Horizons/Odyssey client unification?

Stealthie

Stealthie
Obviously, there's been a lot of threads about this over the last few days but I can't help wondering if people haven't thought this through properly.

Basically, how were people expecting for Horizons and Odyssey to work together in the same client?

I mean, a Horizons player and an Odyssey player wing-up, fly down to a planet surface and... then what?

Can't even recall if base-game and Horizons players could instance together (I don't think they did) but the game dodged the issue by having all(?) Horizons content take place in locations that base-game players couldn't access.
It's not like a base-game player could ever visit a planet surface or see an engineer base so there was almost no conflict.
About the only issue was whether or not base-game players could see/buy/fly Horizons ships.

Odyssey has some similar exclusive areas, such as station and outpost interiors but a honking great chunk of Odyssey takes place in the shared environment of planet surfaces.
How is/was that ever supposed to work?
If Horizons and Odyssey players can see each other's ships then they need to be destructable in order to prevent shenanigans and if they're destructable then it creates the likelihood of Horizons players having their ships destroyed by Odyssey players they can't see.

FDev have, apparently, said they're going to unify the clients when the console versions of Odyssey arrive but I bet there's going to be a lot of brainstorming at FDev HQ to figure out how to make it work.
Honestly, I can see the game running from a single client but I can see Horizons and Odyssey players never being able to instance together.

Anybody care to take a stab at explaining how it all might be made to work?
 

GroG79

G
I think the elephant in the room is: "Why was the new eye candy and planet generation for Horizons 'delayed' "
I think EDH and console are given the same treatment for 'reasons'

Doubt we will get an answer tho :D My guess is that it is just less work/testing if it is handled this way.
 

LeoBartlet

LeoBartlet
Stealthie said:
Anybody care to take a stab at explaining how it all might be made to work?
Click to expand...

We've all be discussing it in depth over here....

Horizons / Odyssey Compatibility

91! You can almost smell it now ... The devs must be terrible people if they can't even manage to give us free stuffs for Horizons right away! I've said it before and I'll say it again, I know much much more about game design.
forums.frontier.co.uk forums.frontier.co.uk

Come give us a visit.
 

Para Handy

Para Handy
Stealthie said:
......

Can't even recall if base-game and Horizons players could instance together (I don't think they did) ......
Click to expand...

Of course they could.

Base game players couldn't (and still cannot) land on planets - other Horizons stuff was gated.

After the console release Horizons players will not be able to land on atmo-planets nor go walkies - there is no reason that they could not have the same restrictions before that. F D just decided that the lighting, graphics changes, etc in EDO will not be extended to Horizons prior to the console release. F D have not stated why this is so, some people think it is for PEGI rating reasons (but that seems daft to me), others think it is because of the required PC specs for EDO - me, I think it is a ploy to encourage EDO purchase by Horizons players.
 

Murfelton

M
Para Handy said:
Of course they could.

Base game players couldn't (and still cannot) land on planets - other Horizons stuff was gated.

After the console release Horizons players will not be able to land on atmo-planets nor go walkies - there is no reason that they could not have the same restrictions before that. F D just decided that the lighting, graphics changes, etc in EDO will not be extended to Horizons prior to the console release. F D have not stated why this is so, some people think it is for PEGI rating reasons (but that seems daft to me), others think it is because of the required PC specs for EDO - me, I think it is a ploy to encourage EDO purchase by Horizons players.
Click to expand...
The old split was straightforward: Horizons specific content was gated by planetary landing.

Now, Odyssey-specific content is only mechanically gated on tenuous atmospheres - Odyssey specific content can be on airless planets that Horizons players can also access.
 

Murfelton

M
Para Handy said:
i.e. Advanced Planetary Landing Suite (not available to Horizons players)

So you agree with me then, no reason to not update Horizons lighting etc .... ;)
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If it is necessary for people to lower their graphical settings to get the same rate in Odyssey - or worse yet, an inability for the minimum spec machine to run the new engine - changing to the new engine would be a disaster. (Changing minimum specs makes it effectively impossible.)

I don’t know if that is what happened, but it is an obvious possibility.
 

Crumly

C
GroG79 said:
I think the elephant in the room is: "Why was the new eye candy and planet generation for Horizons 'delayed' "
I think EDH and console are given the same treatment for 'reasons'

Doubt we will get an answer tho :D My guess is that it is just less work/testing if it is handled this way.
Click to expand...
i hope its because horizons players aren't paying for anything. even horizons is free now
 

Ian Doncaster

Ian Doncaster
Stealthie said:
Odyssey has some similar exclusive areas, such as station and outpost interiors but a honking great chunk of Odyssey takes place in the shared environment of planet surfaces.
How is/was that ever supposed to work?
If Horizons and Odyssey players can see each other's ships then they need to be destructable in order to prevent shenanigans and if they're destructable then it creates the likelihood of Horizons players having their ships destroyed by Odyssey players they can't see.
Click to expand...
I'm not sure I see what the problem is here.

The Horizons client can still have the models for infantry in it, so Horizons players will be able to see the Odyssey players shooting at them, and even fire back, without the Horizons players being able to walk themselves (in the same way that a basic player can still be shot at by Horizons-only ships [1], is not immune to weapon experimentals, etc.).

Stealthie said:
Can't even recall if base-game and Horizons players could instance together (I don't think they did)
Click to expand...
There was no problem at all with this, outside the exclusion zone. Well, no more than any instancing is on an "if it feels like it" basis.

[1] Including Thargoids, which can shoot at you just fine if you only play the basic game, but for which you need Horizons for all ways to effectively fire back.
 

MickyG1982

M
Para Handy said:
Of course they could.

Base game players couldn't (and still cannot) land on planets - other Horizons stuff was gated.

After the console release Horizons players will not be able to land on atmo-planets nor go walkies - there is no reason that they could not have the same restrictions before that. F D just decided that the lighting, graphics changes, etc in EDO will not be extended to Horizons prior to the console release. F D have not stated why this is so, some people think it is for PEGI rating reasons (but that seems daft to me), others think it is because of the required PC specs for EDO - me, I think it is a ploy to encourage EDO purchase by Horizons players.
Click to expand...

I would guess that FD noticed that many of their players don't run massively powerful systems and are indeed hovering around the minimum spec for Horizons. Releasing the new planetary tech as it was in the beta would most likely bring those systems to their knees making the game unplayable.

Its the same way for vanilla / horizons where a lesser (often below minimum spec) pc can run ED but really struggle with EDH.
 

Chorda

Chorda
My guess is it'll go something like this

instancing.jpg
 
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Stealthie

Stealthie
Ian Doncaster said:
I'm not sure I see what the problem is here.

The Horizons client can still have the models for infantry in it, so Horizons players will be able to see the Odyssey players shooting at them, and even fire back, without the Horizons players being able to walk themselves (in the same way that a basic player can still be shot at by Horizons-only ships [1], is not immune to weapon experimentals, etc.).


There was no problem at all with this, outside the exclusion zone. Well, no more than any instancing is on an "if it feels like it" basis.

[1] Including Thargoids, which can shoot at you just fine if you only play the basic game, but for which you need Horizons for all ways to effectively fire back.
Click to expand...

I guess that'd work, although I wonder if FDev would be okay with the idea of Horizons players being able to inflict themselves on Odyssey gameplay (from their cockpits) without having to buy Odyssey.

OTOH, it'd also mean that Horizons owners would probably need an Odyssey-capable PC in order to keep playing due to the likelihood of encountering Odyssey stuff on planets, which Horizons players might not be keen on.
 

Ian Doncaster

Ian Doncaster
Stealthie said:
I guess that'd work, although I wonder if FDev would be okay with the idea of Horizons players being able to inflict themselves on Odyssey gameplay (from their cockpits) without having to buy Odyssey.
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Other than bombing CZs (which they need to come up with some sort of fix for anyway, somehow, because that's also a problem when done by someone who does have Odyssey) there's not a lot of interesting stuff you can do from your ship to Odyssey-specific content.

The salvage sites are designed to have bits for both SRV and on foot so I'm sure they're not going to mind Horizons players showing up, doing the SRV bit, and having the contents of a crate remain just out of reach.

Stealthie said:
OTOH, it'd also mean that Horizons owners would probably need an Odyssey-capable PC in order to keep playing due to the likelihood of encountering Odyssey stuff on planets, which Horizons players might not be keen on.
Click to expand...
If they can get it working on consoles it'll probably be acceptable on a Horizons-spec PC as well. And if they can't get it working on consoles they've got bigger problems.

(And it's mainly the planet generation itself which seems to be the issue there, which they need to solve even if they weren't going to allow instancing)
 

Susanna

Susanna
GroG79 said:
Then the devs do not need to maintain the code anymore. The knife cuts on both sides.
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While that is essentially true, people still use the base game launcher from time to time (usually to get unstuck on the surface). Hence, the base game needs to be maintained as a discreet game.
 

Sakashiro

Sakashiro
Susanna said:
While that is essentially true, people still use the base game launcher from time to time (usually to get unstuck on the surface). Hence, the base game needs to be maintained as a discreet game.
Click to expand...
Horizons and the base game have been using the same client for years. After the merge in autumn, the Odyssey client will be able to run in Horizons mode and in base game mode.
 

Susanna

Susanna
Sakashiro said:
Horizons and the base game have been using the same client for years. After the merge in autumn, the Odyssey client will be able to run in Horizons mode and in base game mode.
Click to expand...
I'm very glad that we will not be loosing the base game option from the launcher in the 'Autumn'...
 
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