Jitter on Fixed Weapons

[BostromNZ]

It makes perfect sense. A machine gun is less accurate than a sniper weapon. If you want to put many rounds downrange rapidly, there's a price to be paid in accuracy. All positives need to be offset by negatives, otherwise everyone will have the same loadout.

You effectively just want to eat cakes all day and not get fat.

No I don't. If you read the thread you'll see I'm more than happy for it to be balanced with either a reduced ROF or for the accuracy of the weapon to be reduced similar to the penalty for the jitter although less but without the crosshair jittering all over the show when I'm aiming.

Morbad put it better than me:

An inaccurate weapon system putting a shot somewhere other than precisely where it was aimed is considerably more likely than the weapon aiming itself at random deflections and hitting exactly where it happens to be aiming.

 

[thirstyfish]

oh well.. i thought it's like photon pressure, and that the extended/correct equation was including relativistic mass.
not something i wanna get back into looking up my self, so i don't know.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkiCPMjpysc

just wanted to keep it simple but if i'm wrong, i'm wrong.

Well, the simple answer is that photons don't have mass. Laser's don't impart kinetic energy at all. It's all thermal. Bethesda bothered to get this mostly right in fallout 4. Any ballistic weapon or plasma weapon can move objects when you shoot them, but laser weapons don't. Bethesda then messed things up by giving laser weapons recoil, despite photons have no mass and there being no moving parts either. This game at least gets the no recoil thing right.

No I don't. If you read the thread you'll see I'm more than happy for it to be balanced with either a reduced ROF or for the accuracy of the weapon to be reduced similar to the penalty for the jitter although less but without the crosshair jittering all over the show when I'm aiming.

Morbad put it better than me:

Read my history lesson, it is a very viable explanation for jitter on fixed weapons. I know it sucks to have jitter, but it can be explained in a way that makes sense for any and all weapon types.

 

[BostromNZ]

Read my history lesson, it is a very viable explanation for jitter on fixed weapons. I know it sucks to have jitter, but it can be explained in a way that makes sense for any and all weapon types.

I don't think you're getting what I'm saying. I agree that that fixed weapons can be inaccurate, if you fire several rounds one after another they are not going to hit exactly the same point and if you increase rate of fire then it's fair to assume they will be less accurate. BUT that doesn't mean my targeting system should be jittering. How does it know exactly where the round is going to end up? The inaccuracy is caused by the action of shooting, the guns don't just jitter about the place on their own.

 

[thirstyfish]

I don't think you're getting what I'm saying. I agree that that fixed weapons can be inaccurate, if you fire several rounds one after another they are not going to hit exactly the same point and if you increase rate of fire then it's fair to assume they will be less accurate. BUT that doesn't mean my targeting system should be jittering. How does it know exactly where the round is going to end up? The inaccuracy is caused by the action of shooting, the guns don't just jitter about the place on their own.

A side affect of the engineering process could be affecting the software/hardware that controls where your boresight point is (the point where your guns all hit the same spot). This is a system that is working whenever hardpoints are deployed. It is running all the time, independent of any firing mechanism. No recoil required for the weapon to move. Like I said, READ my history lesson. This technology has been around since the Korean War. And since each gun can move independently of each other, to some degree, this could make your guns point in slightly different directions at various points in time. The mechanisms and software responsible for adjusting your fixed weapons now have some degree of constant movement.

Here:

Also consider the micro gimballing. even fixed weapons will move a bit on their own to adjust for target range. The F-86 Sabre had this on its guns back in Korea. Funny thing calleld Gun harmonization, convergence cone, convergence pattern/point, or boresight point. Basically, its the point where all of your guns will shoot at. The RAF took a shotgun pattern during WWII on their fighters to make engaging easier. If you have your guns converge on one point, then you need to be at that distance from the target. No farther, no closer. And in a dogfight, no one has time for that. The USAF got around this with the F-86. Its 6 guns would adjust themselves inside the plane based on the distance to a target in front of the aircraft as measured by radar. I assume our fixed weapons have something similar. So the jitter is being introduced into the software and/or hardware that is controlling your weapon's convergence cone.

We don't know exactly what goes on during the engineering process. I assume that all negative effects either unintended or simply unavoidable.

 

[DeathStroke]

Jitter is disgusting, I can't believe they added affects that increased it. Tried it on a corvette in beta, couldn't hit anything if I was more than 200m away. Total garbage.

yes an energy weapons would have some recoil i think

Nope, photons don't have mass, you need mass for recoil.

 

[Madrax573]

I don't believe that's true in the way you are suggesting.

Well the problem with measuring the scatter in the lasers was two fold. One the crystals had structures and impurities in them which adds to the scattering effect and the other was the atmosphere in which the lasers were fired through.

Depending on the frequency of the pulses and the wavelength of the specific light used it would scatter in varying degrees. So with some lasers we could only have the pulse frequency to a certain level then the beam effectively just shotgunned and we didn't get any desirable effect from them.

Was very fun to work on. Even if it was over 15 years ago

 

[Ozram]

Well the problem with measuring the scatter in the lasers was two fold. One the crystals had structures and impurities in them which adds to the scattering effect and the other was the atmosphere in which the lasers were fired through.

Depending on the frequency of the pulses and the wavelength of the specific light used it would scatter in varying degrees. So with some lasers we could only have the pulse frequency to a certain level then the beam effectively just shotgunned and we didn't get any desirable effect from them.

Was very fun to work on. Even if it was over 15 years ago

Sounds genuinely like awesome fun!

 

[thirstyfish]

Well the problem with measuring the scatter in the lasers was two fold. One the crystals had structures and impurities in them which adds to the scattering effect and the other was the atmosphere in which the lasers were fired through.

Depending on the frequency of the pulses and the wavelength of the specific light used it would scatter in varying degrees. So with some lasers we could only have the pulse frequency to a certain level then the beam effectively just shotgunned and we didn't get any desirable effect from them.

Was very fun to work on. Even if it was over 15 years ago

The main way to cause "jitter" upon firing a laser weapon is to take into account the heat it generates. This heat would cause focusing crystals to expand and would create occlusions, thus scattering or redirecting the beam.