IGN article stating Odyssey is NOT the final update to elite

[Jibroni Gibironi]

If FDev were completely silent on Odyssey (previously known as New Era) then you'd be whining about the silence instead

They opened that can of worms by deciding to do a blog, so not really. If blogs weren't planned for it, I wouldn't be here saying a damn thing about it really.

 

[Agony_Aunt]

Actually, this is a sort of inverse SC joke.

I don't want FD to stop development on ED, but i'd laugh like a madman if ED reached EoL before SC even gets out of pre-alpha.

 

[Jibroni Gibironi]

I don't want FD to stop development on ED, but i'd laugh like a madman if ED reached EoL before SC even gets out of pre-alpha.

It probably will, I expect it to occur in fact. I mean, would any of us really be surprised if it did? This is assuming SC doesn't just turn to dust and never see the light of day beyond alpha.

 

[Barking_Mad]

@StuartGT Explain yourself!

He's let us, but most of all himself, down. Tis a sad day.

 

[Barking_Mad]

Was there any solid evidence actually suggesting they were going to arbitrarily stop after EDO?

I mean, it's nice to know and all that but was this a burning community question that just slipped past my attention?

No, but you know what the "maintenance mode crew" will say...

 

[Barking_Mad]

Yes, they'll have to start discussing a LOT more than simply roaming around desolate planets on foot being a botanist, and they have to do it now, not later on next year or whatever. After looking at all the stuff they claim they wanted this game to be back in 2014, what they have shown so far isn't even close to acceptable.

LOL

Some folk want the moon on a stick.

 

[Rubbernuke]

LOL

Some folk want the moon on a stick.

In reality a lot of people don't want much, just what we have now given some attention. ED is not in maintenance mode and won't be for the next few years, but it is stuck in a cycle of foundation laying and superficial features FD drop unless they are instantly popular.

I said I would wait for EDO to see what it brings, and I'll stick to that- but so far it seems FD have inched along- planets look nice, but where are the clouds, the interaction? A nicely lit but static surface mesh deformed to (admittedly clever) proc gen rules is not 'a giant leap' from what we have now in SRVs, nor is it adding to the game which is centered around spaceships.

 

[Stigbob]

Yes, because everybody knows an echo chamber always produces the best game development... oh, wait! The toxic response of NMS ensured a massive turnaround in what, two years? vs the white knight brigade of that other star faring game that has allowed it to languish in alpha for far too long, promising new pick your nose technology being added to the ever growing laundry list of things to be included in the game...

I don't think they have the forum open at important planning meetings. They do drop the odd salty joke into patch notes, but that's about it.

 

[xaisis]

Well... according to this article, it's not the final update for elite, instead Odyssey is only putting the framework in place for future updates.

Reading that, Odyssey won’t be upgraded for new consoles, likely suggest an end to the project.
If i managed something like this, i would make sure my ports where good to go on all major platforms. else why invest further in it.

I think another big upgrade to be at least 3 years out, likely 4-5 years (it is frontier).
That is a far away if you are not gonna make it for next gen. consoles.

Unless it will "just" work on those.

 

[Ambroza]

Yes, because everybody knows an echo chamber always produces the best game development... oh, wait! The toxic response of NMS ensured a massive turnaround in what, two years? vs the white knight brigade of that other star faring game that has allowed it to languish in alpha for far too long, promising new pick your nose technology being added to the ever growing laundry list of things to be included in the game...

Not looking for an echo chamber, just a relief from people who complain about anything and everything. Criticism is obviously fine, I've shared quite a lot of it myself over the years.

Also, I really doubt Hello Games improved NMS because of the death threats they received. I think they just continued making the game they wanted to make.

 

[Viajero]

Unless it will "just" work on those.

Not an expert in console shenanigans but is there a reason to think PS5 won’t be compatible with games designed for PS4?

 

[babelfisch]

@StuartGT Explain yourself!

First he sided with the pink hair clown army and now this. I am so disappointed.

 

[babelfisch]

Was there any solid evidence actually suggesting they were going to arbitrarily stop after EDO?

I mean, it's nice to know and all that but was this a burning community question that just slipped past my attention?

Looks like you missed 6 years of doom.

 

[babelfisch]

Yes, because everybody knows an echo chamber always produces the best game development... oh, wait! The toxic response of NMS ensured a massive turnaround in what, two years? vs the white knight brigade of that other star faring game that has allowed it to languish in alpha for far too long, promising new pick your nose technology being added to the ever growing laundry list of things to be included in the game...

It's not noisy and entitled crybabies who produce the best game development but game developers who produce the best game development. So far the 'the game is doomed' crowd didn't achieve anything other than being proven wrong again and again.
NMS wasn't improved because Sean Murray got several death threats but because he decided to improve it.
You are welcome to write a 'I want higher sea levels' sign, go to the beach and pat your shoulder when the high tide arrives though.

A bunch of toxic gamers doesn't add anything to development. Constructive criticism does.

 

[Ian Doncaster]

So this is the excuse now for Odyssey possibly being bare bones in new content at launch, after waiting for going on five years for another major update? Is this a joke? What have they been doing all this time?

Turns out that building a (multiplayer) first person space game is really complicated.

Elite Dangerous: gets as far as Horizons about on its original schedule, then slows down considerably
X4: an incredible mess of bugs at release ... is that fixed yet? I haven't been keeping up
NMS: arguably released a couple of years earlier than it should have been
Star Citizen: currently ten years behind its original release schedule, very likely to slip further
Dual Universe: currently three years behind its original release schedule, though seems to be getting back on track
Infinity Battlescape: had most of the originally-intended scope thrown away to "just" be a combat-focused game
That ED-beating competitor that's just around the corner, honest: yeah, we all keep hoping

If it was actually easy, someone else would have released the "ED but better" already and we wouldn't be having this discussion.

In reality a lot of people don't want much, just what we have now given some attention. ED is not in maintenance mode and won't be for the next few years, but it is stuck in a cycle of foundation laying and superficial features FD drop unless they are instantly popular.

I'm much more in favour of them doing creative things with the features they've already got - which can already do so much if they put the time into making content with them - rather than yet more frameworks ... but that's not monetisable as an optional purchasable expansion. I'm just hoping they do another Beyond-style expansion after Odyssey.

I said I would wait for EDO to see what it brings, and I'll stick to that- but so far it seems FD have inched along- planets look nice, but where are the clouds, the interaction? A nicely lit but static surface mesh deformed to (admittedly clever) proc gen rules is not 'a giant leap' from what we have now in SRVs, nor is it adding to the game which is centered around spaceships.

I would have been extremely impressed if they'd got clouds working (in the sense of "persistent micro- and macro- scale dynamic weather systems that are consistently and efficiently positioned across multiple clients", not in the sense of "drawing some clouds").
(And I don't get all the fuss about "space legs" either. But apparently you can't be a proper spaceship-flying game without also being a walking game nowadays, or something)

 

[Rubbernuke]

I'm just hoping they do another Beyond-style expansion after Odyssey.

This is the the word I dread more than Soon™ -After™ means it never materialises normally. I waited five years for Powerplay improvements, and yet its always after something and never now. I know FD think Powerplay is the dark side, but if they actually complete it they (and me ) can move on and play it.

I would have been extremely impressed if they'd got clouds working (in the sense of "persistent micro- and macro- scale dynamic weather systems that are consistently and efficiently positioned across multiple clients", not in the sense of "drawing some clouds").
(And I don't get all the fuss about "space legs" either. But apparently you can't be a proper spaceship-flying game without also being a walking game nowadays, or something)

FD already have superficial clouds in other games- I do understand that clouds are difficult (they have to be the same in space / ground / over instances) but that does not preclude dust devils, dust clouds, wind gusts picking up debris etc which would be local POI level (i.e. not seen from space). But FD desperately need to inject visual life into barren worlds otherwise thats all they remain- barren.

 

[Ian Doncaster]

FD already have superficial clouds in other games- I do understand that clouds are difficult (they have to be the same in space / ground / over instances) but that does not preclude dust devils, dust clouds, wind gusts picking up debris etc which would be local POI level (i.e. not seen from space). But FD desperately need to inject visual life into barren worlds otherwise thats all they remain- barren.

The specific problem I'm thinking of is this:
- weather has to be synchronised across clients (if you see it's foggy and I don't, that's very bad)
- weather has to exist on billions of procgen planets
- weather therefore has to be consistent and persistent to stop weird stuff happening when two people get close enough together to merge instances (and also stop "I don't like fog" / relog / "ah, bright sunshine")
- it also has, as you say, to be consistent between the orbital level flying right down (in normal space, potentially) to the surface through the atmosphere layers
...all things which they've solved for terrain.
- weather changes over time
...so the generation has to be dynamic and very efficient ... and ideally, given the rest of the game, give reasonably realistic weather patterns for the terrain, wind going around obstacles, etc.

The combination of the three underlined bits is the bit I cannot possibly see how they can do. Current stellar forge surface generation takes a few seconds just for a heightmap. I can just about see the very edge of how they might theoretically get something that works as a proof of concept for gas-giant atmospheres (where the lack of terrain simplifies matters a lot). Now, of course, Frontier can hire someone much better than me at "procedural weather generation" to work on the problem. I hope they do, because it would be amazing. But if the next five years is simply and only "Elite: Weather" that might not be enough.

The other games are all single-player (or limited location multiplayer?), so "consistent and persistent" isn't needed.

 

[Rubbernuke]

The specific problem I'm thinking of is this:

• weather has to be synchronised across clients (if you see it's foggy and I don't, that's very bad)
• weather has to exist on billions of procgen planets
• weather therefore has to be consistent and persistent to stop weird stuff happening when two people get close enough together to merge instances (and also stop "I don't like fog" / relog / "ah, bright sunshine")
• it also has, as you say, to be consistent between the orbital level flying right down (in normal space, potentially) to the surface through the atmosphere layers

...all things which they've solved for terrain.
- weather changes over time
...so the generation has to be dynamic and very efficient ... and ideally, given the rest of the game, give reasonably realistic weather patterns for the terrain, wind going around obstacles, etc.

The combination of the three underlined bits is the bit I cannot possibly see how they can do. Current stellar forge surface generation takes a few seconds just for a heightmap. I can just about see the very edge of how they might theoretically get something that works as a proof of concept for gas-giant atmospheres (where the lack of terrain simplifies matters a lot). Now, of course, Frontier can hire someone much better than me at "procedural weather generation" to work on the problem. I hope they do, because it would be amazing. But if the next five years is simply and only "Elite: Weather" that might not be enough.

The other games are all single-player (or limited location multiplayer?), so "consistent and persistent" isn't needed.

I'm not even going that far -I'd be happy with static clouds and weather systems I never expected to have full weather systems like MSFS, more like simple NMS level or simple things just to break up the flat sky.

 

[CMDR Yates]

I'm just hoping they do another Beyond-style expansion after Odyssey.

If I was to wildly, wildly blue-sky speculate (not even knowing what's all in Odyssey), I think it wouldn't be unrealistic for them to put out a "free" update in 2022 or so with maybe some slightly thicker atmospheres, clouds, light weather, and some of the stuff they're "considering" like ship interiors.

Something like that could make it's money from Arx alone, with folk tarting up their cockpits and FC control rooms.

Gas giants/water planets paid update 2025, maybe? If the game's even still going then.

 

[zimms]

[...]
instead Odyssey is only putting the framework in place for future updates.
[...]

Come on, you're taking the... 'liquid'.