Have PvP'ers Dealt a Fatal Blow to Elite Dangerous?
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This game absolutely panders to pvp players - except there is a lack of wing content. Almost every decision has been pvp and combat related since the start.
If this were about Solo players we'd have seen
1) A trading interface update
2) Exploration content, missions and updates beyond honk jump honk jump
3) More things like the barnacles out there
4) More AI based help, missions and content.
They NEED people to tow the line PVP and within the community to keep this game alive right now UNTIL they put 1-4 into place.
Lets just hope 2.4 is a doozy for us explorers. If its another combat update I'm gonna throw up.
If this were about Solo players we'd have seen
1) A trading interface update
2) Exploration content, missions and updates beyond honk jump honk jump
3) More things like the barnacles out there
4) More AI based help, missions and content.
They NEED people to tow the line PVP and within the community to keep this game alive right now UNTIL they put 1-4 into place.
Lets just hope 2.4 is a doozy for us explorers. If its another combat update I'm gonna throw up.
For a lot of people, the key feature of this game was the 1to1 Galaxy model.........but you know? It really is pointless other than as a tech demo......it is too big to be a "Game level"........we cant even set up stations out there I mean, is'nt there enough space or something?.......and wasn't it the "competitive crowd" that said no to this as they were worried that OTHER people would gain a seriously unfair advantage...in Open? maybe...in Solo??????.........see my point? the game is being designed around what the PvP combative crowd want....and not want a bunch of science fiction fans wanted.........
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And please understand I only ever played in Solo..........please try and see it from the point of view of others..........let me explain how crazy I think this is with another example.....
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Imagine if Call of Duty or Battlefield franchise said......"For our next game, we are going to build The Earth and you can go anywhere in the world you like, 1to1 accuracy of buildings and trees.....there will be specific areas where wars are going on".......WOW, we would all say....we might imagine fighting the great battles again, and then smaller wars that WE set up in other/random places on the planet....but when the game is finally released........the main battles are going on in only a small area like Ukraine or Iraq......and the rest of the world was just a model, that you could walk to and look at, but nothing ever happens there...........Then the developer comes out and says But there is MORE to come....so, we hang around to see what comes next, and then the next Season arrives..........they have added the worlds Oil Refineries,.....and done a HUGE amount of combat work in to the official battle areas, new weapons, new aircraft, tweaks to weapons, a new spells system that lets you adapt your weapons, better explosion and bullet effects, etc etc..................... and the rest of the earth remains just a model that no one ever sees or can do anything with.......
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That was my thing, I want to go out there and DO STUFF......find a good ring system, build up my own mining platform/business, make my billions, invite other miners to come, hire truckers to carry the minerals and hire security to...., etc etc etc expand and build in to the Galaxy............nope, cannt do anything like that out there.....so, it really is pointless......Have we even seen .1% of the galaxy model yet?...............So because of the PVP mantra, that galaxy model is really pointless........
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And here we are with the latest update,....still no moves in that direction, in fact, going opposite to what I hoped it would go.............. And we see the complaint threads come up....about 95% complaining about Combat issues?......
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So, ....Frontier is going to have to GIT MONEY from somewhere else...........
You're barking at the wrong tree. In my experience, the "carebears" (sorry) in this game are usually also the loudest group who speak against player owned bases and stuff like that.
Their trademark slogan: "Because ED is not Eve!"
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OP is totally wrong , PVPers have nothing to do with that, most players are against selling ships and weapons, this is why I don't play Star Citizen that much, I didn't feel like spending hundreds euros for a decent ship, so I bought the crappiest one just to try the game, see where they are now? They don't even have the basic game done ...
However this post is not about Star C. so I'll go back on topic, PVPers don't represent the players base in any way, people are not quitting cause of the grind, the grind was there before 2.1 , now it is less grindy cause missions worth more than farming ships at a res site, if it depended on me, I would remove ships from res sites and haz completely cause I consider that part a design flaw, bounty hunters are supposed to hunt down pirates in sc, not shoot fishes in a barrel, res sites should be for miners and pirates in that area should be much much less and pirate appearance should be random and very low chances to happen.
As for the 13 yo boy crying playing 2.1 LOL, there must be something else, if you cry at that age for a game there is a problem, however I suggested for him to change tactic, the game is no longer a shoot fish in a barrel type game, now fishes are sharks with big teeth, finally, many of us have been waiting for that for so long you can't even imagine.
You don't like combat ? Do trading, I do trading a lot when I can't find some combat mission and sometimes I prefer trading rather than do combat, trading missions are profitable and fun, also the the number of ships interdicting you is not always that high, there are runs I don't encounter any pirate at all, some where I get interdicted. Alternatively you can do smuggling runs which are more risky but still profitable
You don't like trading ? Explore, it is very profitable, a good fitted ship is all you need, go explore, land on some planet, have fun !
FD doesn't need to listen to PVPers, my impression is that they sometimes listen to community suggestions but most of the time they design new features and tune the game following their own vision.
However this post is not about Star C. so I'll go back on topic, PVPers don't represent the players base in any way, people are not quitting cause of the grind, the grind was there before 2.1 , now it is less grindy cause missions worth more than farming ships at a res site, if it depended on me, I would remove ships from res sites and haz completely cause I consider that part a design flaw, bounty hunters are supposed to hunt down pirates in sc, not shoot fishes in a barrel, res sites should be for miners and pirates in that area should be much much less and pirate appearance should be random and very low chances to happen.
As for the 13 yo boy crying playing 2.1 LOL, there must be something else, if you cry at that age for a game there is a problem, however I suggested for him to change tactic, the game is no longer a shoot fish in a barrel type game, now fishes are sharks with big teeth, finally, many of us have been waiting for that for so long you can't even imagine.
You don't like combat ? Do trading, I do trading a lot when I can't find some combat mission and sometimes I prefer trading rather than do combat, trading missions are profitable and fun, also the the number of ships interdicting you is not always that high, there are runs I don't encounter any pirate at all, some where I get interdicted. Alternatively you can do smuggling runs which are more risky but still profitable
You don't like trading ? Explore, it is very profitable, a good fitted ship is all you need, go explore, land on some planet, have fun !
FD doesn't need to listen to PVPers, my impression is that they sometimes listen to community suggestions but most of the time they design new features and tune the game following their own vision.
*doubletake* Wait, what?
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... and it's not.
Maybe they mean in a risk vs. reward kind of way? [blah]
That's not the point though.
OP was saying player owned bases and stuff aren't in the game mainly due the PVPers insistence, or because FDEV caters to them.
When in fact the PVPers are usually the ones who have least problems with these ideas.
I read that too, and decided specifically not to reply to it.
See, boringnick stated that as the main sentiment against player owned bases. The actual arguments are quite more elaborate than that.
By reacting to the bait, you just 'defended' the strawman he set up, so now his 'claim' it's the main argument is acknowledged.
I have participated in a number of these threads and I'm sure I read quite a few arguments against player owned bases.
Added to that, I never played EVE.
So your: "it's not" should refer to "Their trademark slogan:".
This is all besides the fact there are many PvP players who wouldn't like to see player owned bases.
And this all nicely illustrated the PvE/PvP devide only exists in the minds of those who feel one is superiour to the other.
This is more accurate, except for the "and stuff".
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You almost have me convinced, except that all I have to do is remember how often wing fights are ruined or rendered impossible by instancing to know that if it was as you say, this would have been fixed.
I didn't actually see anything about bases in the original post, maybe it came later, or maybe I scanned too quickly. Either way, you're right. PvPers aren't the reason we don't have them, nor are PvEers. It's really coz fDev doesn't believe they fit in with the "one man in a spaceship, no guilds etc" concept. I agree with fDev on this one. I'm betting you don't.
I always was a sucker for a good bait.
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Just to play devil's advocate FD have said no to player owned STATIONS however I believe they said small hollowed out asteroids and little moon bases to park our ships which can be our own are on the cards? Don't ask me for a reference however but I think it was mentioned in a dev diary.
Mind you that was around the time where I was expecting small planet bases controlled by AI to dynamically expand and die off "live" on the server rather than manually curated on server downtime so maybe this has been dropped now (or perhaps it was in my head ) either way it's not a PvE or PvP thing
Mind you that was around the time where I was expecting small planet bases controlled by AI to dynamically expand and die off "live" on the server rather than manually curated on server downtime so maybe this has been dropped now (or perhaps it was in my head
) either way it's not a PvE or PvP thing"One man in a spaceship, no guilds, etc......"
Sorry, that hasn't been FDev's policy for a long, long time. Player factions came in a while ago, they just aren't well supported, and now we're having elections to see which amongst the most popular gets made into an official, sanctioned faction in the game with full participation in the BGS.
Try to keep up with the times. FDev is years ahead of you, and that's pretty sad considering they're usually years behind everyone else.
http://email-elitedangerous.com/3F35-8LOE-61330U8708/cr.aspx
I am pretty sure the only reason for the lack of player bases etc. is the online architecture (P2P).
If it would have been possible to add this feature on the cheap, without using beeefed up servers, it would be in it. FDEV's adertising is all over the place. They target in one way or another the soloers, the pvpers, the carebears, the pkillers, the mmo crowd, the single player crowd... Just look at the homepage, and especially the early marketing ("Massive MMO!"). It's not a single coherent vision (as seen by all the complaints from many different, opposing, sides), but a try to get as many people as possible.
They would have no qualms trying to target the empire builder crowd as well if that would be possible with the current tech they have.
If it would have been possible to add this feature on the cheap, without using beeefed up servers, it would be in it. FDEV's adertising is all over the place. They target in one way or another the soloers, the pvpers, the carebears, the pkillers, the mmo crowd, the single player crowd... Just look at the homepage, and especially the early marketing ("Massive MMO!"). It's not a single coherent vision (as seen by all the complaints from many different, opposing, sides), but a try to get as many people as possible.
They would have no qualms trying to target the empire builder crowd as well if that would be possible with the current tech they have.
Sick burn.
FD's, or rather Braben's vision is not opposed to guilds. It's opposed to guilds being able to strong arm lesser guilds or solo players through in game mechanics. This still hasn't changed. The player factions can push the BGS around, but not other players. There's no direct control over docking permissions for instance. No direct influence in setting commodity market prices.
Which I feel is rather clever, since guilds are a good thing for a game. Gives the player demographics some colour. From the Fuel Rats to SDC, they all play their part. Guilds being able to boss others around, or getting guild specific advantages are not in the game, and are a part of the vision I hope that will always be kept.
Another thing that really needs to be kept out is money making structures. Getting rewarded for going offline for a day, coming back, and well done not playing CMDR!
Which I feel is rather clever, since guilds are a good thing for a game. Gives the player demographics some colour. From the Fuel Rats to SDC, they all play their part. Guilds being able to boss others around, or getting guild specific advantages are not in the game, and are a part of the vision I hope that will always be kept.
Another thing that really needs to be kept out is money making structures. Getting rewarded for going offline for a day, coming back, and well done not playing CMDR!
DB's quote that people keep misusing as his ultimatum against player factions has a context that people like to ignore because it allows them to use the quote to serve their own agendas. At the time DB made the statement that he didn't want player guilds it was implied that the guilds would be like EvE corporations. I don't know what kind of trauma DB had with EvE but he has a strong aversion to making anything similar to how things function in that other game, so he made a "no" statement that was worded a bit awkwardly in the specific context and in reference people have misinterpreted it ever since because that's what the internet is best at doing.
I will concede that DB's stance was staunchly against anything player group oriented for a long time because he didn't see how it could turn out to be anything but problematic given the open PvP elements. He started to change his mind around Summer of 2015 though, because the community was doing it's own thing and showing that you can have organized groups without having Megacoalitions like the Goonswarm take over your game. I also think that some of the other devs warmed him up to the idea through explaining what they can do and how it would be beneficial to the game.
Either way, DB did start out taking a hard line against the idea because he got a funny notion that we'd see the repetition of what people consider to be a bad element of another game be copied into ED by means of lowest common denomination of human behavior. Truth is this was never possible due to how the game works, and he realized this and changed his mind. Now we have player groups and other things that were said will never be seen in the game and other concessions to community enrichment will be coming in the future, because the response to all of these additions has been overwhelmingly positive.
I was honestly impressed that DB changed his mind about the subject given some of the statements he made but now my only complaint is that the features aren't being added fast enough.
I am not sure if you noticed, but 2.0 was an exploration update.
Engineers 2.1 has a lot of good stuff for explorers too.
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