Look at this!!!!

Nice vid, but needs better foley. Most games that use a walking sound tend to only use 3 surfaces and 4 to 6 steps total before looping.

Good video though. That's not something you can just whip up in an hour.
 
now.....imagine having to do that EVERY TIMR you want to go somwwhere.

it added ZERO gameplay. it wasted minutes of my spaceship flying time not flying a space ship. it did not add any value to the game other than the first time walk through.

why would you want FDev to spend valuable dev time working on tedious eye candy when they could be fixing bugs.

grrat effort on the video but I'm still not a fan of walking around.
As long as there is a "Wahh mah gameplah!" post i will keep posting this.


I saw this posted elsewhere. It's appropriate here.

I'm seeing this weird complex here where people believe that the "space legs" feature probably isn't going to happen, so to come to terms with it, they're trashing the feature as if they'd never wanted it to begin with. It's an interesting neurosis, to say the least. Very "nine-stages-of-grief."

Setting that aside for a second, the kickstarter sold the promise (and I quote) "everything is ready for you to walk around inside your ship," illustrating this with a screenshot of a nicely-detailed cockpit interior. This alone would be a fantastic promise to fulfill. All that "walking around a spaceport and stacking space crates" stuff in Star Citizen is just empty clutter. Walking around my ship, my home in space is not. It's a dream many, many space sim fans have had for years, fulfilling that fantasy of having your very own home in the stars. That's not "filler." That's more or less a required feature given the mood/feeling Elite Dangerous is trying to achieve.

Right now, the ships are just templates - utility slots and hardpoints. Don't get me wrong, I like the customization. However, if your ship has an interior, it becomes more than that, even if it's just part of the aesthetic. Like take my long grind for the FDL as an example: that ship was my penultimate objective from near-day one. I tooled around in my Adder with dreams of the Space Corvette flashing before my eyes. One day, it would be mine. So many months later, when I finally got the scratch for it, I bought it. The hardpoints, slots, and flight characteristics were kind of meh. But it was MY Fer-de-Lance.

My...Fer...wait, that Python has way better internals.

So if your ship is nothing more to you than a set of hardpoints, it's hard to get that connection. It's hard to have that feeling of ownership. Walkable interiors would add a lot to the feeling that you've worked hard to own something, especially if you've got something huge like an Anaconda. Walking around the interior of such a ship, thinking to yourself "this flying palace is mine" would be very satisfying. Now if you could customize that interior with credits-purchased items (and some "premium" variants purchaseable on the Frontier store), it would be even better.

Do you know WHY Star Citizen made its millions? Space legs. Nothing but Space legs. People really, really want the ability to walk around the interior of your ship. More complicated stuff can and should come later, but the very basic aspect of freely walking around the interior of your ship - maybe even the interior of someone else's ship, but even that's just icing on the cake - would do a lot for those of us wanting to enjoy the experience.

The actual internal structure of a ship doesn't have to be drawn unless it needs to be drawn. The sealed door you see at the end of every cockpit/bridge would do the trick perfectly. Amazingly (at least I'm impressed" you can steer your ship right over another player's cockpit and see right through their canopy into their interior, and even see the pilot inside sitting at the controls. It blows my mind. But the interior of the ship beyond that door could be blocked for anyone not actually inside the ship. Culling geometry is not "smoke and mirrors."

I specifically think that any Space Legs content should pointedly be limited to ship interiors for a very long time. There's nothing wrong with putting FPS gameplay on the backburner until the big fundaments are ironclad. I'd just like to see the ship interiors happen soon, as an isolated thing.

I'm totally cool with not seeing space station interiors and planetary EVA and stuff like that until way down the line. We shouldn't need or want to get the whole Space Legs package up front. It's - and I have to quote Shodan here - impractical and unnecessary to expect such a thing. Ship interiors can be the start, and the rest of that "package" can come in a big FPS update sometime in the future.

I'd love to see FPS stuff, but I'm content to wait for it while "ship" stuff gets developed, which I can agree should be a priority (like atmospheric landings). That's the thing though - ship interiors is ship stuff, which should be the single most important element of Elite. It's the polar opposite of Star Citizen, which seems to be more about making goofy-looking monkey humans out of wax and buying designer shirts for them. shudder

So, to address: "Screw Space Legs! I want planetary laaaaaandings! My wants should be the priority!" Okay, everybody wants atmospheric landings. However, what you're asking for is a million times more complicated to implement than simple ship interiors. We all want it, and we all hope it's coming. So chill. No one's saying we should ditch atmospheric landings in favor of anything.

But let's be realistic. Your opinion is that Space Legs add nothing special to the game, that it's aesthetic. Okay, what does atmospheric flight add to the game? Trees, plants, animals (maybe), water, and buildings. Cool. Basically ground props, all cosmetic. Lovely, delightful, immersion-building, but ultimately cosmetic. Unfortunately, that cosmetic effect is going to be very hard to implement to the standards of quality Frontier is committed to. That's not to say it won't happen - it's just saying that it's going to take time and effort, especially with the added pain of instance-based multiplayer.

So, basically, what you want is the aesthetic you personally want and prefer over the aesthetic features other people want and prefer. There's no moral or logical "high ground" here. Saying you don't want Space Legs because you want atmospheric landings is silly - it's just two immersion-based aesthetic game elements, which everyone wants anyway.

Besides, what are graphics in games if they're not cosmetic, aesethetic additions to the experience? We all know how important "graphics" are to people - important enough for some of you to completely tear a game apart because the "special effects" aren't appealing or attractive enough to suit your tastes. Many games today would be functionally the same if they were played entirely through a text interface, omitting graphical elements completely. So complaining that I'd like to enjoy the long-ago promised ability to walk around the modelled interior of my Fer-de-Lance just because that element of the experience is "cosmetic" is puerile.

"Oh, it doesn't add GAMEPLAY" someone said. Immersion IS gameplay. Those creaking and cracking sounds you hear in combat get your blood pumping. They add terror and nerves to the gameplay, ENHANCING the experience far more than your superduper def supersampling, 16 level antialiasing, and super ambient occulsion effects ever will. You could take a lot of those "cosmetic" enhancements from other games, and lose nothing. "You hit the orc. You hit the orc. You hit the orc. The orc dies. You loot the orc. Here's some leveled stuff. Yeah, 'bout what you expected." See, I just played Skyrim without the graphics.

If players view their ships as their home in space, which I'm sure many of us do (I know I'm not the only one), naturally we want it to feel like home. The cockpit just isn't enough, unless of course your argument is that in real life, you'd be comfortable living in a concrete prison cell with a bunk, a toilet, and a sink, because that's technically all you need.
 
now.....imagine having to do that EVERY TIMR you want to go somwwhere.
Not necessarily. The features that you have currently, quickly buying/selling stuff, doing missions, etc, all that can still be accessible from cockpit and you never have to leave the seat. However, for new and added game play that you would do on foot in any other game, like FPS that can't be done sitting in a chair but has to be done in "person", requires this.

it added ZERO gameplay. it wasted minutes of my spaceship flying time not flying a space ship. it did not add any value to the game other than the first time walk through.
So... all the games where you walk around without a spaceship, all of them lack game play? Does RDR2 or Assassins Creed have zero gameplay? There's a lot of stuff that can be added to the game though space legs. I don't think the legs are added to remove or replace, but are rather a door to new things that weren't available before.

why would you want FDev to spend valuable dev time working on tedious eye candy when they could be fixing bugs.

grrat effort on the video but I'm still not a fan of walking around.
Hopefully, if they even are working on space legs, all the things you do today you can still do and can do them the same way as before, and only new game play that you couldn't do before is added through the new mechanics. In other words, if you don't want to use the space legs, then don't. At least that's what I'm hoping for, that it's a choice you can make and not forced to do.
 
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Do you know WHY Star Citizen made its millions? Space legs. Nothing but Space legs. People really, really want the ability to walk around the interior of your ship. More complicated stuff can and should come later, but the very basic aspect of freely walking around the interior of your ship - maybe even the interior of someone else's ship, but even that's just icing on the cake - would do a lot for those of us wanting to enjoy the experience.
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Wall of text. Read most of it. Agree with what you're saying. Just wanted to add, on top of SC making money from the promise of space legs, also consider No Man's Sky, Dual Universe, X4, Hellion, bunches of other games, doing it now. For years we got "fly space ships" and "fight space pirates" games, but the "space legs" games are increasing in numbers, and players buy them. We like it, and we want it. And there's plenty of new stuff that can be added to the game through this new mechanics. Doesn't mean the old mechanics would have to disappear. We can still (hopefully) keep the feature rich menu from the cockpit where most things can be done, while the things you can't do from a chair will be address with the legs-mechanics.
 
About the only thing I'm sure of is the 2020 update will produce copious amounts of salt in these forums, probably from both sides of this camp.
 
I especially like the whole boot up sequence you get when you sit in the cockpit's chair. I'd love to have something similar in game. that when you land you can shut down your ship or so, and when you boot it up again you get that, and the COVAS welcoming the Commander is also a very nice touch.
 
Wow. That's flipping epic work!

The boot up sequence was cool, whilst I can see it could get tiresome, but I think that perhaps just once at each start of a session or ship change would be fine.
 
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Awesome video. Sadly, scale is fundamentally wrong in the game and the graphics are not detailed enough to support such scale (the way you perceive relative scale and distance is tied to details you see and the game is not detailed enough, thus everything seems smaller than the game would like to imply). I don't think we'll ever walk around ships like this because it would make the illusion fall apart. There's not enough geometry detail available for this. The game was simply not designed with this in mind. That said, as a proof of concept it's utterly awesome.
sigh.... never mind. Carry on.
 
Wall of text. Read most of it. Agree with what you're saying. Just wanted to add, on top of SC making money from the promise of space legs, also consider No Man's Sky, Dual Universe, X4, Hellion, bunches of other games, doing it now. For years we got "fly space ships" and "fight space pirates" games, but the "space legs" games are increasing in numbers, and players buy them. We like it, and we want it. And there's plenty of new stuff that can be added to the game through this new mechanics. Doesn't mean the old mechanics would have to disappear. We can still (hopefully) keep the feature rich menu from the cockpit where most things can be done, while the things you can't do from a chair will be address with the legs-mechanics.
True. And it's simple: space legs is what gamers overwhelmingly want. The FD forums are mostly a tiny slice with a strong bias towards the more elderly segment of the community. On Reddit this already got over 200 responses and 1700+ upvotes. The tl;dr? "Hell yeah, we want to walk around!"

https://www.reddit.com/r/EliteDangerous/comments/bvh7sw Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/EliteDangerous/comments/bvh7sw/take_a_walk_inside_my_sidewinder_full_ship/


If I were FD and 2020 does not bring space legs they need to tell us ASAP because the longer this lasts the more disappointed the average person will be with literally anything else.
 
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