It's quite obvious that this game has hit its peak in popularity. If the only thing that comes in the future are small features and scenery pieces like almost every "major" update, this game is going to become less and less interesting after each update. I think it's about time to give the players a chance to add their own assets and features to the game since a good amount of what is being asked for can't be added to the game due to how this game is created I guess. Some people would disagree but I feel like it'd be a smart move to listen to those that don't always agree for once. If the community is in charge of scenery items and small features, I feel like the developers could spend their time making bigger and more ground breaking updates to the game that a novice modder would be incapable of pulling off. For example, water parks, wildlife, actual cities surrounding the parks instead of terrain, Pretty much just bigger features that can't be added by players. In the end, nobody wants to figure out how to streamline modding this game, it's too difficult and time consuming but those modifications would really give this game and community a second wind.
It's about time for an SDK/User Generated Content/Modding
- Thread starter Variable Gaming
- Start date
There is absolutely no valid argument to not include modding. If some people don´t like it, they are not forced to use it at all.
Maybe, when they stop releasing paid DLC, they could do something like that as last update for the game and give the game to the community. However, Frontier is known for not supporting modders, so I have my doubts.
I also feel like developers don´t want to spend much time on ground-breaking updates as mentioned in OP, simply because current way is easier for them and brings in more money.
It´s sad though. Big part of RCT games success is was modding and that´s why even these old games are still being played quite a lot today. That won´t be case of PC.
Maybe, when they stop releasing paid DLC, they could do something like that as last update for the game and give the game to the community. However, Frontier is known for not supporting modders, so I have my doubts.
I also feel like developers don´t want to spend much time on ground-breaking updates as mentioned in OP, simply because current way is easier for them and brings in more money.
It´s sad though. Big part of RCT games success is was modding and that´s why even these old games are still being played quite a lot today. That won´t be case of PC.
I wouldn't mind modding of any sort. That's fine by me.
But I won't be the one doing the modding, because I probably suck at doing that kind of stuff.
But I don't think they will give or make any tool for the game, just because it would decrease any future change of incomes and could destabilize the game.
I don't see them develop a program that is only going to be used by a select few (of course the modded stuff would be more widely used), but from a Frontier perspective there is no point at using resources for developing such kind of thing.
They are fine with you modding the game I think. We've already seen that in the past. (although some see it as a conspiracy that the thread has been closed on request of the OP back then but it was suggested that Frontier closed it)
Simply because there are to few people who can actually do that kind of stuff or are interested in using these kind of programs due to complexity.
On the other hand it means giving away some knowledge about the Engine, which if it was my company I would never give green light for that.
Of course I am not against it. I just don't see them providing the tools.
But I won't be the one doing the modding, because I probably suck at doing that kind of stuff.
But I don't think they will give or make any tool for the game, just because it would decrease any future change of incomes and could destabilize the game.
I don't see them develop a program that is only going to be used by a select few (of course the modded stuff would be more widely used), but from a Frontier perspective there is no point at using resources for developing such kind of thing.
They are fine with you modding the game I think. We've already seen that in the past. (although some see it as a conspiracy that the thread has been closed on request of the OP back then but it was suggested that Frontier closed it)
Simply because there are to few people who can actually do that kind of stuff or are interested in using these kind of programs due to complexity.
On the other hand it means giving away some knowledge about the Engine, which if it was my company I would never give green light for that.
Of course I am not against it. I just don't see them providing the tools.
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you don't have to expose the code of the engine (it's enough to offer the knowledge how to use it) and no one would expect that specific people should do the mods. it's quite normal for every modding scene that this is more about the few hardcore nerds than about the "common customer". people with ideas, knowledge and motivation to enhance a game they love. installing an available mod to enhance your game and use its features is a different story, this is something the common customer should be able to achieve. i'd love to see that if it gives me what i miss.
a company would rather gain a fortune from good mods. people who want to use a modificated game still have to buy the game. the mod doesn't prevent you from that task.
a company would rather gain a fortune from good mods. people who want to use a modificated game still have to buy the game. the mod doesn't prevent you from that task.
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Like I said, I'm not against modding and I don't think the game will be worse or anything like that.
The suggestion/idea is that Frontier supplies a tool to do so, which I believe will not happen.
Like you said, it's only for the few hardcore nerds, thus it's such a small market it won't make sense for Frontier to invest in something like a tool/UDK or something.
think from this perspective - the ones who create the mod(s) itself are few, but they aren't the market either. the market are those who took advantage from using these mods and this - if the available mods are commonly known, stable and helpful - can start a fresh snowball of old customers playing the game again and eventually new customers finding their way into the scene because they got triggered by features which weren't available before.
but honestly, especially a "model making" game like PC is perfectly designed to be a mod enabled software. enabling this game for modification shouldn't be based on the question how to make money out of it, if the customers are the ones who develop such tools.
But if Frontier wants to make a buck, they rather should develop the mod(s) on their own and offer them as DLC, the sooner the better.
Which is unlikely to happen as only a few would probably buy them.
So think from that perspective.
As a company I would let the users do it themselves, let them create tools if they want, that way Frontier doesn't have to support it and nobody can claim that Frontier makes stuff that breaks the game.
I'm just being realistic here, spares me the dissapointments.
if it comes: GREAT
No they don't.
I'd love Custom Guests, Shops/Stalls, Rides Etc.
This, this and this! We NEED MODS
I cant stress it enough, please give us the ability for real mods like Cities Skylines does. The game is just too limited and I hate that it takes so long.
And please stop with the "They can't release DLC anymore once we have mods" arguments because this has again and again been debunked by the very same game which had mod support from the beginning and plenty of succesful DLC later on.
It's been years, what are they waiting on or why don't they want us to have mods?
I cant stress it enough, please give us the ability for real mods like Cities Skylines does. The game is just too limited and I hate that it takes so long.
And please stop with the "They can't release DLC anymore once we have mods" arguments because this has again and again been debunked by the very same game which had mod support from the beginning and plenty of succesful DLC later on.
It's been years, what are they waiting on or why don't they want us to have mods?
Who says they don't want you to have mods.
I think we should stop comparing and pointing at Cities Skylines, as that has been build with the wildly available Unity Engine that hundreds of games use, thus makes it more logic to have mods in it as the Unity Engine already has that function build into it.
Everybody can learn to work with Unity.
Unity is most popular because of it's variety it can be used in. I don't think the same can be said for Cobra.
Hi all,
I've cleaned up this thread. Apologies if I deleted a post that you felt added to the discussion around OP's argument. This is an emotive subject for some, so I'm going to pretend the last few messages didn't happen and let you get back to conducting your civil discussion about Frontier's position on modding / user SDK. Everyone is entitled to their opinion; feel free to discuss and reason around that, but please do not attack others for that opinion.
Cheers,
xyphic
I've cleaned up this thread. Apologies if I deleted a post that you felt added to the discussion around OP's argument. This is an emotive subject for some, so I'm going to pretend the last few messages didn't happen and let you get back to conducting your civil discussion about Frontier's position on modding / user SDK. Everyone is entitled to their opinion; feel free to discuss and reason around that, but please do not attack others for that opinion.
Cheers,
xyphic
ok, and thanks.
but how concrete is Frontier's position on this task beside that they have nothing against it? would Frontier support this idea, are there actual plans to offer an API for modders, is there anything concrete in that direction?
i don't see any benefit regarding this discussion in having assumptions by other customers why Frontier eventually decides against such plans.
but how concrete is Frontier's position on this task beside that they have nothing against it? would Frontier support this idea, are there actual plans to offer an API for modders, is there anything concrete in that direction?
i don't see any benefit regarding this discussion in having assumptions by other customers why Frontier eventually decides against such plans.
I don't have any special insight here I'm afraid. We know that in the past they've said they'd like to provide an official toolset for UGC, but they haven't elaborated on what that would look like nor have they said how far it would go. What I do know is that Cobra was never designed to be put into the hands of hobbyist developers (unlike, say, Unity or Unreal), and given it's never (as far as I know) been licensed out to a third party to use, I would expect that there's a lot of work to do in order to make the tools friendly. I also suspect that they use some commercial tooling such as Maya and that making a toolset that anyone could use would be a lot of effort. Given they have at least 4 game franchises under development or maintenance, I would guess there simply isn't the resource to allocate to get this task done quickly.
We also have to remember that even if they were to release a UGC toolkit, it's unlikely to go as far as some people would like and that it would be likely that only certain aspects of the game would be moddable. A lot of what people are used to doing with mods change the way the game plays or add new functionality, and I don't think it's likely that that's where Frontier would want to go with this. They would still want it to fundamentally be Planet Coaster.
I'd like to add a bit regarding it.
In terms of gameplay modding, I see things in two ways.
I don't mind the idea of user generated buildings, scenery objects, rides etc provided there are limits on things like poly count to avoid problems on lower end systems (and also considering that there are limits on the drawing side which are DX11 related).
I'm more wary of the modding the actual gameplay itself (other than buildings/scenery objects/rides) as this would need to be monitored by Frontier to prevent problems caused by problematic mods. I see quite a bit of the problematic mod side when it comes to Cities: Skylines.
Regarding the second category, it would need to be someone who is able to update their mod to keep up with any updates made for the game as game updates can and often do affect mods (Skylines is a good example here).
Hopefully that all makes sense.
Shane
In terms of gameplay modding, I see things in two ways.
I don't mind the idea of user generated buildings, scenery objects, rides etc provided there are limits on things like poly count to avoid problems on lower end systems (and also considering that there are limits on the drawing side which are DX11 related).
I'm more wary of the modding the actual gameplay itself (other than buildings/scenery objects/rides) as this would need to be monitored by Frontier to prevent problems caused by problematic mods. I see quite a bit of the problematic mod side when it comes to Cities: Skylines.
Regarding the second category, it would need to be someone who is able to update their mod to keep up with any updates made for the game as game updates can and often do affect mods (Skylines is a good example here).
Hopefully that all makes sense.
Shane
Here is the Thing with modding at the moment: As long as the Game gets constant updates, Modding doesn't make much sense. As soon as a new update is out, the Mods will break.
The second reason is, nobody really figured out yet how to mod the Game properly. You pointed out official modding tools, but those might only come when Frontier stops supporting the Game.
I don't see the End of the Road for the Game yet. And i hope this Game will get support for some time. After that, your wishes might come true.
The second reason is, nobody really figured out yet how to mod the Game properly. You pointed out official modding tools, but those might only come when Frontier stops supporting the Game.
I don't see the End of the Road for the Game yet. And i hope this Game will get support for some time. After that, your wishes might come true.
Well, we don´t have to figure it out (or it would be much more easier) if Frontier provided us with the tools.
I must disagree with you saying it makes no sense to support modding as long as there is official support. It works, many games have huge modding community and the game is being updated by devs too. Modding community is used to that after update, some things might get broken. That´s simply part of the modding. Always have and always will. Ofcourse I do agree there are people who don´t like it and avoid mods. I´m myself a person that enjoy Vanilla games and usually, don´t play mods at all.
The question is, how hard would it be to create a tools for us. Well, it depends. It would be no problem to make a plug-in that would compile custom models for instance. We do not talk about complex mod kit here (even though that would be ideal), but even these small plug-ins that would make game at least a little bit modable would be very appreciated.