Rubbish.
Though on the subject of the existing PvE piracy options... I thought that low temperature diamonds were the item to look out for? I've seen reports of pirates making good money hunting down those.
I'm going to start advocating for improved PvE criminal gameplay.
Rubbish.
Though on the subject of the existing PvE piracy options... I thought that low temperature diamonds were the item to look out for? I've seen reports of pirates making good money hunting down those.
Deleted member 110222
D
The personal attacks I've been subjected to in-game, simply for trying to extract cargo... You know, part of the game?
I'm lucky the attackers haven't gone so far as to make IRL threats to me. But that's probably down to sheer luck of the draw.
In any case, it's become bad enough that I've had enough of it, and I'm just going to pursue a solid PvE experience, however futile that might be.
PC mate. I also play on Xbox.
One time this guy said something nasty to me, and I punched him in the arm so hard that it left a bruise.
Ouchie
I would really like to see more consequences in PvE for criminal game play. But getting fined for accidentally plinking a security ship that happened to boost past your beam while you're firing on a wanted pirate and then getting wanted yourself, has got to go.
Also, if you get a mission to scan data in a High Security base, there has to be some chance in gameplay with carrying out the mission and getting away with it without getting fined and wanted.
But I would really like to see wanted players/NPC ships being denied entry into stations where the controlling faction has them on their wanted list.
Also, if you get a mission to scan data in a High Security base, there has to be some chance in gameplay with carrying out the mission and getting away with it without getting fined and wanted.
But I would really like to see wanted players/NPC ships being denied entry into stations where the controlling faction has them on their wanted list.
What parameters of PVE criminal gameplay do you desire changed?
My thought is that the NPC's should carry player based cargoes rather than 100 tons of biowaste...
Is there a line that should be drawn from this?
Should NPC's act like other games...kill them and see what the pinata drops?
Should Piracy be as profitable as trading?
How difficult should the NPC's be to fight and plunder?
My thought is that the NPC's should carry player based cargoes rather than 100 tons of biowaste...
Is there a line that should be drawn from this?
Should NPC's act like other games...kill them and see what the pinata drops?
Should Piracy be as profitable as trading?
How difficult should the NPC's be to fight and plunder?
You seem to have misunderstood this entire thread.
Other people's minds disagree. Mine included.
Really? I use Mobius to avoid unpleasant human players. If others want to use it to hunt NPCs, why does that affect me (or you)? It doesn't affect me in the slightest.
As per my first statement, I think you've misunderstood just about everything that the OP is talking about.
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You are getting very lost in acronyms.
The point of this thread is to find cooler things for criminals against the environment, not to hunt down other players; OP got his ears burned off over comms doing that, so is hanging up their PVP pirate patch for a PVE version and is seeing what's available and what's lacking. This has absolutely nothing to do with your PG gameplay, unless somehow Uni was part of your group and you all but him were playing police types.
Edit: I see I'm not the only one mystified by your mystification.
Deleted member 110222
D
Exactly. I want to see PvE criminal gameplay just become more interesting. Think of me making a cause akin to the explorers. They have my full support by the way. PvE as a whole needs to be made more interesting. Right now it's basically nothing more than shoot an NPC or click buttons on menus.
I do think that NPCs should be viable piracy targets. There's low temperature diamonds of course, but there should be a range between diamonds and biowaste.
I wouldn't worry about security response times, because the obvious way to avoid that is to use an anarchy system as your hunting ground. Ta-da, no more security. Obviously if there aren't any NPCs worth hitting in any anarchy systems, well obviously some should be added. Low-security systems should probably be an in-between where there will be a response, but it will be slow enough that it might be feasible to pull a heist out from under them if you're quick.
NPC traders carrying anything valuable in an anarchy system should likely have an escort of course, because they're not stupid, and the size of that escort should be proportional to the value of their cargo. But because they're in an anarchy system, at least they can't call in reinforcements. Low-security systems would have traders with smaller escorts or sometimes no escorts, because they expect the cops to show up... eventually.
I don't know if NPCs are currently programmed to pretend they can be mass-locked, but they should be. Honestly I think one thing that would really help piracy would be if an interdictor amplified your mass-lock factor, especially if NPCs obeyed mass-lock.
On the bounty side, well obviously an easy way to avoid bounties is to hunt in an anarchy system. However, once the bounties are on, a fewchanges.
First, NPC bounty hunters shouldn't be chasing chump change. Got a 200Cr bounty for a friendly fire incident or while motivating a surrender? Shouldn't be worth their time, their ammo costs more than that. They should probably weigh your bounty against your combat rating: if you're Harmless, novice bounty hunters in Sidewinders and such might chase you for 5k and a chance at first blood. If you're Elite, it might take over 100k before a hunter considers trying their luck with you, but when they do they'll bring their best ships and maybe a wing.
Second, bounties should be harder to get rid of. The bounty should be split between the player and the ship that earned it: the portion on the ship will follow the ship no matter how many times you die in a sidewinder. If you sell a ship with a bounty on it, the ship's share will be taken out of the sale price. If the ship is destroyed, it will be added to your rebuy. I was thinking of making suicide not clear the portion on the pilot, but it's so easy to get an NPC to kill you that I don't think that would make any difference. By tying a portion of it to the ship, and ensuring it will be taken out of sales and rebuys, you can be sure that at least part of a bounty will come back to haunt you sooner or later.
Third, frequency of bounty hunters. NPC Bounty hunters should show up most often in a low-security system that doesn't like you. They have just enough resources and motivation to tip off a bounty hunter, but just few enough to not go after you themselves. High-security systems should actually have a slightly lower occurrence of bounty hunters, because they'd rather catch you themselves. A low-security system that likes you should have a very low chance of bounty hunters, because they'll actually try to hide you, but someone might tip them off anyway. An anarchy system that doesn't like you should probably have about the same frequency as a low-sec that is either favorable or neutral: they'd like to tip off the hunters, but don't have the ability to track you reliably. Finally, an anarchy system that likes you should never spawn bounty hunters. Any that come looking for you just happen to get pointed in the wrong direction or mysteriously disappear in a dark alley, what a coincidence.
I wouldn't worry about security response times, because the obvious way to avoid that is to use an anarchy system as your hunting ground. Ta-da, no more security. Obviously if there aren't any NPCs worth hitting in any anarchy systems, well obviously some should be added. Low-security systems should probably be an in-between where there will be a response, but it will be slow enough that it might be feasible to pull a heist out from under them if you're quick.
NPC traders carrying anything valuable in an anarchy system should likely have an escort of course, because they're not stupid, and the size of that escort should be proportional to the value of their cargo. But because they're in an anarchy system, at least they can't call in reinforcements. Low-security systems would have traders with smaller escorts or sometimes no escorts, because they expect the cops to show up... eventually.
I don't know if NPCs are currently programmed to pretend they can be mass-locked, but they should be. Honestly I think one thing that would really help piracy would be if an interdictor amplified your mass-lock factor, especially if NPCs obeyed mass-lock.
On the bounty side, well obviously an easy way to avoid bounties is to hunt in an anarchy system. However, once the bounties are on, a fewchanges.
First, NPC bounty hunters shouldn't be chasing chump change. Got a 200Cr bounty for a friendly fire incident or while motivating a surrender? Shouldn't be worth their time, their ammo costs more than that. They should probably weigh your bounty against your combat rating: if you're Harmless, novice bounty hunters in Sidewinders and such might chase you for 5k and a chance at first blood. If you're Elite, it might take over 100k before a hunter considers trying their luck with you, but when they do they'll bring their best ships and maybe a wing.
Second, bounties should be harder to get rid of. The bounty should be split between the player and the ship that earned it: the portion on the ship will follow the ship no matter how many times you die in a sidewinder. If you sell a ship with a bounty on it, the ship's share will be taken out of the sale price. If the ship is destroyed, it will be added to your rebuy. I was thinking of making suicide not clear the portion on the pilot, but it's so easy to get an NPC to kill you that I don't think that would make any difference. By tying a portion of it to the ship, and ensuring it will be taken out of sales and rebuys, you can be sure that at least part of a bounty will come back to haunt you sooner or later.
Third, frequency of bounty hunters. NPC Bounty hunters should show up most often in a low-security system that doesn't like you. They have just enough resources and motivation to tip off a bounty hunter, but just few enough to not go after you themselves. High-security systems should actually have a slightly lower occurrence of bounty hunters, because they'd rather catch you themselves. A low-security system that likes you should have a very low chance of bounty hunters, because they'll actually try to hide you, but someone might tip them off anyway. An anarchy system that doesn't like you should probably have about the same frequency as a low-sec that is either favorable or neutral: they'd like to tip off the hunters, but don't have the ability to track you reliably. Finally, an anarchy system that likes you should never spawn bounty hunters. Any that come looking for you just happen to get pointed in the wrong direction or mysteriously disappear in a dark alley, what a coincidence.
Deleted member 110222
D
I like it.
PvE piracy seems pointless because you always have to shoot up the npc to get cargo.
The real art of piracy should be to get cargo with little or no shooting.
And that involves witty banter and conversation.
The real art of piracy should be to get cargo with little or no shooting.
And that involves witty banter and conversation.
A good crime and punishment system should actually improve life for pirates (and assassins) as much as it improves life for traders. It should encourage gameplay, not artificially limit it. And it should impactt both PvE and PvP equally.
Pirates should be flying out of hidden pirate bases… praying on those foolish enough to enter anarchy systems or sneaking into high-sec systems to pray upon traders there – and they should get good money for doing so.
Bounty hunters should hunt pirates, assassins should hunt bounty hunters… (assassins get paid more, but will have a harder time having high-quality components serviced). Pirates should be flying overheating rustbuckets with devastating weapons… a real risk, but not a full on military force.
This can be achieved with:
* Rep is not wiped with death, but is changed by long-term actions.
* High sec systems should see pirating nearly impossible, with high-powered security forces patrolling and jumping in within moments
* Low sec systems should have zero repercussions for pirates, and should be deathtraps for unarmed traders (massive amounts of npc pirates if no player pirates about).
* There should be a range of security types in between
* Stations in high sec locations should shoot known pirates on sight, while clean traders/bounty hunters will be followed when they leave from lowsec stations, hounded by pirates and assassins respectively.
* High sec stations won’t allow a very low-rep pilot to dock, nor will a low sec stations allow high rep pilots to dock (since high rep means you’ve been working with security forces or navies).
* Low sec stations should offer greater rewards for basic cargos – thus tempting traders to risk it
* Low sec stations have no black markets – they’re happy to buy stolen gear at full price.
* High sec stations tax you…. Unless you can smuggle cargo in…
* Buying anything (cargo or components) at high sec stations should cost a lot more – someone needs to pay for all that security.
* Ship components at high sec stations should have far better quality and better range, with massive mark-ups. Modifications rarer and mostly ‘clean’ or ‘efficient’ type. Insurance is good (aka normal).
* Ship components at low sec stations should be dirt cheap, but poor quality. Weapons should be prone to overheating, but devastating. Modifications should be cheap and plentiful, but mostly of the dirty/overcharged variety. Insurance should cost more (although lower ship-cost should offset that)… maybe some notorious pirates don’t get insurance at all.
* Pirate stations shouldn’t be able to (or should charge massive amounts for) repairing high-quality components and ships… encouraging pirates to fly with ‘pirate’ gear.
* High sec stations won’t repair illegally modified gear (some very high-sec stations might even fine you for using modified or bootleg gear), and charge a lot more for repairing legally modified gear.
The whole thing has to go hand-in-hand with a communication overhaul to allow a Wing Commander style communication system that allows you to hail NPC ships with basic options, such as "drop your cargo", "I surrender", "Do you need help", etc
Pirates should be flying out of hidden pirate bases… praying on those foolish enough to enter anarchy systems or sneaking into high-sec systems to pray upon traders there – and they should get good money for doing so.
Bounty hunters should hunt pirates, assassins should hunt bounty hunters… (assassins get paid more, but will have a harder time having high-quality components serviced). Pirates should be flying overheating rustbuckets with devastating weapons… a real risk, but not a full on military force.
This can be achieved with:
* Rep is not wiped with death, but is changed by long-term actions.
* High sec systems should see pirating nearly impossible, with high-powered security forces patrolling and jumping in within moments
* Low sec systems should have zero repercussions for pirates, and should be deathtraps for unarmed traders (massive amounts of npc pirates if no player pirates about).
* There should be a range of security types in between
* Stations in high sec locations should shoot known pirates on sight, while clean traders/bounty hunters will be followed when they leave from lowsec stations, hounded by pirates and assassins respectively.
* High sec stations won’t allow a very low-rep pilot to dock, nor will a low sec stations allow high rep pilots to dock (since high rep means you’ve been working with security forces or navies).
* Low sec stations should offer greater rewards for basic cargos – thus tempting traders to risk it
* Low sec stations have no black markets – they’re happy to buy stolen gear at full price.
* High sec stations tax you…. Unless you can smuggle cargo in…
* Buying anything (cargo or components) at high sec stations should cost a lot more – someone needs to pay for all that security.
* Ship components at high sec stations should have far better quality and better range, with massive mark-ups. Modifications rarer and mostly ‘clean’ or ‘efficient’ type. Insurance is good (aka normal).
* Ship components at low sec stations should be dirt cheap, but poor quality. Weapons should be prone to overheating, but devastating. Modifications should be cheap and plentiful, but mostly of the dirty/overcharged variety. Insurance should cost more (although lower ship-cost should offset that)… maybe some notorious pirates don’t get insurance at all.
* Pirate stations shouldn’t be able to (or should charge massive amounts for) repairing high-quality components and ships… encouraging pirates to fly with ‘pirate’ gear.
* High sec stations won’t repair illegally modified gear (some very high-sec stations might even fine you for using modified or bootleg gear), and charge a lot more for repairing legally modified gear.
The whole thing has to go hand-in-hand with a communication overhaul to allow a Wing Commander style communication system that allows you to hail NPC ships with basic options, such as "drop your cargo", "I surrender", "Do you need help", etc
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I've said from day 1, infractions for PvP crimes should apply equally to PvE crimes. Also, I must say, the one time I had to deal with a PvP pirate......it was actually a really cool experience.
If you think all that shows up on these boards is 'difference of opinion', you haven't been paying much attention. I've seen some fairly vitriolic threads closed down that were quite a bit more than mere differences of opinion. More than one complete with the same sort of language the OP mentions.
Not all toxicity is that extreme, fortunately, or this place would be little different than Reddit most days.
I agree with the OP. That sort of idiocy shouldn't be tolerated, and pirates shouldn't be subject to it any more than anyone else in game. At the same time, pirates/pvpers have a reputation for name calling and harassing people, via these forums and elsewhere, who don't share their opinions or who disagree with their actions. They can't call people names and post videos getting their jollies chain interdicting, killing newbs, etc..., and then complain later that people are 'being mean' to them in game, and expect any real level of sympathy from people. It just won't be there in sufficient quantity to make a difference, because they'll say it's well deserved.
Which of course, will trigger more of the same, and the cycle of idiocy continues ad nauseum ad infinitum.
Personally, I think the CSR and the Mod teams need to take a harder stance on this sort of nonsense, and hand out much firmer punishments when it occurs. Eventually the message will be received and the idiot behavior tapers off. Or the folks responsible eventually get culled to the point that it tapers off. Either way, you clean up the cesspool. You'll still have those that think they can get away with it, or who will try to be 'clever' about it and claim their innocence with faux righteous indignation when caught, but if done right, those will be rare.
In the end, it's not acceptable behavior, here or in game. Pirates/pvp players shouldn't be subjected to that sort of verbal abuse for playing the game the way it was designed. Pve players shouldn't be subjected to that sort of abuse for using a game mode that allows them to avoid piracy or pvp either. Both groups are using legitimate gameplay mechanics, and shouldn't have to put up with the sort of toxic antisocial behavior that's been displayed by both sides. At some point both sides need to kick FD in the shorts, and work together to do something constructive for the game, instead of always being at each other's throats.
Will that ever happen? Who knows. I'd like to think most of us are sane enough to at least try.