Hyperspace stutter

[Benny Mac]

I don't understand the replies that are along the lines of "Stuttering is understandable because your computer is so busy doing other stuff while playing the tunnel animation".

To me that sounds a bit like "It's impossible to fix. There's just no way it can be any other way than stutter-city-a-Rama".

Not buying that. It's only a question of prioritisation. If FD deemed it the most critical problem in the game then it'd surely be fixed. End of.

That it's been stuttering since, like ever, means they're cool with it. As pointed out above it's even evident in their public videos.

Personally, it really annoys me.

 

[OamodSias]

I don't understand the replies that are along the lines of "Stuttering is understandable because your computer is so busy doing other stuff while playing the tunnel animation".

To me that sounds a bit like "It's impossible to fix. There's just no way it can be any other way than stutter-city-a-Rama".

Not buying that. It's only a question of prioritisation. If FD deemed it the most critical problem in the game then it'd surely be fixed. End of.

That it's been stuttering since, like ever, means they're cool with it. As pointed out above it's even evident in their public videos.

Personally, it really annoys me.

There's a reason animated loading screens stutter.

Despite how gloriously fast our current SSD's are, drives are still too slow to run complicated calculations directly off of. When a game is loading, it is pulling information from the drive into memory. As a game loads, it is pulling all the information it needs off of the hard-drive, converting it into a useful state for the client and dumping it into memory. ED does this right at the beginning; you'll note the long load time when you enter the game (if not running an SSD). However, when you begin a transition between systems, the game needs to load more resources from the drive into memory, whilst freeing those resources it no longer uses (for example, it doesn't need to hold onto the earth planet textures if there are no earth-like planets in the system). It additionally needs to load the code that ensures all the astronomical entities are on their correct paths, it needs to prep the AI code (since the AI only spawn once you enter the system). It needs to load a thousand other things whilst simultaneously establishing a connection to another player who is in that system; or, if no player is in the system, it needs to set you up as the holder and relay this to the server so other players will connect to you when they join.

Considering all of this happens within the space of a few seconds, which results in stutter of a second or two - I'd say that's damn impressive.

"stutter-city-a-Rama" - it's really not that bad, lol.

 

[Wallbanger]

Aha so it's not just my machine doing it! Oh well. It's not game breaking but it is mildly annoying. I don't know if smooth transitions from one flight mode to another are possible but it would be nice.

 

[Cyranis]

a lot of mmo's got seamless zone transitions right, the tech is seemingly available. Perhaps not for a P2P model though.

 

[Ackoman]

You gave me no grounds to report you; so, no.

Oh well, some humourless so and so did!

 

[Aussiedroid]

I get this stutter too, and some pops in my sound.

 

[OamodSias]

Oh well, some humourless so and so did!

Some people are incapable of fighting their own battles.

 

[OamodSias]

This happens to me all the time. I especially love it when it happens just before you come out of frame shift. Causing my T9 to get caught in the gravity well, as I no longer have time to pull away from the star. This happened to me not 5 minutes ago. Repair bill, 740k credits. I've had it happen 5-10 times a day.. which is stupid expensive for a bug.
Also, my computer is top of the line, it's not like i'm running some 396 junk.

Spoiler

------------------System Information
------------------
Time of this report: 2/11/2015, 20:05:57
Machine name: ARCLIGHT
Operating System: Windows 8.1 Pro 64-bit (6.3, Build 9600) (9600.winblue_r3.140827-1500)
Processor: Intel(R) Core(TM) i5-4670K CPU @ 3.40GHz (4 CPUs), ~3.4GHz
Memory: 8192MB RAM
Available OS Memory: 8112MB RAM
Page File: 11425MB used, 7223MB available
---------------
Display Devices
---------------
Card name: AMD Radeon HD 7900 Series
Manufacturer: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc.
Chip type: AMD Radeon Graphics Processor (0x6798)
DAC type: Internal DAC(400MHz)
Device Type: Full Device
Device Key: Enum\PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_6798&SUBSYS_3000174B&REV_00
Display Memory: 9941 MB
Dedicated Memory: 6101 MB
Shared Memory: 3840 MB
Current Mode: 5916 x 1076 (32 bit) (60Hz)
Monitor Name: Generic PnP Monitor
Monitor Model: ASUS VN247
Monitor Id: ADVEF3D
Native Mode: 1920 x 1080(p) (60.000Hz)
Output Type: Displayport External

------------------------
Disk & DVD/CD-ROM Drives
------------------------
Drive: C:
Free Space: 22.1 GB
Total Space: 122.1 GB
File System: NTFS
Model: Samsung SSD 840 PRO Series


Drive: E:
Free Space: 394.9 GB
Total Space: 2861.5 GB
File System: NTFS
Model: ST3000DM001-1CH166


Drive: F:
Free Space: 857.2 GB
Total Space: 953.9 GB
File System: NTFS
Model: WDC WD1001FALS-19J7B0


Drive: H:
Free Space: 540.9 GB
Total Space: 953.7 GB
File System: NTFS
Model: WDC WD10EARS-00Y5B1


Drive: D:
Model: HL-DT-ST BD-RE WH16NS40
Driver: c:\windows\system32\drivers\cdrom.sys, 6.03.9600.16384 (English), 8/22/2013 03:46:35, 164352 bytes

Ah, AMD - there's your problem right there.

In all seriousness, I don't get any stuttering when exiting Shift; I'm running a similar setup only I've got a GTX 760 on ultra with supersampling set to 1.0x.
Try fiddling with settings to see if it still does it. If it does, then it's likely your connection. You could try opening up a UDP on port 5100 (there's a thread on here somewhere that tells you how, will try to find it if you need it); see if that helps.
Beyond that, I have no idea what could be causing the stutter.

 

[Cyranis]

My connection is solid. 50Mb. I'll try opening the port. I have an A rated connection. Low judder , stable ping.

 

[OamodSias]

My connection is solid. 50Mb. I'll try opening the port. I have an A rated connection. Low judder , stable ping.

I'm running off a puny little 1.5mb/s line (wireless as well).

You running an SSD?
Ah, I see you are - is the game stored on it though?

 

[Dannyc]

Since the update the stutter in these loading screens has all but gone (using 2x SSD - 1 store the entire game and 1 -OS separate ). It cant be made to fully dissapear as I presume thats down to the d/l connection as well which being in a barn n the middle of a field is not great.

 

[Cyranis]

Yes the game is on the SSD. I have a 1TB 850 Pro coming in the mail, maybe that will help, but it's sort of silly to expect that level of hardware. Also, im running 2x 7970's in crossfire. I've charted the bandwidth the game requires. It's pathetically small.

 

[OamodSias]

Yes the game is on the SSD. I have a 1TB 850 Pro coming in the mail, maybe that will help, but it's sort of silly to expect that level of hardware. Also, im running 2x 7970's in crossfire. I've charted the bandwidth the game requires. It's pathetically small.

I'm on an i5 3.5ghz, 8gb ram, 126gb Samsung 840 Pro with a GTX 760 through a 1.5mb/s line (HSPDA+ mobile band) and my only stutter is on Jump, so obviously your PC is capable of handling the game.

The only thing I can think of is the internet connection or your SSD isn't running up to scratch for some reason, other than that I'm all out of ideas, mate. Soz.

 

[Ekar]

There's a reason animated loading screens stutter.

Despite how gloriously fast our current SSD's are, drives are still too slow to run complicated calculations directly off of. When a game is loading, it is pulling information from the drive into memory. As a game loads, it is pulling all the information it needs off of the hard-drive, converting it into a useful state for the client and dumping it into memory. ED does this right at the beginning; you'll note the long load time when you enter the game (if not running an SSD). However, when you begin a transition between systems, the game needs to load more resources from the drive into memory, whilst freeing those resources it no longer uses (for example, it doesn't need to hold onto the earth planet textures if there are no earth-like planets in the system). It additionally needs to load the code that ensures all the astronomical entities are on their correct paths, it needs to prep the AI code (since the AI only spawn once you enter the system). It needs to load a thousand other things whilst simultaneously establishing a connection to another player who is in that system; or, if no player is in the system, it needs to set you up as the holder and relay this to the server so other players will connect to you when they join.

Considering all of this happens within the space of a few seconds, which results in stutter of a second or two - I'd say that's damn impressive.

"stutter-city-a-Rama" - it's really not that bad, lol.

Thanks for the clarification. Before the latest hotfix I was pretty frustrated with the hyperspace sequence as it was really stuttering bad, sound cutting out, obvious looping of sounds, even freezing up at times. But it's quite a bit better at the moment.

One thing I haven't been able to get info on is - why another break between supercruise and normal flight? The connections to other players should have been made by then, since you can see them in SC. Other games manage to be able to load in detailed assets at various lods, and the experience is quite smooth. Put another way, do you think this is possible at some point- or will we never get rid of that technical break between flight modes?

 

[OamodSias]

Thanks for the clarification. Before the latest hotfix I was pretty frustrated with the hyperspace sequence as it was really stuttering bad, sound cutting out, obvious looping of sounds, even freezing up at times. But it's quite a bit better at the moment.

One thing I haven't been able to get info on is - why another break between supercruise and normal flight? The connections to other players should have been made by then, since you can see them in SC. Other games manage to be able to load in detailed assets at various lods, and the experience is quite smooth. Put another way, do you think this is possible at some point- or will we never get rid of that technical break between flight modes?

I'm not quite sure what break you mean between SC and normal. I think you mean the drop out though.

This is likely due to the fact that everything in that zone you're dropping into needs to be rendered; hence why no stutter when dropping out in the middle of open space (nothing to render). The station, the planet(s) and moon(s), ships, players and their locations and so on need to be rendered and positioned. If I'm not mistaken, you can consider each drop out to be a localised "smaller" instance within the system instance; so you'll be experiencing unloading/loading of resources. This is just a guess though as I have no idea how they implemented it.

You'll also notice that, on approach to a planet, there may be some stutter, this is due to resource and texture loading (if you watch the planet, you might catch a glimpse of it going from bad quality to good quality).

Some games can load everything at once; I think in order for ED to load an entire star system into memory would simply require too much RAM and would prevent them from having clients with less capable machines. It could also be a simple design decision for technical or development reasons. I honestly don't know. Only FD can answer that.

All that said, it's entirely possible that the rendering of assets isn't that good; thus the stutter when approaching a planet, or the second or two pause between SC-space and normal-space. Or SC-space is a different instance to normal-space.


Think I need a disclaimer: This is all speculation drawn from career experience in software development. How it's actually done can only be clarified by an FDev.

 

[Ackoman]

Think I need a disclaimer: This is all speculation drawn from career experience in software development. How it's actually done can only be clarified by an FDev.

You've hit the nail on the head - my ambition when I started this thread was to get some sort of clarification from FD, because there are a lot of theories doing the rounds and it would be good to hear it from the horse's mouth.

 

[OamodSias]

You've hit the nail on the head - my ambition when I started this thread was to get some sort of clarification from FD, because there are a lot of theories doing the rounds and it would be good to hear it from the horse's mouth.

Found this:

Elite: Dangerous features dynamically created free roaming multiplayer instances, based on perception bubble, that are decoupled from the star systems themselves (but you can also play solo).
...
The server transparently creates free roaming sessions (instances) when meeting other players and NPCs within that galaxy based on a perception bubble around you, that is defined by your scanner/visual range. That means that those instances are not a fixed location in space as in most other MMOs, but they dynamically move around.
The effects of those instances are then stored on the central galaxy server and shared by everybody.
...
Because the game features very high speed twitch combat and very detailed damage models, this is the most reliable way to do it, also keep in mind there can be many sessions within a star system and those sessions can dynamically move around, also because this game uses a 1:1 scale Milky Way galaxy, sessions will typically be spread out much farther away (although most of the action will be within the core systems) and it wouldn't be immersion breaking as opposed to a space game in a smaller area.

- http://elite-dangerous.wikia.com/wiki/Elite:_Dangerous_FAQ

The stutter is, as I mentioned, caused by loading/unloading of assets, and instance changing. Each star system is an instance, and your perception bubble is an instance unto itself. Dropping out of SC likely puts you into another instance. Because your perception bubble is an instance unto itself which can freely move around the star system instance, there is no loading/unloading needed.

 

[Tiamat]

I had stuttering until I found this thread: https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=103962&p=1655628&viewfull=1#post1655628

Once I'd made the changes detailed in that post, all the glitches/stuttering went away (I have a Radeon R9 280 card). Maybe FD could take a look and fix it for everyone...

I tried that post too and whilst it improved my framerate overall (which is nice!) it had no effect on the HS animation at all. Only a 750Ti here though.

 

[Ackoman]

Anyone tried the new Nvidia drivers? Noticed some new ones came out a day or two ago.

 

[Lasse B.]

Putting the game onto a Ramdisk and running from it would be the fastest solution to load times as far as storage access times and throughput is concerned. Gonna test this tomorrow, although past experiments have shown that in practice there's hardly any difference between running a game from SSD vs running a game from Ramdisk.