"Liberate Missions just unplayable? (...or is it just me?)

evanevery · Aug 7, 2017

I've returned to my home system and I'm working to reestablish my rep with the local factions. There are lots of "Liberate" missions (hostages, diplomatic bags, scientific research, etc) and they give triple rep. Basically, you go out and find a wanted NPC and then steal a very specific quantity of a very specific item from their ship. Anyway...

Is it just me, or are these missions almost unplayable? I found these to be the single most tedious thing in ED. I was actually trying to finally run one to completion. The problem is, you gotta keep their shields down without destroying them, while launching hatch breaker limpets, while watching exactly what cargo gets ejected so you can selectively target collector limpets to bring it back. All the while trying to stay behind the target - but no so close to collide/destroy the specific cargo your looking for - and managing your cargo scoop to allow for high speed maneuvering or incoming collector limpets as appropriate.

...and don't forget to turn off "crimes against me" or the cops will come and kill your target before they eject the stuff you want...

So, I was absolutely determined to finish one of these 6-item liberation missions. I was chasing the NPC for what seemed like 30 minutes absolutely determined to do everything right! (If you collide and destroy even one of the items your looking for the mission will fail). So, yes, one of my collector limpets (with cargo) crashed into my ship while I was maneuvering. I completely drained the NPC's cargo, but alas I was 1 item short. So after all that... Failed mission!

I'm pretty disgusted so I swore there was no point in trying to do any more of these types of missions. I reconfigured my ship (removed hatch breaker limpet and collector limpet controllers) and went on to do something else...

(I also tried targeting one of my target's cargo hatches - instead of using hatch breakers - but could not make it happen and destroyed the target in the process...)

Is it just me or are these "liberate" missions crazy tedious and mostly impossible?

Ian Doncaster · Aug 7, 2017

They're not quite as impossible as you found if you make a few changes in tactics:
1) Don't drop their shields or even fire on them at all - hatchbreakers work through shields nowadays. Much less chance of accidentally destroying them, and it makes them less aggressive too. It also means you've never committed an attack on them, so if something else destroys them, you won't get kill credit for it ... which means the mission thinks they're still alive, go to 3.
2) Definitely "crimes off" as you found
3) If you've got a bunch of cargo out of them but not enough, leave the instance and look for them again. They'll have a fresh set of cargo. So long as you don't kill them you can do this as often as you like. So don't worry too much if you smash a cargo pod or two.
4) Get a fast(ish) ship with DD5 and you can probably keep up with them scoop down.
5) Take the ones with lower difficulty rating so their loadout and ship will be terrible, so you can keep up with them easier and their puny weapons won't bother your shields. Also fewer point defense to take out your hatchbreakers.

Nevertheless, they are still incredibly tedious, and I don't plan to do a second one ever.

Hossi · Aug 7, 2017

Nah, they are difficulty but not THAT hard.
A few things to keep in mind.
- The target ship withe the (full) mission cargo will respawn if you just low wake out and keep looking at the right place. Just DONT KILL HIM!
- This means: If you accidently destroy one container--> try again
- Hatch breaker limpets work even with full shields, no need to keep them down.
- If the cops kill him, it doesen't count. He will respawn. Or just low wake out before he's dead.

Final tipp: in the begining target his thrusters. This way its easier to avoid his weapon fire

evanevery · Aug 7, 2017

Thanks all!

- Thought I read that shields had to be down for hatch breakers, but OK!

- Re-Instancing seems to be the ticket! I actually tried that once (the ONLY Liberate mission I ever completed but it was only 3 items and I wasn't sure if I whacked one of the items already...)

- Found out about "Crimes Off" the hard way. Then forgot to turn it off on one of my other (many) failed liberate missions...

I may have to run another one of these just to make sure I am "comfortable" with the process. However, I don't see myself ever running another one of these otherwise (even with the new tips). Still just too tedious...

Enderby · Aug 7, 2017

Weirdly I just tried one. Target died, sadly. But he left items (I used limpets before he died). I crashed into one and it got destroyed, the others all disappeared at the same time and I had to abandon mission. Switched off ED.

Hossi · Aug 7, 2017

Enderby said:
Weirdly I just tried one. Target died, sadly. But he left items (I used limpets before he died). I crashed into one and it got destroyed, the others all disappeared at the same time and I had to abandon mission. Switched off ED.

Yea, as I wrote above: Don't kill him before you actualy have everything you need. As long as he is alive and the timer doesn't run of you're ok.
(A word on the timer: Don't belive the mission time limit. It lies. Look for the spawn time. The mission will fail if you miss this, even if there is a week left on the mission time)

Enderby · Aug 7, 2017

Yeah i realise that now. It happened before I read this thread.

Still feels a little annoying but at least i learnt the lesson for next time.

Spacecat · Aug 8, 2017

I have never taken one of these missions because they just sounded like a pain in the butt.

ThriveInDark · Aug 8, 2017

Ian Doncaster said:
They're not quite as impossible as you found if you make a few changes in tactics:
1) Don't drop their shields or even fire on them at all - hatchbreakers work through shields nowadays. Much less chance of accidentally destroying them, and it makes them less aggressive too. It also means you've never committed an attack on them, so if something else destroys them, you won't get kill credit for it ... which means the mission thinks they're still alive, go to 3.
2) Definitely "crimes off" as you found
3) If you've got a bunch of cargo out of them but not enough, leave the instance and look for them again. They'll have a fresh set of cargo. So long as you don't kill them you can do this as often as you like. So don't worry too much if you smash a cargo pod or two.
4) Get a fast(ish) ship with DD5 and you can probably keep up with them scoop down.
5) Take the ones with lower difficulty rating so their loadout and ship will be terrible, so you can keep up with them easier and their puny weapons won't bother your shields. Also fewer point defense to take out your hatchbreakers.

Nevertheless, they are still incredibly tedious, and I don't plan to do a second one ever.

Dude that whole time I read your reply I was like, this man knows the struggle. This is experience talking. Then at the end, one attempt. It must have been quite the trial indeed because I still buy it, you're grizzled, you've been to 'Nam after just one completion.

Spacecat said:
I have never taken one of these missions because they just sounded like a pain in the butt.

I'm with you^

metascrawl · Aug 8, 2017

Oh so that's what those missions involve. Yeah, sod that.

Stealthie · Aug 8, 2017

Spacecat said:
I have never taken one of these missions because they just sounded like a pain in the butt.

This.

I keep seeing "rescue the slaves/hostages" missions but I just know they're going to end up being a faff.

I am such a lightweight.

Ouberos · Aug 8, 2017

Piracy missions are very similar. For various reasons I often hesitate before clicking on them. (Mostly because I can go and do normal Piracy without a mission and for cargo that's worth Pirating thanks very much)

But hey, at least you found your target! That's progress isn't it? Amiright?

Marc_Hicks · Aug 8, 2017

The funny thing is.....I enjoy the challenge they present. I am getting better at them, especially as they've made it a little easier to use hatch-breakers. Back in 2.1 they were a total nightmare, & not worth the effort.

xDreadnoughtx · Aug 8, 2017

All this shows exactly why the ED missions implementation as currently in game, lacks believability and engaging play.

Rushed and unfinished. Like many parts of ED that have been rolled out despite clear beta warnings.

Crank Larson · Aug 8, 2017

xDreadnoughtx said:
All this shows exactly why the ED missions implementation as currently in game, lacks believability and engaging play.

Rushed and unfinished. Like many parts of ED that have been rolled out despite clear beta warnings.

People regularly ask for missions that are more than just "Move this from a-b", "go shoot this". So, here we have one that actually involves some effort and will take a little time and thought... And of course, people don't like it.

The only unbelievable thing about this mission is that the NPC will reappear with full cargo if you leave the instance and find it again (same as salvage missions will respawn).

Ian Doncaster · Aug 8, 2017

CMDR Crank Larson said:
People regularly ask for missions that are more than just "Move this form a-b", "go shoot this". So, here we have one that actually involves some effort and will take a little time and thought...

Fair point.

Though I think in this case the problem is that the mission requires thought (to get the right loadout and tactics) once which is fine, and then repeatedly "hatchbreaker, scan, collector?" about ten times until you get the cargo you want. Giving the NPC much less non-mission cargo (and perhaps a couple of spare mission cargo, on the easier difficulty levels) would require exactly the same thought but make the "stroll after the NPC for ten minutes" part a little quicker. Or expand the piracy+comms mechanic a bit so you can send them "If you don't drop 8 tonnes of diplomatic bags in the next 10 seconds I'll open fire" messages, then depending on difficulty and relative loadouts maybe actually have to shoot them a bit to get them to comply.

Aashenfox · Aug 8, 2017

I also avoided these cos they sounded like a faff. Now that I know what they are I think I'll take one on, but with collectors as well; pick everything up, sort the chaff out later.

evanevery · Aug 8, 2017

You can't complete the mission unless you get EVERY ONE of the items in your mission description. The target typically bleeds out all sort of crap and you have to be very patient to get X widgets (cause the target ONLY carries X of them among all the other meaningless cargo). Yes, it appears you can re-instance (if you don't kill the target).

Collectors are helpful but you still have to stay within range of the cargo and still keep an eye on the target. Lots of stuff going one here and not enough gain.

I'm all for a variety of missions but these are just way too tedious and time consuming for what they pay or the rep gained. If you don't believe me, simply accept one, and keep accepting them, until you actually complete one successfully...

xDreadnoughtx · Aug 8, 2017

CMDR Crank Larson said:
People regularly ask for missions that are more than just "Move this from a-b", "go shoot this". So, here we have one that actually involves some effort and will take a little time and thought... And of course, people don't like it. The only unbelievable thing about this mission is that the NPC will reappear with full cargo if you leave the instance and find it again (same as salvage missions will respawn).

But it is exactly what you don't think it is not. Move A to B. A being someone else's cargo hold to elsewhere. The effort you mention is based on a stupid mechanic where the dead exist. Dead. Undead. Dead. Undead. Rinse. Repeat. Rinse. Repeat.

System and NPC name changes. That is it.

Nothing new happens.

You feel that is Engaging? Interesting? Fun?

I can roll eyes too. Only my rolling eyes are based on a sane person's response to crappy implementation. Your rolling eyes might be due to early onset or actual blindness.

Crank Larson · Aug 8, 2017

xDreadnoughtx said:
But it is exactly what you don't think it is not. Move A to B. A being someone else's cargo hold to elsewhere. The effort you mention is based on a stupid mechanic where the dead exist. Dead. Undead. Dead. Undead. Rinse. Repeat. Rinse. Repeat.

System and NPC name changes. That is it.

Nothing new happens.

You feel that is Engaging? Interesting? Fun?

I can roll eyes too. Only my rolling eyes are based on a sane person's response to crappy implementation. Your rolling eyes might be due to early onset or actual blindness.

If you've done a particular mission type before, then of course it isn't new. How do you propose that a liberate mission should be implemented? You haven't provided any reasonable argument against the mission except for the fact that you don't like them. In fact, you haven't provided any reasonable argument at all - you are just spewing rubbish.