I love E:D But really?

Ydiss

Ydiss
I miss the days when P2W actually meant something. Now it's just "if you have to buy something it's P2W".

Also, I don't think anyone should ever compare anything to what's gone on at SC. That's not even "Pay to play". It's not even out yet.

It's a legitimate question to ask why the Cobra MKV isn't out of early access yet. But we can just ask it without hyperbole.
 

Pville_Piper

Pville_Piper
The pay to win always slays me... None of these ships are overpowered.
  • The Python 2 is a great combat ship, can double as a daily mission runner, but is extremely limited because of a horrible internal layout and limited jump range. As a combat ship, it matches any other of the best medium combat ships but doesn't really beat them.
  • The T-8 is the best medium cargo hauler, but has extremely limited hardpoints, makes a poor miner and isn't the fastest either.
  • The Mandalay is almost overpowered... But somewhat limited in cargo capacity and hardpoints. It is an extremely good daily mission runner and a blast to fly.
  • The Cobra V is almost overpowered... But somewhat limited in cargo capacity and hardpoints because it's a small ship. It is an extremely good daily mission runner.
  • The Corsair is almost overpowered... But just missed being overpowered because the something is just a bit better in every category. It is an extremely good and versatile daily mission runner.
The only thing you "win" is getting to enjoy the ship earlier, which adds to enjoying the game a bit more, and hopefully the "pay" will keep this game around a bit longer. The only real win is that they do make things easier to do and move around. They've done a remarkable job of balancing these ships, so nothing is overpowered.
 

Cmdr Esteban

Cmdr Esteban
Pville_Piper said:
The T-8…makes a poor miner
Click to expand...
I guess you could say it therefore makes a miner poor 🙂

It’s strange because the T8 looks like a mining ship with its industrial styling and those pylons (which otherwise don’t seem to serve any purpose). It should be ideal for mining but this is the second time I’ve heard that it’s not (I wouldn’t know first hand as I don’t mine and have never owned a T8).
 

Thauma

Thauma
Its P2C - pay for convenience. Essentially what you do to skip the grind.

As for my point earlier and the better ways to make players buy arx:
  • more COVAS
  • more carrier customizations - layouts, announcers, lobby, skins, colors. Heck, maybe even the crew uniforms can be subject to customization.
  • more CMDR customization (hairstyles, accessories, tattoos, etc.)
  • changeable cockpit designs (refer to cabin interiors in ETS2 to see what I mean)
  • now that colonization is here - flight control announcers; station/outpost/settlement layouts; lobby color varieties
 

galahad2069

G
Pville_Piper said:
The pay to win always slays me... None of these ships are overpowered.
  • The Python 2 is a great combat ship, can double as a daily mission runner, but is extremely limited because of a horrible internal layout and limited jump range. As a combat ship, it matches any other of the best medium combat ships but doesn't really beat them.
  • The T-8 is the best medium cargo hauler, but has extremely limited hardpoints, makes a poor miner and isn't the fastest either.
  • The Mandalay is almost overpowered... But somewhat limited in cargo capacity and hardpoints. It is an extremely good daily mission runner and a blast to fly.
  • The Cobra V is almost overpowered... But somewhat limited in cargo capacity and hardpoints because it's a small ship. It is an extremely good daily mission runner.
  • The Corsair is almost overpowered... But just missed being overpowered because the something is just a bit better in every category. It is an extremely good and versatile daily mission runner.
The only thing you "win" is getting to enjoy the ship earlier, which adds to enjoying the game a bit more, and hopefully the "pay" will keep this game around a bit longer. The only real win is that they do make things easier to do and move around. They've done a remarkable job of balancing these ships, so nothing is overpowered.
Click to expand...
Idk why it's so problematic for some people to accept the simple fact that some elements in this game are obviously P2W.

P2W in computer gaming is simply a name of a monetization technique when you exchange real-world currency for an ingame benefit.

pay to win - Wiktionary, the free dictionary

en.wiktionary.org en.wiktionary.org

It's an umbrella term that covers a wide range of ingame benefits you can buy, from otherwise unobtainable overpowered weapons to early-access assets or simply skipping some of the ingame grind. Some of these things are more annoying, some of them are less so, but the difference between them is just quantitative, it does not change the fact that they all belong in the category of P2W.
 
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Pville_Piper

Pville_Piper
Cmdr Esteban said:
I guess you could say it therefore makes a miner poor 🙂

It’s strange because the T8 looks like a mining ship with its industrial styling and those pylons (which otherwise don’t seem to serve any purpose). It should be ideal for mining but this is the second time I’ve heard that it’s not (I wouldn’t know first hand as I don’t mine and have never owned a T8).
Click to expand...
The arms get in the way, really block your view. Only having one size 2 hardpoint is the real limitation along with the limited power setup, you can't run more than 3 mining lasers without the capacitor draining very fast. I took out my T-10 the other night and the difference in how fast it draws down a roid with 2 medium and one small mining laser is very noticeable.
 
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Pville_Piper

Pville_Piper
galahad2069 said:
Idk why it's so problematic for some people to accept the simple fact that some elements in this game are obviously P2W.

P2W in computer gaming is simply a name of a monetization technique when you exchange real-world currency for an ingame benefit.

pay to win - Wiktionary, the free dictionary

en.wiktionary.org en.wiktionary.org

It's an umbrella term that covers a wide range of ingame benefits you can buy, from otherwise unobtainable overpowered weapons to early-access assets or simply skipping some of the ingame grind. Some of these things are more annoying, some of them are less so, but the difference between them is just quantitative, it does not change the fact that they all belong to the category of P2W.
Click to expand...
So, then paint jobs are an in-game benefit by that definition... Pay to win is not about having nice things, it's about gaining advantage over another player with something that can't be bought with in game credits in a competitive situation. There is NO advantage over any other player that owning one of these ships will give you. They all can be matched by current, in game assets, if not bested. There is nothing to win, no advantage, so there is NO PAY TO WIN.
 

Ozric

Volunteer Moderator
Ozric
galahad2069 said:
Idk why it's so problematic for some people to accept the simple fact that some elements in this game are obviously P2W.

P2W in computer gaming is simply a name of a monetization technique when you exchange real-world currency for an ingame benefit.

pay to win - Wiktionary, the free dictionary

en.wiktionary.org en.wiktionary.org

It's an umbrella term that covers a wide range of ingame benefits you can buy, from otherwise unobtainable overpowered weapons to early-access assets or simply skipping some of the ingame grind. Some of these things are more annoying, some of them are less so, but the difference between them is just quantitative, it does not change the fact that they all belong to the category of P2W.
Click to expand...
Using a website that can edited by anyone as your source isn't the best move :)

That might be what some people use it to mean now, but it's not what it actually is. It's just the same as how trolling has become a blanket term for anyone being slightly snarky or horrible to someone else, nothing remotely close to what it actually is.

This is why it's "so problematic" for some people, because they remember what it meant :)
 

Pville_Piper

Pville_Piper
Ozric said:
Using a website that can edited by anyone as your source isn't the best move :)

That might be what some people use it to mean now, but it's not what it actually is. It's just the same as how trolling has become a blanket term for anyone being slightly snarky or horrible to someone else, nothing remotely close to what it actually is.

This is why it's "so problematic" for some people, because they remember what it meant :)
Click to expand...
It's like when you play one of those "free -to-play" FPS shooter games, and you buy a gun that's overpowered, and you can't match it with anything else that you can get in-game... That's pay to win.
 

galahad2069

G
Pville_Piper said:
So, then paint jobs are an in-game benefit by that definition... Pay to win is not about having nice things, it's about gaining advantage over another player with something that can't be bought with in game credits in a competitive situation. There is NO advantage over any other player that owning one of these ships will give you. They all can be matched by current, in game assets, if not bested. There is nothing to win, no advantage, so there is NO PAY TO WIN.
Click to expand...

Paint jobs can be P2W if they are not purely cosmetic and give you some tangible advantage. Actually the black paintjobs used to be p2w elements in ED long ago (before they changed silent running mechanics and night vision became a thing).

As for whether or not they all can be matched by current ingame assets, that's not necessarily true. For example the Python2 is the ultimate Cutter-killer, no other ship can come close to it in that particular niche, and there used to be a time when it was an ARX-only ship.
 

Pville_Piper

Pville_Piper
galahad2069 said:
Paint jobs can be P2W if they are not purely cosmetic and give you some tangible advantage. Actually the black paintjobs used to be p2w elements in ED long ago (before they changed silent running mechanics and night vision became a thing).

As for whether or not they all can be matched by current ingame assets, that's not necessarily true. For example the Python2 is the ultimate Cutter-killer, no other ship can come close to it in that particular niche, and there used to be a time when it was an ARX-only ship.
Click to expand...
Baloney, the Fer Delance is equal to the Python 2. There is no in-game advantage that you can get from any other ship. Period.
 

Dougie

Dougie
Pville_Piper said:
...
  • The Python 2 is a great combat ship, can double as a daily mission runner, but is extremely limited because of a horrible internal layout and limited jump range. As a combat ship, it matches any other of the best medium combat ships but doesn't really beat them.
Click to expand...

Really? Have they changed the PD then? I found it completely useless. I think I need to learn more. :)
 
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