[Lore] How does the (solar) system lock actually work?

[Y'Berion]

No real point in trying to rationalize gamist elements. You can enjoy the game and still be immersed in it with out having to have the answers to all the tiny things. You are playing a game where when you die you just respawn.

I know what you mean. EVE's lore also has certain parts which I found somewhat displaced, like for example concept of CONCORD - independent police force who flies undestructible ships armed with weapons so powerful that no one else, except the major NPC factions (see Yulai incident: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v8xAItqMksE... that CONCORD station has been destroyed soon afterwards), can match their firepower. CONCORD was clearly needed from the gameplay's point of view (crime punishment in high-sec areas), but at least CCP provided some background stories to it so that the suspension of disbelief is easier. For the most part Elite is not even trying.

You see, some of us -I am sure I am not the only one- appreciate good lore because it helps a lot to immerse yourself into the game's world. Elite falls short on this field (IMHO) which is a real pity, considering the age of this franchise and how much potential it has. Perhaps EVE spoiled me, but simple "you die - you respawn" is just not good enough for me. In CoD-like games it's okay, but not here.

I hope that Frontier will find some time and money to hire someone to fill in the blanks: sci-fi writers aren't that expensive after all

 

[Commander Debic]

I know what you mean. EVE's lore also has certain parts which I found somewhat displaced, like for example concept of CONCORD - independent police force who flies undestructible ships armed with weapons so powerful that no one else, except the major NPC factions (see Yulai incident: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v8xAItqMksE... that CONCORD station has been destroyed soon afterwards), can match their firepower. CONCORD was clearly needed from the gameplay's point of view (crime punishment in high-sec areas), but at least CCP provided some background stories to it so that the suspension of disbelief is easier. For the most part Elite is not even trying.

You see, some of us -I am sure I am not the only one- appreciate good lore because it helps a lot to immerse yourself into the game's world. Elite falls short on this field (IMHO) which is a real pity, considering the age of this franchise and how much potential it has. Perhaps EVE spoiled me, but simple "you die - you respawn" is just not good enough for me. In CoD-like games it's okay, but not here.

I hope that Frontier will find some time and money to hire someone to fill in the blanks: sci-fi writers aren't that expensive after all

Sorry mate but you die you respawn is common both to Eve and Elite.

 

[Alex Brentnall]

Responding to OP I assume some sort of Mass Effect 2 thing where if you don't have precise enough mapping you end up warping into a star or black hole.
Permit systems could even have the Nav beacons setup to deliberately transmit false data to anyone without the permit sending them into the star or into deep space instead of their destination.

 

[danubezoe]

Unsure about the lore but any system that require the ship computer to Block Access is vunerable, that's why your bank-balance isn't an integer on the magnetic strip on your atm-card. I believe a scrambler or similar on the system in question that prohibit targeting the system to be a better solution.

When, for instance, the guys at Hodack recognises you as an ally a small subspace authentication occur before every jump to stop the scrambler from disrupting the jump.
Such a scrambler might scale to block several systems aswell.

/Eh ... what Alex just said ... here's me taking my time responding

 

[Snarfbuckle]

-Hardcoded CMDR ID within the FSD
-Hardcoded permit list in FSD
-FSD checks CMDR ID with System ID and decides if CMDR is allowed according to the permit list

This would be something easily used for a Crime & Punishment update where hardened criminals could be temporarily locked out of systems by authorities when their list of crimes becomes to bothersome.

 

[Ganos_Lal]

Not permit specific but these videos by Obsidian Ant will give you some background to the lore and major factions.

https://m.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLmX89YRYfWK2nI2NZAS_87PHM4lC1-DyD

He is expanding this history all the time, so keep a lookout for updates.

 

[[HJ]-RedRaven]

Sorry mate but you die you respawn is common both to Eve and Elite.

@CDMR Debic, alas, you are mistaken.

In Eve if your ship is destroyed, your pod is ejected, and you can (hopefully) make a getaway. If your pod is destroyed, at the moment of hull breach, your consciousness is transferred via fluid router to a waiting clone (location generally at your pre-arranged clone-vat pleasure). With any luck you will have paid for a clone capable of housing your learned skills...

In Elite, we are treated to an escape capsule - upon ship death your escape capsule carries the pilot back to the last station successfully docked at.

There is technically no pilot death. Yet.

 

[TimcoTheRokka]

A bit unrelated question but is it possible to travel to another solar system with supercruise?

 

[Futuristic Kung Fu]

A bit unrelated question but is it possible to travel to another solar system with supercruise?

Absolutely not!

 

[Alex Brentnall]

A bit unrelated question but is it possible to travel to another solar system with supercruise?

No, the hyperspace animation hides a loading screen. You can get there but you won't see any planets or anything. It will also not lower the amount of fuel needed to get there. In effect imagine them as distinct islands in space that you can only get between via the loading screen even if you swim in the space where the next island should be.

 

[Dipso]

Here is my theory: A scrambling system similar to the frameshift interdictor technology is in place in the systems that need permits.

Any ship that has not identified properly before targeting the system will get thrown of course trying to head to the restricted system. The system being marked as needing a permit and you not being able to target it is just common sense safety measures.

 

[Jack Schitt]

Elite doesn't have much lore, except for novels recently written by third parties. It's not like Eve Online which has a team of dedicated writers supplying a background to its universe for the last 12 years or so. A lot still has to be worked out.

The initial lore of Elite comes from the original Flight Training Manual from the first game, along with The Dark Wheel novella. They're both quite thin, both physically and in terms of content, but it was enough to drive the imaginations of those who played the game.

The sequels Frontier and First Encounters came with their own background material and collections of short stories, which more or less (although not 100%) dovetailed with what had come before, and tried to explain some of the political and technological changes within the galaxy.

The recent spate of official ED novels were based in part on those previous works, along with "insider" information from FD on how the new game and its background would be structured.

Sadly, the thing that departs most from all of that lore is the game itself. Much of it is a mere shadow of what was originally envisioned (and thus used by the contemporary authors), while major elements that have been added are at best tangential to what came before (e.g. CQC) or at worst completely contradictory (e.g. Powerplay).

The entire thing is a bit of an unholy mess if you ask me, and as a 30 year veteran of all things Elite that saddens me.

 

[Father Cool]

I would prefer that you can jump to a restricted system but are immediately detained by an incredibly tough police force there and asked to jump away. If you don't then you are a wanted criminal in that system and hunted down accordingly. Also no station should give you docking permission. It would be good to try to escape the police and run to an asteroid field or something to hide. Would open up some nice mission possibilities too where you have to retrieve items etc from restricted systems such as intel or photos of facilities for pirate or opposing factions from systems locked out for them. If you had the permit the mission would be easier of course but as punishment the permit could be revoked as soon as the intel is sold on meaning it makes more sense to do the sneak in missions if you don't have the permit in the first place.

As for escape pods, meh, the #1 hate of mine in the game. Eject yes, take you somewhere yes but not magic you back to somewhere potentially 30kly away. I'd like to see at least a shot of you being ejected, better still a 1st person view of it, and then seeing an insurance paid retrieval ship scoop you up and then cut to the nearest station. Here you should then have to A) buy a new ship with your insurance money based on what they have available to buy there or B) hire transport to B1) a nearby system where you can buy what you want or B2) a system where one of your stored ships are. Distance covered is reflected in cost of hire!

 

[OldSchoolPlayer]

I'd like to see at least a shot of you being ejected, better still a 1st person view of it, and then seeing an insurance paid retrieval ship scoop you up and then cut to the nearest station. Here you should then have to A) buy a new ship with your insurance money based on what they have available to buy there or B) hire transport to B1) a nearby system where you can buy what you want or B2) a system where one of your stored ships are. Distance covered is reflected in cost of hire!

I like that idea to hire someone to fly me to a shipyard or take me to one of my stored ships. My insurance should be full comprehensive with option for loan spacecraft.
- OldSchoolPlayer

 

[Sapyx]

Out of Curiosity I just flew to Van Maanens Star in Frontier Elite 2, without the permit
The result
a 4000 Cr fine which I needed to pay before I was allow to dock

No Insta Kill, just the fine, and once paid I could dock, got the fine each time I jumping into the System

Strange, I definitely remember instantly blowing up, the couple of times I tried it. And I'm sure it would have been FE2, not FFE. Perhaps I was simply the victim of one of those bugs that plagued those games, and I attributed the bug-death to my lack of permit.

 

[Agony_Aunt]

sci-fi writers aren't that expensive after all

Rubbish writers are a dime a dozen. Good writers are a rare talent and cost.

 

[Jake_blakeson]

I like to think of permit only systems as having NAV computer scrambling. The system authorities are sending scrambled NAV computer information to all unauthorized NAV computer systems. Since you rely on information in your NAV computer to safely jump to any system without that information it becomes impossible to Jump there. If you get authorization it unscrambles that system in your NAV computer.

 

[Y'Berion]

Sorry mate but you die you respawn is common both to Eve and Elite.

Basically yes, but you might be missing my point. EVE has very well thought-out and intriguing background story built around the ship's destruction which -this is important- reflects in the actual gameplay: escape capsules, or pods, are "physical" objects in game that can be seen, flown and/or destroyed, at which point cloning kicks in (see: https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Capsule). Whilst in Elite we've got almost nothing neither lore or gameplay-wise; all we can do is to speculate.

I would prefer that you can jump to a restricted system but are immediately detained by an incredibly tough police force there and asked to jump away. If you don't then you are a wanted criminal in that system and hunted down accordingly. Also no station should give you docking permission.

I... would actually like this a lot more than the current mechanics. Your ship either get wrecked by local security forces (they could leave you a minute or two to jump away from there, it doesn't have to be an insta-kill), some catastrophic celestial event, aliens... whatever. Or you just can't dock anywhere. This concept is simple, elegant and as you said opens up some interesting options.

 

[Bruce Warren]

Actually we do have something. We have escape pods. it's just that they are no longer visible in game, and no longer flyable. It's an implied mechanic rather than an actual one.

Back in frontier and FFE we had actual escape pods. They couldn't hyperspace and you had to manually fly them back to the nearest station. It's kind of implied that pods are still used in ED. In Michael Brooke's book, it's made clear that firing on an escape pod is considered the lowest crime in space.

The problem is that now the game is multiplayer it's no longer a good idea to have actual in game pods, because players can and would shoot them down, or scoop them up and enslave the poor commander flying them. No matter how dishonorable, it would likely happen all the time.

The only flaw imo is that you now get dumped at the last visited station. Lore wise it would make more sense if you were dumped at the nearest station, since pods shouldn't be able to teleport between star systems.

 

[Father Cool]

I actually quite like the idea of pilotable ones but they are fitted with silent running as standard so never show up on scanners. That way you can still be killed but they would have to be right on top of you to see you so you could in theory sneak by unseen!