how does ED compare to SC ?

[SAB380]

I had a much longer post but decided against it ....not necessary.

I'll just say that I hope that SC fans who currently like Chris Robert's long detailed explanations regarding the delays continue to be understanding in 12+ months time when those explanations are still being given.

 

[Gibbonici]

Yes, however the developers seem to be keeping the hype high to encourage donations, that is the cause of the discontent. They need to lay off the marketing for a while and be seen to be focusing on production more.

Absolutely. The trouble with hype is that it builds unrealistic expectations, and when perfectly decent but overhyped games comes out they invariably get trashed by players and press alike.

 

[SlimExpert]

A few people have come up with flyable SC ships outside of the garage, at least the second video is.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0fEsQ_ke28

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n3Fpw0jmhhc

The second video does indeed look fun! I knew folks were extracting the models from the Hangar module, this guy went a whole bigger step. Can't wait for ED to get landing on planets. The only thing, I hope (a really big hope) that ED ships have better visibility than the SC ship in that video.

Now SC has 3rd person view (according to CR in the Alpha Dog Fight video just prior to Christmas) but, ED has no plans for 3rd person. The current ED alpha shows very good visibility, I hope that applies to all ships.

It will be a shame if SC players don't get to actually fly around planets, just a sort of in engine animation between planet places and orbit. I truly want to fly around the 1 trillion planets / moons (assumes 10 planets / moons per star)

SlimExpert

 

[Jezzah]

I had a much longer post but decided against it ....not necessary.

I'll just say that I hope that SC fans who currently like Chris Robert's long detailed explanations regarding the delays continue to be understanding in 12+ months time when those explanations are still being given.

I think many of us backers of SC could write very long posts across the whole spectrum of annoyance/discontent to hope/faith, i know i could in any case

They simply have to NAY it is imperative to the project that the DFM module be utterly peerless in its release, they have so much to prove that to do otherwise would be a massive blow and a real kick in the teeth to the backers.

This is a shame as they really ought to be releasing an alpha with the usual bugs and stuff but they have hyped themselves too much and said too much to now do anything like that.

ED has really set the bar that SC has to climb in terms of its competitor(s) but the main bar they have to climb has been self-made and i'm not sure they can top it.

 

[Memnoch]

Are there any plans for SPL in SC? It should be doable with the amount of staff and money they have.

 

[Jezzah]

Are there any plans for SPL in SC? It should be doable with the amount of staff and money they have.

i believe so

but then sometimes to listen to the dev's over there they are also going to be coding in the second coming of jesus christ at the next stretch goal

 

[Mazhurg]

Disclaimer - I sponsored SC to the Rear Admiral level.

What I see on that side right now are overreach, lack of focus, desire to please (i.e. 3rd person view) and quite a bit of instancing "Eve-like" behaviour (gates, railroads, kill boxes).

While the initial vision still stand, it is getting diluted to the point were it will soon be unrecognizable.

Yep, the pretties are very pretty and hopefully the game will be just as detailed and complete, but my confidence factor is starting to dip.

Anyway, I'll sit back and wait to see what comes. However, other than the JP subscription the funds are cut until said confidence is restored.

 

[Jezzah]

You know I hope its just my eyesight or something but I dont think SC looks all that pretty at the moment - just watched the Live steam stuff from the DFM "reveal" before xmas and i wasnt that impressed at all, looked really washed out and well....boring.

ED wins for me again i think.

 

[rgb_astro]

It will be a shame if SC players don't get to actually fly around planets, just a sort of in engine animation between planet places and orbit. I truly want to fly around the 1 trillion planets / moons (assumes 10 planets / moons per star)

SlimExpert

There's no shame in something CR/CIG has no control over. They can push CryEngine only so far. I bet with high degree of confidence that CryEngine's next reincarnation will feature much more expansive maps/arenas with some degree of allowing developers to implement procedural generation. But since it's something in the works, CR couldn't wait for it, so he licenced current version.

 

[Pyros]

Are there any plans for SPL in SC? It should be doable with the amount of staff and money they have.

AFAIK No.

And I believe it is not even possible due to Cry Engine limitations. Of course that engine evolve (specially if heavily modded), but SPL would require extensive PG and proper algorithms, something that is hard to plug in easily).

ED is a full multiplayer universe simulator (well, I hope). SC is a detailed multiplayer space game, that is based on crafted "pockets" in multiple environments (space POIs), stations, ships and planets. You cannot free roam in the same sense.

 

[rgb_astro]

Are there any plans for SPL in SC? It should be doable with the amount of staff and money they have.

Do you mean Single Player Leaderboards? Or Seamless Possibilities of Lagrange? If either, I cannot help you.

If it is seamless planetary landings, then it's not possible tech wise. Basically, seamless world in SC will very much depend on suspension of disbelief, i.e. when you move from area to area (either dynamically created for quests or static like stations or POIs on planets) you essentially move from one arena to another. Space will not be seamless as in ED or SpaceEngine.

 

[Dunk]

ED Kickstarter page says "Release date: March 2014"
How you think the single player combat alpha is anywhere close to that release version, coming in 2 months? Show me stations, the whole universe to travel around and at least 10 ship interiors and exteriors, and a hangar where my ships will be docked. What you are seeing now in the "alpha" is a tech demo.

SC has 18 months, ED has 2 months. Let´s wait and see.

I'm not sure what your motive for this assault is. Frontier have done the sensible thing and released a working demo.

Let me address your items one by one :-
The whole universe is a procedural thing.
The stations at launch are a distinct set of exterior designs.
10 Ship exteriors at launch are a distinct set of exterior designs and we've seen these for several ships already.
10 Ship interiors was not promised at launch time except for the view from the captain's chair.

All this is very achievable. Firstly because the alpha "demo" (I'm happy to agree that it is an alpha demo and not an alpha "release") is solid. As a developer, this tells me that they are only showing you the solid stuff. This means that they didn't show you something that was 90% complete. So yeah, I'm prepared to consider that the items they need ready for launch are somewhere up to 90% complete. Also, for release, the hardest thing they needed to complete is what is in the demo/alpha. Skins for some ships and stations is hardly taxing.

And lastly, you count now to March as 2 months. This tells me that you are wilfully looking for them to fail, since a March release could equally be a shade short of 3 months away.

Right now, if I were a a sad bitter person intent on Elite being the product to go for, I'd be straight over to the SC forums and would be rubbing their faces in it and looking to get as many people to switch 'sides' as possible. I'm not though, as I want both to be a success. I want them both to be good games with a different flavour.

 

[Jezzah]

Do you mean Single Player Leaderboards? Or Seamless Possibilities of Lagrange? If either, I cannot help you.

If it is seamless planetary landings, then it's not possible tech wise. Basically, seamless world in SC will very much depend on suspension of disbelief, i.e. when you move from area to area (either dynamically created for quests or static like stations or POIs on planets) you essentially move from one arena to another. Space will not be seamless as in ED or SpaceEngine.

Clearly means Scottish Premier League!

Nah Im sure i heard that long haired goof dev that appears on Wing-mans Hangar talking about the possibility of doing seamless landings and take offs and he was all over the idea like a tramp on chips. But I might be totally wrong there.

 

[SAB380]

Both games are going for an enormous reach.

For all the talk of SC reaching too far, Elite: Dangerous is reaching further.
Its just that we've seen Mr Braben do it before with Frontier Elite 2 so Elite4 seems very possible.

Mostly, I'm just shocked that Elite: Dangerous seems to be on schedule.

I had an initial estimate of a 6-12 month delay on Elite and 12 to 18 months on SC.

Hence although I'm a backer of SC, I don't care at all that the hanger module and Dogfighting modules are buggy and delayed. I doubt I will play on launch either in early to mid 2015 considering how buggy it will still likely be.

Elite Dangerous I skipped the alpha and had planned to skip the beta's....although am reconsidering joining the beta now if things are as stable as the alpha. We'll see....

I am very curious how long it will be before planetary landings are available in Elite since that will be the hardest part of what they're trying to achieve.

 

[Jezzah]

Betaaaaaa

do itttttt

 

[MxM]

I first stumbled across SC and was mega hyped and impressed and spent over $700 backing it. The hype train was so high and so many promises were laid out by Chris it was hard to resist.

A month ago I stumbled across Elite by accident and saw the capital ship trailer. I was instantly hit with joy, I don't know what it was, but everything felt consistent and polished. Then the alpha came out and I was floored (I have alpha access) and the feeling of being scammed by SC was growing inside me.

Another questionable act is the constant promises of new features. They are so obsessed with getting money now, that they will promise anything and everything to the community. The reality is that those stretch goals are turning into illusions. Where is the execution and core plan gone to?

In hindsight I would have loved to move my money across to ED, now that I see what is happening with SC. Chris has lied to the community, it's obvious they are so far behind schedule and are focusing on milking everyone.

The DFM demo was horrific. It looked like an absolute glitchy mess and this was supposed to come out in Dec? It's not even remotely close and he knew it months before hand. Even the asteroids and atmosphere looked really cheap.

I'm starting to believe that Chris has no clear vision or ability to manage a project this large and complex. The choice of selecting the Crysis engine was imo risky and is now proving to be a serious drain on progress. There has never been anything close to a sim made with that engine. It's great to showcase a hangar module with nice models (with fish tanks.. lol), but it's going to take serious work to make it even approach anything that the ED alpha has shown.

The other aspect of ED that I love, is the non down your throat marketing and hype. For example, there is no sexy lady draped in Star citizen merchandise and other questionable money making schemes.

FD is focused, has a tight team and is not outsourcing 90% of the work to random development houses. David has a clear vision and can execute it, in the end that's the difference that will make or break a game.

I predict ED will far surpass SC in both scope, fun, game play and overall gamer satisfaction.

 

[Pyros]

They need to have a working backend for 350,000 people with alpha slots which was neither planned nor expected. They could have hacked some code in to throw away later or do it right from the beginning. I prefer they do the right thing and not waste my backer money on temporary hacks to please some whining impatient teenagers. People don´t get the fact they are building a world wide server infrastructure in the size of any upcoming triple A MMO.
ED is a Peer2Peer game, so there is your difference.

The problem is having a proper netcode in place, as the original CryEngine netcode seems to be a little underwhelming for space games. Of course the technical infrastructure (DB, authentication, instance handling,... servers) takes time and expertise to design and implement, but it is too early for that.
But it is not AAA MMO level type of structure. Something good if you ask me

But you seem to be a little misinformed, as ED is not a Peer2Peer game. It uses P2P communication, but that is an optimization route.

ED Kickstarter page says "Release date: March 2014"
How you think the single player combat alpha is anywhere close to that release version, coming in 2 months? Show me stations, the whole universe to travel around and at least 10 ship interiors and exteriors, and a hangar where my ships will be docked. What you are seeing now in the "alpha" is a tech demo.

SC has 18 months, ED has 2 months. Let´s wait and see.

Using the same reference (KS promise), ES has 3 months and SC has 11 months (November 2014). I think it is pretty obvious that neither game will meet their original schedules, which is not really much of a surprise. I expect that ED to hit Gamma phase (for me, meeting the promise to backers) around May this year, while SC depends on the polish level - if polished I think no sooner than June 2015 is likely.

As a SC backer, I'm currently more concerned with overhype/excessive demands from the player base with corresponding promises and feature creep and Pay To Win - tbqh, while positive for the financing of the project, the extreme success of the piecemeal ship sales raise some concerns, hopefully without merit.

 

[Mazhurg]

Software project goal dates are just to make people feel better... like the tooth fairy.

 

[Elenoe]

So yeah, I'm prepared to consider that the items they need ready for launch are somewhere up to 90% complete. Also, for release, the hardest thing they needed to complete is what is in the demo/alpha. Skins for some ships and stations is hardly taxing.

Honestly, I disagree. Dogfighting is actually smaller part of the game. Even when big concepts are already designed (unlike SC, Braben actually did the great scope before so he has an idea how things need to be connected).

Even 3 months seem quite low if it should be complete and fun to play. However it will be reasonable if there is alpha version of free roaming in the completed Sol system with random NPC encounters before January ends. Without docking, inventory, equipment/fuel management, missions, story or friendly NPCs and such things. Just map, navigation and free flying around.

If this is delivered then March is remotely achievable. But the content is what usually takes as much time as the game development itself. Procedural universe is not answer to everything. Handy work is what counts. Procedural there is just adjustment, not merit of it.

My best estimates based on dev diaries, news and alpha (compared to all previous materials) is beta in april/may with release in second half June/begin of July.

 

[Jack Booted Thug]

I bet the devs roll their eyes at a lot of the ongoing speculation and treat it as a bit of an in house joke.

We don't really have any idea.