engines. 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nano-particle_field_extraction_thruster
A good excuse for having such flat engines on these 3300ad starships.
"Much of the engine is etched directly onto a wafer-thin piece of silicon via micro-electromechanical systems technologies, known as MEMS, that are more commonly used in the semiconductor industry. Measuring no thicker than a half-inch (1 centimeter, including the fuel) and with tens of thousands of accelerators able to fit on an area smaller than a postage stamp, these “stick-on” thrusters could power tiny spacecraft over vast distances. "
Now take this tech and plug it into a 3300ad setting. What you think people right direction? Doc?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nano-particle_field_extraction_thruster
A good excuse for having such flat engines on these 3300ad starships.
"Much of the engine is etched directly onto a wafer-thin piece of silicon via micro-electromechanical systems technologies, known as MEMS, that are more commonly used in the semiconductor industry. Measuring no thicker than a half-inch (1 centimeter, including the fuel) and with tens of thousands of accelerators able to fit on an area smaller than a postage stamp, these “stick-on” thrusters could power tiny spacecraft over vast distances. "
Now take this tech and plug it into a 3300ad setting. What you think people right direction? Doc?
No they wouldn't (and didn't). They didn't want their rivals to get the fish
So we have no evidence but you still trust myths passed down generations?
Yes, I am well aware of British being a little gullible when they want to be beat others in achievements, offense meant, but Piltdown-man was possible mainly because anglos just HAD to have important part in evolution of humanity.
Zero evidence for English fishemen in Americas, so they weren't there.
Claims without scientific evidence, thus false.
I think we should instead look at some kind of life which COULD live in vacuum. Yeah, it is extremely far fetched and not ever been confirmed, but if we could come up with scientifically relatively plausible lifeform for outer space...
Any ideas?
OK Bored of this now!
Point of fact, your scientific method is rusty- lack of evidence does not equal false.
PacalB, I've only heard about this Nano-FET just now, but it sounds like a good way of making very small thrusts, liket the caesium ion thruster discussed earlier in this thread, rather than high speed bulk motion.
They might be suitable for sending out small probes or something like that
Sorry for not answering earlier, I've been on holiday with no real access to a computer (just my ipod touch for internet!). This is a tough one, so here are my first thoughts.
I don't think that a radiating system would be practical on a ship. A cooling system that works by heating and ejecting gas would work, especially if that gas is stored under high pressure, or maybe even as a solid. This would need to be topped up as part of regular ship maintainence.
I know that one X-ray observatory, called Suzaku, managed to keep one of its detectors at 0.065 K for 3 weeks before there was an accident with the coolant; this seems to have been like a very high tech thermos flask, where the instrument is surrounded by liquid helium and solid neon; the instrument would have worked only until all the neon melted.
A stealthy ship might have an extremely cold coolant, that is ejected at the ambient temperature (maybe 100 K or so). Less refined ships would be happy to eject hotter matter. I don't think you would be able to see the gas by eye, but you might be able to pick up thermal emissions (IR) if the gas is hotter than the surroundings.
Last edited:
Excellent! Thank you for the very informative post - I had not even thought of using extremely cold coolant and ejecting it at ambient temp. I had thought that the moment of ejection might be the weak point in the stealth of such a ship, but I now see that it might not necessarily be so.
Also, good to know that there would be no visual cues (to human eye) of any of this happening.
Also, good to know that there would be no visual cues (to human eye) of any of this happening.
"offense meant" ? ... lol at the fail. Bored by it too. (America is not a myth, BTW )
Question: aircraft display teams (e.g. the Red Arrows) have coloured smoke trails which are visible against the sky in daylight. What sort of trail, if any, could a spacecraft emit for a similar effect? And would it have to shine to be visible?
)Question: aircraft display teams (e.g. the Red Arrows) have coloured smoke trails which are visible against the sky in daylight. What sort of trail, if any, could a spacecraft emit for a similar effect? And would it have to shine to be visible?
Excellent! Thank you for the very informative post - I had not even thought of using extremely cold coolant and ejecting it at ambient temp. I had thought that the moment of ejection might be the weak point in the stealth of such a ship, but I now see that it might not necessarily be so.
Also, good to know that there would be no visual cues (to human eye) of any of this happening.
Cool runnings (so to speak
) would be very inefficient compared to ejecting hotter coolants, so I imagine that stealth engines would have a normal mode where the coolant was ejected at a much higher temperature, as well as stealth mode for occasional use (in active hunting / hiding)Also, there might be a visual effect if the ejected gas was lit up from behind be e.g. a planet or star; it would make the light shimmer and twinkle. But most of the time, space is black.
Last edited:
Last edited:
There has got to be a more efficient way of cooling/using cooling gas/fluid, and indeed using that excess heat as a form of energy?
Brian
That depends on what you want to achieve. Certainly you could use that heat internally, but your whole ship ends up getting hotter and hotter as you use more power ( as FD have said in the past). So that would be better than what i suggested for normal operation. If you want to be mr sneaky pants, then ejecting coolant is the way to go.
So I'd end up having to buy quantities of coolant too? No doubt some joker will add space tax, and an MoST (Ministry of Space transport) test, and insurance as well!! No doubt I'll end up getting an orbital parking ticket if I'm 1 minute late getting back to my ship after getting the shopping!!
Brian
Brian
I think ordinary folks would be just fine; you would probably need special equipment or a special ship to be a real coolant hog. And if you burn it all off, bam- you light up like a Christmas treeSo I'd end up having to buy quantities of coolant too? No doubt some joker will add space tax, and an MoST (Ministry of Space transport) test, and insurance as well!! No doubt I'll end up getting an orbital parking ticket if I'm 1 minute late getting back to my ship after getting the shopping!!
Brian
!