Coaster Crazy LWK on Coaster Crazy

LightWarriorK

L
Hey, my account still works here! Great! On to business...

I feel the impulse, whether it's a good idea or not, to comment on Coaster Crazy. I just saw the announcement, and can't watch the trailer yet, but I've been reading what people have been saying (some of whom I do remember from RCT3 days of yore), and mostly about what Michael has said.

My thoughts are thus, take them for what they're worth:
  • If this is done right, we can forget RCT4. Seriously, I could care less who makes the game or what it's called; the best game wins.
  • Never forget the fans. I understand that as game developers that Frontier has a vision, and as mere players we should in part trust that the developers are making a game which we will want to play. That said, when fans bring up points to be addressed, and they are never looked at or fixed, that hurts the game, and in the end it hurts the product. The same happened in the Beta Tests for the RCT3 Expansions, that MANY of the suggestions provided by the testers were completely ignored. It's infuriating.
  • Don't forget the impact of Minecraft. SimCity4 started it with custom buildings, which bloomed into mods that completely redesigned the game. RCT3 has survived ONLY because of the efforts of custom content. Minecraft allows for whole worlds to be built. We CAN'T go back. A coaster-only sim for iOS (and hopefully Android) makes sense, but once on the PC, if full park customization isn't included, this game will fail. Note: How about including a custom building designer? A custom texture importer? A custom theme pack importer/exporter? EMBRACE customization, and make it integral to your game. We will love you for it.
  • If the AI of the park/ride visitors is keeping them from going on the rides, the game is broken. Just an FYI.
  • Limits belong to yesterday. PCs are so much more powerful then they were, and putting size limits on parks, however reasonable, aren't necessary.
  • If a style or type of ride, coaster, or feature that is typically found in RL amusement parks is missing, the game is incomplete
  • Ridiculous themes worked well for RCT1 and RCT2. They didn't for RCT3, hence the massive amount of custom content. Please grow up the themes.
  • Don't be afraid to get really complex. Kids these days can handle Minecraft's redstone, so they can handle a LOT. Feel free to add in programmable rides like Ghost Trains and Jungle Cruises. And 5 or 6 standard set pieces for them won't do....again, the more customization you let US have, the better your game will be.

I don't know if I'm going to be a part of this or not, it's been a long time, but I wish Frontier the best with Coaster Crazy and I wish the fans the best of luck in getting a game that will be more than just iterative of an 8 year old genre. Thanks!

-LightWarriorK
 

sfy

S
watch the trailer, then come back and read the wishlist threads, THEN comment on what they are doing vs what the community has been asking for. quite a difference.
 

LightWarriorK

L
sfy said:
watch the trailer, then come back and read the wishlist threads, THEN comment on what they are doing vs what the community has been asking for. quite a difference.
Click to expand...

The trailer was much like what I expected, and yes, I did read through the wishlists. If there's one thing I've learned when it comes to video game developers, it's that they aren't going to turn 180-degrees just because a few people on the internet are complaining. Even the most community-oriented developers know that the players on the internet represent less than 1% of their market, and we're not paying any more for the game than anyone else. Extreme community input is really only seen in cases where the online community comprises the majority of the market, with games like Minecraft, for example.

I used to make the point many times, that game developers do NOT work for their customers. The customers purchase a game AS IS. Your money goes towards the existing game, and does not afford any past, present, or future rights for forcing a developer to do what you want. The risk they take is that if the game doesn't sell, they go out of business. It's a top-down relationship, NOT a bottom-up.

But Frontier is not an indie developer. They're well trained in what sells, and that is critical to them staying in business. I'm sure their chosen style, ridiculous though it may be or seem, was chosen for a reason. And "cartoony" doesn't equate to "bad;" the RCT series has always been cartoony, and it's always sold very well.

That said, I stand by my points. I feel that Frontier has an opportunity here, and that those of us who love coaster sims (and have had just as much experience playing games as they have developing them) have a lot of good ideas which merit discussion.

There is also a lot of crap flowing in. There always has been and always will be. I remember suggestions on the RCT3 forums where players wanted a FPS view and guns, so they could run around and kill peeps. Insane, and if Frontier took all the suggestions that came their way, their games would be terrible. They wouldn't resemble the game they wanted to make. And in the end, that IS their goal as the creator.

So in some respect, it does make sense to say, "if you don't like the way they're building the game, 1) learn coding and make one yourself, 2) don't play the game, or 3) go whine to Atari about RCT4." However, once again, I do feel that Frontier would be best served to listen to as many of the good ideas as possible.

TL;DR....I trust Frontier to make a game that people everywhere will want to buy and play, possibly exempting a few butthurt people on the internet who didn't specifically get X feature they desperately wanted. However, the wealth of potential community input existing for well over 13 years (since RCT1) should not be completely ignored. We're a good resource, please use us.

So here are some additional things for Frontier to be aware of, IMHO:
  • Build your game, go right ahead. But don't be so prideful so as to ignore all community suggestions. There are some good ones.
  • You're building a coaster sim for iOS. Fine. But that's not enough for the PC, and won't command a high price. Rather, bolster your coaster sim with full theme park implementation, and make it better than the way RCT did it. You know deep down you need to, otherwise Coaste Crazy will be just a memory when RCT4 comes out. I challenge you: take it down.
  • Honestly, don't even worry about making loads of content for said parks. Rather, give us the tools to make our own. Think Spore, but don't be as restrictive as they were:
    [*]Playset Maker - Create theme packs for building from scratch, including importing from SketchUp and other 3D modeling programs.
    [*]Attraction Maker - Similar to the Playset Maker, this would allow players to basically create rides, stalls, and restaurants from scratch, given pre-set attributes that would be selectable and placable. Would include the theming and skinning of coasters.
    [*]Advanced Character Creator - If we're going to be cartoony, at least let us make it our own.
    [*]Advanced Terrain Editor - Full terrain and vegetation modification. Allow for importing new vegetation as made in the Playset Maker
    [*]Etc. - You know what I mean. Just look at what the community has made for RCT3. Again, EMBRACE THE FUTUE.​
  • Don't be like EA or Atari: When there are bugs, fix them. When there are good requested tweaks and features (see my link in the OP), add them. Don't release a paltry few patches that fix a few things but leave much broken or lacking, and don't release expansions that cause more bugs than they fix. Again, look at Minecraft. They're constantly updating the game. 7.6 million purchases for PC and 4 million purchases for Xbox 360 and climbing. Elegant proof of concept for continuing development and support, eh?

In any case, I think Coaster Crazy as shown in the trailer will do just fine for iOS. If it's really then going to be developed further for PC, then it's going to compete with whatever RCT4 Atari has in mind, and Frontier will have it's work cut out for it. All I can say is good luck!:)
 

sfy

S
some great points and ideas in there, lets hope they get listened to. obviously it won't happen with the new game though.
 
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