I was just looking at the T16000M HOTAS solution myself and I realised I would have had a worse time adapting to the T16000M after using the Warthog precisely beacause of the lack of digital controls on the stick itself. Looks like a decent stick and throttle set, but even with the "braille" markings for the buttons on the base of the stick they would most likely go unused and create mapping problems for me personally. If migrating from a HOTAS-X though, I can see there being much less issues.
Modern HOTAS Options?.
- Thread starter Saltyseadog
- Start date
I understood you perfectly, and your claim is demonstrably false (from an overall device perspective) - the X-56 has a grand total of 7 auto-centering analog axis
- Main Stick X - Pitch
- Main Stick Y - Roll
- Main Stick Twist - Yaw
- Main Stick Thumb Stick X - Lateral Thrusters (L/R)
- Main Stick Thumb Stick Y - Vertical Thrusters (Up/Down)
- Throttle Thumb Stick X - Fore/Aft Thrusters
- Throttle Thumb Stick Y - Spare
There are not many stick/throttle combos with such a high number of analog axis (even the more expensive HOTAS Warthog is lacking in that area) but there are more options available (with your stated desired features) than you are claiming.
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And it has another one, the index finger analog hat on the throttle, which is also self-centering (and clickable).
Most HAT/POV controls (even 8-way ones) are fundamentally digital in nature even though they are self-centering. The X56 has a total of 5 of these (3 on the stick, 2 on the throttle), plus a number of self-centering toggle switches.
The Index finger "analog hat" is probably better referred to as a mini-stick - similar to the Thumb Sticks on the X56 and the nipple control on the Warthog. I have never been a big fan of "index finger" analogue controls, they seem to be rarely placed well enough.
I tried to look up detailed and unambiguous specs for the T1600M HOTAS and was disappointed with what I found - very little clarity. The best description of the T1600M HOTAS was at Trusted Reviews. From that it is clear that my first impressions were pretty much spot on.
- Analog Controls
- Stick X
- Stick Y
- Stick Twist
- Stick Throttle Slider
- Throttle handle
- Throttle Paddles (whether these are one axis like the HOTAS X, two separate axis like the analog paddle buttons on modern game pads, or two linked but opposing analog half-axis like some peddle solutions is still unclear)
- Throttle Index Finger "HAT"/Mini-stick X
- Throttle Index Finger "HAT"/Mini-stick Y
I was seriously considering getting one which is why I tried to investigate the feature set more closely.
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... and I get accused of trolling for pointing out the same thing, at least they were not so rude to you.
Wow!.... That's what I call a juicy price tag!
Is that company from/in Lithuania?
Looks like it by section 18 of their TOC. I am asking because they are in the EU, and they can not offer a 1 year limited manufacturer warranty afaik. It has to be 2 years at least!
...On the throttle. The TM TWCS has all the axis I need on the throttle. Stick is attitude, throttle is vector. That's what I wanted, TM 16000m is the only one with enough in the right place.
FWIW, the Saitek x sets have the better stick for sure. But the throttle wasn't going to do what I wanted so I opted for Thrustmaster. I'm actually not using the whole set; I've got an old Saitek S290 pro that I'm patiently waiting for the death of so I can replace it. I got the TM TWCS and will replace the stick with the 16000m stick when it finally goes as (once I got over the learning curve of the TM software... and how poorly they explain it to you) I quite like the flexibility of. It'll be nice to have the curves on my stick and not just throttle. I might consider another Saitek stick if I could get just that instead of the set, but then again that would mean it wouldn't work with the software I'm already using for the throttle so, alas...
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I use the X56 stick and the TCWS throttle from the T16K hotas. Best of both worlds really
I always wanted an X56 stick, but went for the Thrustmaster t1600.
Can't say anything negative about the new model from Logitech (X56). Some say the price is rather high.
It ain't high. When you get a full set of the t1600m, you even get a pair of rudder pedals, this price is higher.
Setup? Just pick custom profile in ED. Works right out of the box(es) for me. I do have the TARGET installed, but since my keyboard isn't English layout I have to switch if I want to use the application.
So this is what I can tell you about the set so far:
Main stick, USB connection. 8 way hat on top. 16 buttons total, 12 on base and 4 on the stick itself. Small sliding throttle. Twist function on stick.
Hall Effect Sensor (magnetic..), for measuring the position of the stick. The hand rest can be switched between left or right handed. Two sticks can be used at the same time using TARGET software.
Throttle, USB connection. Sliding throttle. Do note it does not have any notch or so for the middle!
Axis: The throttle itself. The built in rudder. A mini stick. "Antenna wheel" (you use the pinkie finger for this one).
A connector for the external TFRP rudder, also this gives you an extra 3 axes.
Small screw under the base for tension adjustment.
14 buttons + 8 way PoV hat. Two 4-way hat switches, 1 push mini stick, one 2-pos. slider. The PoV hat has a button aswell.
The throttle is missin a "notch" that would be something good, so if you want to have it centered you need to find a solution, where you can see it somehow.
Not much to say about the rudder itself. Like the rest it's made of plastic (of some sort). They can be connected either via USB (if bought separate, an adapter is included), or directly to the throttle. They have air-brake features if wanted to be used in say DCS.
Both the joystick and throttle can be mounted to a cockpit with 2 M6 screws/bolts. The threaded holes are "offset" on the bases, so bottom right and top left on both of them.
They might not look like much, but they do the work. And combined with rudder pedals, you get real freedom.
Also, as another forum member said, the throttle sits on "rails" these are lubricated from factory. But not much.
I can strongly suggest silicon based lubricant for it, and much.
Sorry for such a long post.
//SaiZo//
Can't say anything negative about the new model from Logitech (X56). Some say the price is rather high.
It ain't high. When you get a full set of the t1600m, you even get a pair of rudder pedals, this price is higher.
Setup? Just pick custom profile in ED. Works right out of the box(es) for me. I do have the TARGET installed, but since my keyboard isn't English layout I have to switch if I want to use the application.
So this is what I can tell you about the set so far:
Main stick, USB connection. 8 way hat on top. 16 buttons total, 12 on base and 4 on the stick itself. Small sliding throttle. Twist function on stick.
Hall Effect Sensor (magnetic..), for measuring the position of the stick. The hand rest can be switched between left or right handed. Two sticks can be used at the same time using TARGET software.
Throttle, USB connection. Sliding throttle. Do note it does not have any notch or so for the middle!
Axis: The throttle itself. The built in rudder. A mini stick. "Antenna wheel" (you use the pinkie finger for this one).
A connector for the external TFRP rudder, also this gives you an extra 3 axes.
Small screw under the base for tension adjustment.
14 buttons + 8 way PoV hat. Two 4-way hat switches, 1 push mini stick, one 2-pos. slider. The PoV hat has a button aswell.
The throttle is missin a "notch" that would be something good, so if you want to have it centered you need to find a solution, where you can see it somehow.
Not much to say about the rudder itself. Like the rest it's made of plastic (of some sort). They can be connected either via USB (if bought separate, an adapter is included), or directly to the throttle. They have air-brake features if wanted to be used in say DCS.
Both the joystick and throttle can be mounted to a cockpit with 2 M6 screws/bolts. The threaded holes are "offset" on the bases, so bottom right and top left on both of them.
They might not look like much, but they do the work. And combined with rudder pedals, you get real freedom.
Also, as another forum member said, the throttle sits on "rails" these are lubricated from factory. But not much.
I can strongly suggest silicon based lubricant for it, and much.
Sorry for such a long post.
//SaiZo//
I got me an X56 HOTAS, because it has a twist axis on the stick to replace rudder pedals and two analog thumb joysticks, one on the stick and one on the throttle.
I find that with the twist stick it is easy to beat dangerous NPC interdictions even in a Type-9 heavy.
I use DIView.exe to adjust the ranges of the thumb sticks (they have round limits, while Elite has independent x and y limits) to obtain maximal diagonal thrust. I find the switches on these thumb sticks too hard to use though.
I find that with the twist stick it is easy to beat dangerous NPC interdictions even in a Type-9 heavy.
I use DIView.exe to adjust the ranges of the thumb sticks (they have round limits, while Elite has independent x and y limits) to obtain maximal diagonal thrust. I find the switches on these thumb sticks too hard to use though.
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The X-56 has two of them, one on the thumb of the stick, the other on the thumb of the throttle. The analog sticks have round mechanical limits, I use DIView.exe to reduce the sensitivity and get maximum for both axes in the corners. They also have a switch if you push them in, but that is a bit hard to trigger.
Microsoft did make some real quality gaming kit back in the day.
It's a pity they dropped away from that part of the business.
The t16000 turned out to be more expensive in the end because you end up replacing them and buying another one. They break.