Have I just run into another cheater, or is my ship build useless basically?

  • Thread starter Deleted member 182079
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Deleted member 182079

D
Scenario:

  • Me: FAS - 150 shield (fast charge so this is on purpose), 4,000 hull, 4x G5'd fixed rapid fire pulse lasers all with phasing sequence experimental
  • Them: FdL, presumably the usual meta shield tank with the usual meta PA loadout incl. TLB (forgot to check their internals loadout unfortunately as they interdicted me, and I was too busy evading their shots while returning fire)

Despite me landing a fair few hits, their hull didn't drop by even 1% - we also rammed each other where I lost my shield (fair enough) and about 15% of hull, didn't notice any shield drop on their end but that's just judging from the ring colours to be fair.

I don't want to call people cheaters outright, but give them the benefit of the doubt (and googling the CMDR name didn't yield any red flags, unlike others I've encountered in the past) - what I'm wondering though is why I didn't make a dent at all with my lasers, not even a single % point.

Could it be caused by lag as in even though I could see their shields responding to my weapon hits, on their side it may not have registered? I dodged quite a few PA shots from them but some seemed to hit despite being pretty far away.

But the evident complete lack of impact of my phasing setup strikes me as pretty odd. Especially against a presumably lightly armoured FdL (again I could kick myself for not checking the loadout)? If so I shall reconsider the entire build as that was the whole idea of it to begin with. Cheers.
 

Deleted member 182079

D
They didn't use the SCB (no need I guess), I had them in my sights pretty much 90% of the time. Eventually I gave up shooting at them while they got my hull down below 50% so I just jousted a bit with HP's retracted before low waking out.

Edit - my build was basically to 'counter' shield tank FdL's, due to the limited number of internals that would be used for shield reinforcement/SCBs I should in theory "burn" through their armour knocking of a few % points here and there with a full-on phasing build, but maybe I'm expecting too much here?
 

Spike K

Spike K
I wonder if posting something like their Inara ranking would be considered enough info to qualify as 'name/shame'.
Doubt they even have one. eh?

\\///
Oo
Spike.k
 

rOmiLaYu

rOmiLaYu
ObiW said:
4x G5'd fixed rapid fire pulse lasers all with phasing sequence experimental...But the evident complete lack of impact of my phasing setup strikes me as pretty odd. Especially against a presumably lightly armoured FdL (again I could kick myself for not checking the loadout)? If so I shall reconsider the entire build as that was the whole idea of it to begin with. Cheers.
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An FDL is going to have north of 1K worth of sheilds and if they had any HRP's, you're not going to see much damage from pulse lasers. Phasing sequencing, to me, has always been a bit of a disappointment. It sounds sexy, but it never really delivers much hull damage through sheilds....especially if the sheilds are high volume. I suspect you didn't bring enough gun to the fight, more so than anything else.
 

Ashnak

Ashnak
Just cobbled up something that may or may not be similar to what you describe as your ship and pitted it against my everyday Krait Mk.II in Coriolis.

Straight head to head, I strip your shields faster than Coriolis can count, and kill your hull within 43 seconds - without even deploying my fighter.
You, on the other hand, would need almost three minutes to crack miy shileds, and another three minutes agaionst my armour - if Coriolis is right.

FAS : Krait Mk.II

I didn't put any engineering onto the hull, though, so your hull might be tougher. On the other hand, that Krait could be a lot tougher if I used the unused (in that build) mission specific slots for shields and/or armor. I don't know how well a FdL compares against a Mk.II, but just losing in a specialist build does not imply that your opponent is cheating.
 

Deleted member 182079

D
Attack Chimp said:
About your shield. Are you using it to screen away as much damage from the hull as you can? You're essentially flying a hull tank?
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Yeah, pretty much. It was supposed to be a shieldless hulltank, but after an encounter with a pair of Cobra Mk3s with packhounds and dumb fires in Deciat I decided to replace one size 5 HRP with a shield generator - it's a trade off, just because I tend to draw the short straw in terms of outfitting more often than not:S.
 
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Deleted member 182079

D
Ashnak said:
Just cobbled up something that may or may not be similar to what you describe as your ship and pitted it against my everyday Krait Mk.II in Coriolis.

Straight head to head, I strip your shields faster than Coriolis can count, and kill your hull within 43 seconds - without even deploying my fighter.
You, on the other hand, would need almost three minutes to crack miy shileds, and another three minutes agaionst my armour - if Coriolis is right.

FAS : Krait Mk.II

I didn't put any engineering onto the hull, though, so your hull might be tougher. On the other hand, that Krait could be a lot tougher if I used the unused (in that build) mission specific slots for shields and/or armor. I don't know how well a FdL compares against a Mk.II, but just losing in a specialist build does not imply that your opponent is cheating.
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My build has a few MRPs and all armour is mostly G4/5'd (I think!). It probably works better on paper, and honestly it was more built in protest of all those shield tank FdLs I keep seeing (can't stand that ship for that reason, which is a pity as it's evidently a good one). It's a bit of a risky endeavour I know that, and I'm relying on my evasion skills also. Wouldn't normally pit it against a Krait to be fair, as I know how tough those can be, especially with an SLF.

Also just for the record - I'm a complete PvP noob and usually only engage in it passively, hence my OP.
 

Deleted member 182079

D
ADAMtheWELSHMANz said:
Did you save the video?

Saves a lot of guesswork, and a replay mighy show something you missed during the heat of battle.

Otherwise it's all speculation (lotta that around here today) 😀
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As I said, unfortunately not - I don't record my game as I don't usually find it necessary, it was more of a general question whether my assumptions may make sense (not the cheating one, but whether phasing sequence is basically useless in PvP).
 

Deleted member 182079

D
Spike K said:
I wonder if posting something like their Inara ranking would be considered enough info to qualify as 'name/shame'.
Doubt they even have one. eh?

\\///
Oo

Spike.k
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Honestly, they most likely played fair - I've been accused of cheating myself flying a hulltank AspX before so want to be extra careful accusing others of it unless I'm close to 100% sure it wasn't just some lag, or the at times ridiculous imbalances we love Elite for.
 

Deleted member 182079

D
rOmiLaYu said:
An FDL is going to have north of 1K worth of sheilds and if they had any HRP's, you're not going to see much damage from pulse lasers. Phasing sequencing, to me, has always been a bit of a disappointment. It sounds sexy, but it never really delivers much hull damage through sheilds....especially if the sheilds are high volume. I suspect you didn't bring enough gun to the fight, more so than anything else.
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It seems to work pretty well against NPC's but yeah I know CMDRs and their engineering are a different world. It was more an experiment than anything else, as I said it looked pretty neat on paper.
 

Deleted member 182079

D
Morbad said:
Fairly easy to get ~2.3k armor into a shield focused FDL, making phasing questionable unless you know they've neglected hull.

I would have expected some hull damage to register from even a small number of hits, but there are many possible explanations for it not.
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You're probably right... god I hate these bloody FdLs even more now:mad:
 

rOmiLaYu

rOmiLaYu
ObiW said:
It seems to work pretty well against NPC's but yeah I know CMDRs and their engineering are a different world. It was more an experiment than anything else, as I said it looked pretty neat on paper.
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Yeah, I made what I thought was sure to be an absolute murder boat out of an FDL with engineered frags, rails, and PA's. It was worse DPS than my beam-fit Corvette. Turns out DPS only goes up when you are on target. Again, good idea...on paper. Keep trying, you'll find something that works for you, but I'd avoid the phasing sequence.
 

Phisto Sobanii

Phisto Sobanii
ObiW said:
You're probably right... god I hate these bloody FdLs even more now:mad:
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The FDL with prismatic shields and heavy armor underneath is one of my favorite builds. It's very resistant to phasing damage. Like Morbad said it's odd no damage registered on the hull, but without the video I think it's relatively safe to give them benefit of the doubt.

I'd recommend considering four PAs on that FAS of yours. Two large with thermal conduit and then TLB and dispersal on the mediums is very effective. IIRC, one of my favorite builds was efficient on the larges and then short range blaster on the mediums. Help you get that heat up so you can really hurt.
 
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Bigmaec

Bigmaec
As someone regularly using both phasing and a dual-hrp prismatic FdL I call bullsh*t.
No bleed-through with 4 phasing (absolute!) weapons is very unlikely.

I can imagine only two reasons:

cheating and a very borked connection where you don't hit at all.

OP: if possible always record those encounters, to have some proof.
 

Deleted member 182079

D
Phisto Sobanii said:
The FDL with prismatic shields and heavy armor underneath is one of my favorite builds. It's very resistant to phasing damage. Like Morbad was said it's odd no damage registered on the hull, but without the video I think it's relatively safe to give them benefit of the doubt.

I'd recommend considering four PAs on that FAS of yours. Two large with thermal conduit and then TLB and dispersal on the mediums is very effective. IIRC, one of my favorite builds was efficient on the larges and then short range blaster on the mediums. Help you get that heat up so you can really hurt.
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Yeah think I'll reserve phasing to PvE from now on. I actually have that PA loadout on my FGS (PvE only), 5 PAs and 2 Rails with a fixed beam SLF to chase and melt shields. So much fun but again pretty useless against player ships as the FGS is too slow.

Another reason I experimented with Pulses is because I want to practice more with fixed weapons, and I had PAs on quite a few of ships in my fleet already - given I'm playing with a XBox pad fixed weaponry is proving to be difficult (so sensitive) but want to keep at it. Definitely landed quite a few hits earlier despite that so am not giving up. But am not expecting to win any fights anytime soon - but yeah the complete lack of hull damage was a bit discouraging alright.
 

Phisto Sobanii

Phisto Sobanii
Phasing PAs might be a good compromise. Go all in on that and you can cause some real issues.

Keep at it with the fixed stuff. I still use a controller and I've gotten pretty good with PAs and fixed multis (right?!). I'm getting back into pulse lasers now. Rails still need a lot of work, but that's always true if you don't commit to it.
 
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