Modding support

[Aero-Bubbles]

You can’t make new rides in Planco, you won’t be able to make new animals in Planzoo, that part is more than likely fact.

I modded in ZT2 and we were given all the necessary “language” to code with, including coding for animals.

And speaking of ZT2 animals, they were literally cardboard cut outs of each other, Planet zoo has put so much more into creating their animals, I don’t think the average person who mods would be able to replicate animals of that quality.

So unpopular opinion but I’m 100% fine with no mod support

 

[AndyZoos]

The full release isn't even out yet, I don't understand why people are so concerned about being able to mod in animals when they don't even know what's all going to be in the game, let alone DLCs. First animals you would see getting put up are polar bears and penguins... And then what? Frontier loses out on sales for future DLC because yes some people will of course buy it, but there's also a huge expanse of people that will figure "eh I can get it for free, why pay money".

Not to mention I highly doubt any animal released through a mod would be anywhere near Frontier's standard, so why bother? You'd have to know how their fur shaders work, how their inverse kinematics work, how the nav mesh system works, how the personality and animations are going to work, etc etc. ZT2 was no where near the same level PZ is at, so it's not really fair to compare the two.

If they do ever release mod support then I would hope it wouldn't be for years out, when they've moved on from the game. Then yes I can understand a "longevity" aspect of that. But for now when the game isn't even out yet, yes, I do find it a bit selfish for people to demand modding abilities because it does feel like they're disregarding all the work Frontier has done (to clarify, I have no problem with people wanting/asking for it, I'm talking about the people I've seen that have been pretty nasty about claiming Frontier is in the wrong for not allowing modding support for animals).

As for decorations and stuff that would be a nice addition, but animals in particular shouldn't be allowed to be modded in.

These are all really great points, and sort of what I was getting at. The animals here are too detailed to be effectively modded. ZT2 worked because it lacked climbing, had very limited environmental interactions, etc. That's simply not the case herewith animals being able to climb, jump, etc. Far more complex!

That being said, I don't know that anybody is "demanding' the ability to mod the game so much as just... Wishing for it. It would be cool, but if it ever happens it's years and years away... And it probably won't.

I do think it would be great to add/create new items the way you are with PlanCo but that's far away, I would imagine.

Particularly in terms of animals I think Frontier would have understandable concerns about quality control and protecting their reputation - and product.

Aesthetically Planet Zoo looks incredibly beautiful and the animals are all of a very high standard and consistent style and that’s contributing to the enormous excitement building for the launch of the game.

There are some incredibly talented people creating mods for other games but let’s be honest, with no disrespect, there are some who might not have the same standards or ability to keep to the standards set by Frontier in developing Planet Zoo.

ZT2 was a bit different. A lot of the recent modding with animals, for example, has been about fixing the poor appearance of the original animals - often with stunning results - rather than just adding missing species although that was important too. There’s also been incredible game-changing building and foliage sets which really kept the game playable, significantly extending its longevity.

I’m not sure there will be the same pressing need with Planet Zoo even if we don’t get all the species we want straight away.

This is a great point too, in terms of quality (and frankly, depth). It's one thing to update an animal that operates on a relatively linear plane, but beyond the graphics I think the way the animals interact with the environment is pretty complex which would require a whole mess of other revisions...

 

[xTo]

I think the complexity of the animals is hardly an argument why modding would not work. There are some insanely talented teams of modders out there so I'm 99% sure that is some of them came together they would be able to figure something out.
Take Skyrim for example. some teams or even single modders have managed to create entire expansions on par with the original quality of the game. These are very passionate, creative people doing there best to create something the community might enjoy. "Bad" mods will of course be a part of this but those will only be used by the people that want them.

I'm not saying I want modding to be added to the game per se but I do think it would be another creative outlet for the community to mess around with while simultaneously increasing the longevity of the game and providing players with small bites of new content inbetween the DLC's.

Personally I haven't seen people "demanding" mod support and that's not what this post is about. Of course the game hasn't been fully released yet and we don't know what going to be included but that doesn't mean we can't discuss the future possibility of it

 

[LN]

I think the complexity of the animals is hardly an argument why modding would not work. There are some insanely talented teams of modders out there so I'm 99% sure that is some of them came together they would be able to figure something out.

That's the point, these modders not only need to be able, they also need to be willing to go mod this game.
And yes, it probably is possible, but apparantly to much of a hustle.

Games like Cities are very easy to mod, because it's build in Unity, for which even you and me can invest time and learn working with that Engine.

Do you know how to make a mod or not?

 

[xTo]

That's the point, these modders not only need to be able, they also need to be willing to go mod this game.
And yes, it probably is possible, but apparantly to much of a hustle.

Games like Cities are very easy to mod, because it's build in Unity, for which even you and me can invest time and learn working with that Engine.

Do you know how to make a mod or not?

I'm a software developer myself and I've tried my hand at the Unity Engine and the Creation Kit in the past. I am in no way experienced with them though but given enough time and resources I'm confident I could make something viable haha

 

[NL_Mutso]

I think a lot of dedicated modders could pull of some crazy stuff (as mentioned by xTo - Skyrim), but also Ark Survival.

Somewhat think that modding conflicts with future DLC.. If you are skilled modder and create a new animal with the AI of an existing animal. You can create subspecies without paying for DLC. Scenery would work somehow, somewhat conflicting with themed DLC.

And we have an online part (franchise), would't modding allow to more ways to cheat in the online Franchise?
And limiting this only to sandbox could influence activity for online Franchise.

 

[LoneBlind]

I think a lot of dedicated modders could pull of some crazy stuff (as mentioned by xTo - Skyrim), but also Ark Survival.

Somewhat think that modding conflicts with future DLC.. If you are skilled modder and create a new animal with the AI of an existing animal. You can create subspecies without paying for DLC. Scenery would work somehow, somewhat conflicting with themed DLC.

This is mainly where I disagree. If modding were possible it would likely be just reskins/MAYBE remeshes of existing animals, so even if new animals so anyone downloading those mods are just looking for more variety. I think its way more likely that IF possible the modding community would go the same direction as ZT2 or even Skyrim, where almost every mod available actively requires other DLC because of the assets they add that are used by the newly modded animals. There's pretty much no chance anyone will settle for free, not 100% Frontier quality copies of existing animals instead of buying DLC.

And we have an online part (franchise), would't modding allow to more ways to cheat in the online Franchise?
And limiting this only to sandbox could influence activity for online Franchise.

I don't see how this would hurt franchise mode at all so long as modding was turned off in that mode. Could you elaborate?

 

[NL_Mutso]

There's pretty much no chance anyone will settle for free, not 100% Frontier quality copies of existing animals instead of buying DLC.

Really ? To me, this doesn't make any sense. When modders make a Mexican Wolf, Great Plains Wolf and Red wolves and Frontier releases a Wolf DLC.. I think most people would prefer the free version. Why pay for something that's basically the same but free ? Some modders are on the same level as developers..

I don't see how this would hurt franchise mode at all so long as modding was turned off in that mode. Could you elaborate?

If you allow amazing mod buildings & animals in the sandbox and not in online franchise, players they have to make a choice.
A lot of people don't have the time to play both modes and pick their favorite (most people on this forum already made their mind up)
If you allow a lot more freedom in sandbox in mod building&animals options, people will pick the sandbox mode.
(I played Ark and a lot of people picked unofficial for similar reasons - Official was too limited)

But also, If modders were able to create a Marine mod, imagine how many people won't be playing the online franchise.

 

[LoneBlind]

Really ? To me, this doesn't make any sense. When modders make a Mexican Wolf, Great Plains Wolf and Red wolves and Frontier releases a Wolf DLC.. I think most people would prefer the free version. Why pay for something that's basically the same but free ? Some modders are on the same level as developers..



If you allow amazing mod buildings & animals in the sandbox and not in online franchise, players they have to make a choice.
A lot of people don't have the time to play both modes and pick their favorite (most people on this forum already made their mind up)
If you allow a lot more freedom in sandbox in mod building&animals options, people will pick the sandbox mode.
(I played Ark and a lot of people picked unofficial for similar reasons - Official was too limited)

But also, If modders were able to create a Marine mod, imagine how many people won't be playing the online franchise.

I think all of this is making some really generous assumptions that modders would be able to make Frontier-quality level mods in their own time for completely free, BEFORE Frontier themselves would be able to put out their own extremely fleshed out, 100% professional quality, and inevitably much more in depth DLC (Because they have access to the backend of the game's engine) when they're an entire studio of people who get paid to do it as their job. I've no doubt that if allowed modders could do some really nice stuff eventually, but it would take a very very long time. And again, most likely because of the variety it would offer, almost all mods would require DLC rather than being available instead of it.

Even so, all of this is completely hypothetical because its really unlikely that level of mod compatibility will be in the game at all. And as for Franchise mode, in my opinion its a game mode with somewhat limited longevity in the first place. I have no doubt many people will focus on it for a while but in the long term there will likely only be a small community of die-hards still actively playing it as their main mode. And most people like myself likely plan to utilize every game mode anyway, because there is no point in paying for a game and only playing 1/3rd of it :P I don't think there's any worry of out-competing their own game modes anyway...and artificially limiting other game modes for the exclusive purpose of making sure people still play the other ones is a very bad development tactic that would only hurt the long term longevity of the game.

 

[LN]

I think all of this is making some really generous assumptions that modders would be able to make Frontier-quality level mods in their own time for completely free

ALL of this is based on the assumption there is somebody out there that will make a mod anyway.
3 years into Planco and not a single mod. I don't expect a mod for Planet Zoo either.

Maybe first find someone that is willing and able to mod.

Frontier is NOT providing mod tools (other than TMTK). That much can be told on forehand.

 

[LoneBlind]

ALL of this is based on the assumption there is somebody out there that will make a mod anyway.
3 years into Planco and not a single mod. I don't expect a mod for Planet Zoo either.

Maybe first find someone that is willing and able to mod.

Frontier is NOT providing mod tools (other than TMTK). That much can be told on forehand.

I did say that already in the same post you quoted lol. We're talking in purely hypotheticals, assuming they could add mod support and that it has anything to do with community feedback. I don't think they really can, or will. But if they could, I don't see the argument against it.

 

[LN]

I did say that already in the same post you quoted lol. We're talking in purely hypotheticals, assuming they could add mod support and that it has anything to do with community feedback. I don't think they really can, or will. But if they could, I don't see the argument against it.

Lol. Yeah we mean the same.

 

[NL_Mutso]

I think all of this is making some really generous assumptions that modders would be able to make Frontier-quality level mods in their own time for completely free, BEFORE Frontier themselves would be able to put out their own extremely fleshed out, 100% professional quality, and inevitably much more in depth DLC (Because they have access to the backend of the game's engine) when they're an entire studio of people who get paid to do it as their job. I've no doubt that if allowed modders could do some really nice stuff eventually, but it would take a very very long time. And again, most likely because of the variety it would offer, almost all mods would require DLC rather than being available instead of it.

Even so, all of this is completely hypothetical because its really unlikely that level of mod compatibility will be in the game at all. And as for Franchise mode, in my opinion its a game mode with somewhat limited longevity in the first place. I have no doubt many people will focus on it for a while but in the long term there will likely only be a small community of die-hards still actively playing it as their main mode. And most people like myself likely plan to utilize every game mode anyway, because there is no point in paying for a game and only playing 1/3rd of it :P I don't think there's any worry of out-competing their own game modes anyway...and artificially limiting other game modes for the exclusive purpose of making sure people still play the other ones is a very bad development tactic that would only hurt the long term longevity of the game.

For a lot of games there are a good amount of amazing mods (a lot of them are rubbish or not updated properly).
Skyrim/Ark/Xcom2 are just a few that pops up, but some of them are on the same level than devs put out..
I remember the skyrim mods focused on texture/HD quality, were a discussion on why the devs didn't deliver these.. And the building mod which later featured in a DLC.
I agree some mods take time, I think it's amazing what modders can do in a short period of time,.

Offcourse it's hypothetical, we are talking about mods for a game not released yet..
I just included animals, because I'm expecting a high demand for modding animals. Even if you limit it to just structures, imagine the whining on this forum.

Don't get me wrong, I will be playing most game modes, I've seen too many topics and quite a few only care about sandbox or Franchise mode. They will be playing 1/3 of a game. Also a bit surprised about that one..
I agree with longetivity of the Online franchise mode, pretty great that we also get the offline version of this. Will be playing Online franchise at first..

I personally don't need mods for this game.
I like mods in some games but if they decide to add this, I think they should be added when the game is losing interest.
Proper DLC will greatly enhance a game imo.

Also when a game updates, mods tend to bug your savegame, lose stuff/animals or mess up your game in another way.
For those who played Ark on unofficial, they know
If you experienced this a couple of times, quitting the game comes to mind.

 

[NikolaP]

Honestly can't see Frontier will allow making new animals from moders, or even subspecies. Maybe some scenary or themes if there are some group of really tallented and skillful moders but new animals no way. I am expecting tons of animals from Frontier though later through DLC's. I mean depends how much game will hit popularity and sales but I think it will go viral. So many options from them for the future, birds, sea creatures, continent based DLC's with maybe new theme, group species like e.g DLC with primates or cats, or something like nocturnal species.. really plenty of options from them.

 

[AndyZoos]

For a lot of games there are a good amount of amazing mods (a lot of them are rubbish or not updated properly).
Skyrim/Ark/Xcom2 are just a few that pops up, but some of them are on the same level than devs put out..
I remember the skyrim mods focused on texture/HD quality, were a discussion on why the devs didn't deliver these.. And the building mod which later featured in a DLC.
I agree some mods take time, I think it's amazing what modders can do in a short period of time,.

Offcourse it's hypothetical, we are talking about mods for a game not released yet..
I just included animals, because I'm expecting a high demand for modding animals. Even if you limit it to just structures, imagine the whining on this forum.

Don't get me wrong, I will be playing most game modes, I've seen too many topics and quite a few only care about sandbox or Franchise mode. They will be playing 1/3 of a game. Also a bit surprised about that one..
I agree with longetivity of the Online franchise mode, pretty great that we also get the offline version of this. Will be playing Online franchise at first..

I personally don't need mods for this game.
I like mods in some games but if they decide to add this, I think they should be added when the game is losing interest.
Proper DLC will greatly enhance a game imo.

I agree with this as far as modding vs. DLC is concerned. I would much prefer official DLC to user-created stuff, purely based on quality and the ability to be sure that it all works as it should. The mods for ZT2 are great and all, but the number of animals/items I have with wonky menu items is huge. Haha.

I think there's definitely going to be a demand for more animals and foliage, above all else in this game, as far as what people will want out of DLC. And I'm sure Frontier is keyed into this (and if not, I'm sure they will be after the game is released).

Maybe I'm thinking about it wrong (or at the very least, presenting a biased perspective ), but I feel like the demand for additional animals in a game like this... I don't know. It feels like it will just be higher than the new theme sets, rides, etc. that went out for PlanCo. Or even the dinosaurs for JWE. Just based on the buzz around this game--and the way the game functions. The game is already loaded with plenty of tools to create all sorts of unique exhibits. And yes, they can always add more but... What will keep me playing the game is the variety of animals, not so much the variety of shops and buildings (and if I want new one as far as that goes--I can lean on the Steam workshop).

Honestly can't see Frontier will allow making new animals from moders, or even subspecies. Maybe some scenary or themes if there are some group of really tallented and skillful moders but new animals no way. I am expecting tons of animals from Frontier though later through DLC's. I mean depends how much game will hit popularity and sales but I think it will go viral. So many options from them for the future, birds, sea creatures, continent based DLC's with maybe new theme, group species like e.g DLC with primates or cats, or something like nocturnal species.. really plenty of options from them.

Yeah, I think there's a whole lot that Frontier will be able to do as far as DLC is concerned if the game picks up traction... And I think it will be at least as popular as PlanCo, probably more so.

And that's the real motivator, right? How many people play the game and are willing to pay for additional DLC. I think it'll be there in a pretty major way if the buzz in these forums alone is any indication! Here's hoping for years and years of official DLC.

 

[Barje]

personally,for me they can make dlcs as long as theyre adding serious content(max 3 Animals,when our worlds variety allows much,much,much more is meh) i had all zoo tycoon 2 dlcs,and they felt good. Im not that supportive for mods though.While it was easy to copy ZT2 style/make it better. Its near impossible to do such amazing work do we couldnt differ mod Animals from vanilla