Ships Most efficient bounty hunter?

[TheWebmage]

I got back into the game over the last few months and I've finally decided to tackle one of my last major grinds: Combat Elite.

I've tried a few different ships to make this easier and also remedy my questionable flying skills. My old standby is a frag cannon Courier. Shreds hulls decently fast once shields drop, and the cockpit actually looks like a fighter jet, which I love. But I've also tried a few different builds since returning. A pack hound Python, a railgun Viper III, a full thermal shock Clipper... each has been fun to fly. But I was wondering, what build is considered to have the fastest time to kill Dangerous/Elite non-goid NPCs in 2024?

 

[Helmut Grokenberger]

I would guess a Frag Mamba will delete NPCs the fastest, but it might not be the most efficient if you factor in reload time - a Frag Mamba can quickly run out of ammo. Other than that, maybe skill is also a factor; highest theoretical DPS doesn't neccessarily translate into efficient killing if you don't manage to keep your time on target high.

So I'd say there is no definitive answer. Depends a bit on the pilot, their skills and their preferences.

 

[TheWebmage]

I thought a frag Mamba might be it as well. It seems to have the best listed DPS, so I engineered up a corrosive/thermal/screening shell one a few weeks ago, but I just could not get the hang of how (poorly) it handled and turned.

Right now my 4x focused + thermal shock burst laser Clipper seems like it might be my answer. The thermal shock hobbles pirates enough to get an impressive time on target, and the focused lasers tend to pop conda reactors with anywhere from 20% to 50% hull left. But it also needs a large landing pad for whatever reason and the hardpoint convergence is horrible, forcing me to use gimbals. So I can't help but wonder if there's a better build or if the only way I'll take out pirates faster is if I learn to fly full FAOff and aim better.

 

[Helmut Grokenberger]

This is my Frag Mamba. I only take it out these days to roflstomp a low CZ in a team for a giggle for half an hour or so. My frags are all overcharged, and I have incendiary on the three large ones, corrosive on one small and drag on the other. It's great for CZs in a team but it doesn't really have enough ammo for soloing anything but a low. For regular NPCs, it's god mode.

That's the thing of the Mamba: It's a hit and run ship. It's very fast in a straight line (and a little less fast if you armor it up properly), but if you don't delete your opponent on the first load, you just pass, turn around and repeat. It's not made to be glued to the butt end of a Vulture for an extended amount of time. It can circle the bigger whales well enough though.

I used it as a bounty hunter now and then, but only with carrier support. It's travel capabilities are appalling. I've had great success with a Krait II with either three large PAs and two rails, or all PA. Especially all PA is very funny, and with plasma slugs and maybe and extra tank you have indefinite staying power. My combat Krait has 3k armor, 1.4k Bi-Weaves (a bit less when I fit a KWS), a jump range of 32 and a fuel scoop for longer trips. For me it's the ultimate PvE fighter.

But as I said, the "best" might be different from person to person. Although I'm sure someone will come up with a meta and claim you "must" use it to be efficient .

 

[Darrack]

Grind Fed rank for a Corvette, NPCs will just melt before you no matter the loadout.

O7

 

[Helmut Grokenberger]

Grind Fed rank for a Corvette, NPCs will just melt before you no matter the loadout.

O7

I did work my way up to a Corvette and build a basically unkillable PvE battle cruiser in my first year or so of Elite. I'd argue it's the least efficient one, because it's so boring after a while you fall asleep at the wheel .

 

[Helmut Grokenberger]

To clarify my point, as with everything long term in Elite - and getting Elite rank in combat can be a VERY long process - you should fly what is fun and entertains you rather than what's most "efficient". Because if you don't enjoy flying it, you will either hate it after a while, complain about the grind and turn your back on the game, or you will just not do it anymore after a while, complain about the impossibility of the rank grind and turn your back on the game .

Never forget fun, even when "grinding" for something.

 

[Darrack]

I did work my way up to a Corvette and build a basically unkillable PvE battle cruiser in my first year or so of Elite. I'd argue it's the least efficient one, because it's so boring after a while you fall asleep at the wheel .

This is true and why i use my Crusader now

O7

 

[Kayvan]

Yeah, what the Grok said.

Among my ships, what I do best in - and also enjoy the most - is the Chieftain. It's reasonably fast, and very agile even without boosting. And it harmonizes just so amazingly with Powerplay weapons.
I usually run it with 2 Cytos, 2 Pacs, a corrosive MC and 1 small LR beam, the latter mostly to tag targets from far away. The Cytos wreck shields like Large SRB Beams at a fraction of the power draw and heat. The Pacifiers shred corroded hulls as if they were made of toilet paper.
All in all, the ship has something like 100 DPS vs shields (just using lasers) and an effective 300sDPS vs hull. The ammo lasts me just long enough until I've had enough for one session anyway. It is relatively dependent on range control, but still more forgiving than regular frags that will spray over the entire screen.

Alternatively to the Pacs, it also performs very well with Azimuth Plasmas.
There are times I enjoy taking the Vulture for a spin or experimenting with small ships like a DBS or a Courier. But ultimately I always come back to the Chief. ^^

Note: while I do own pretty much every ship up to and including a Corvette, I have never outfitted anything bigger/more expensive than a Krait for combat -- and I decided I just don't like the Krait, or Crate as I like to call it for its handling characteristics. So I figured I'd hate the Vette or the Conda even more.

 

[Galecwulf]

Worked my way up to Dangerous using a Krait Mk II. Go tired of constant having to leave a Hazrez to go patch it up. Finally got my Corvette and finished it out and love it. Using it to grind my way to Elite. It doesn’t matter Dangerous, Deadly or Elite, I can grind them up in little to no time. Only time I have a problem is if I get a squadron of 3 mad at me. It takes a while to get them all and the prismatics are pretty low by then. I use to carry more than 1 shield bank but found I just didn’t need them that much if I’m only doing 1v1 or 2v1.
Whats really helped me out is using Long distance Beam Lazers with Thermal vent. Plus 1 Corrosive multi cannon and 1 multi cannon with an Autoloader.

 

[Kayvan]

The question is, why do you need to patch up the Krait?
I typically fly my Chief with 7-800 shields (Bi-Weaves) and no banks, and can't remember the last time I took hull damage in a RES. And as far as I remember, the Krait has rather stronger shields than the Chief.
As a wild guess, you may have rather low DPS, which ofc is a problem when you engage Wings and can't break them down quickly enough.

 

[Helmut Grokenberger]

My combat Krait has bi-weaves of around 1400, so it can have somewhat strongish shields. The only time I am in danger of dropping shields in a HazRes is when I take on strong wings (Elite and two Dangerous) and can't shake them quickly enough because I cannot land my shots - wings with two dangerous DBS can be very annoying. But for anything but wing assassinations or those massacre POIs where eight ships turn on you at once, the Krait should be pretty much unkillable in PvE.

 

[Galecwulf]

The question is, why do you need to patch up the Krait?

The damage I’m talking about is usually just to the shields. And of course running low on ammo. The build is I believe one I made from one D2EA’s posts. It’s been a couple of years since I built it. It’s a good ship but obviously could be made better with more tweaking. In fact I might go back to it since you’ve piqued my interest. It’s just that the Corvette to me is a great sounding ship and I love the punishment it can take and throw off and keep fighting. And let’s not forget that the pilot (me) is a big part of the equation.

 

[Ashnak]

Define "efficient"
Time to kill, kills per outing or kills per hour?
And, in any case, if you want to grind rank, you'll have to concentrate on Elite opponents - all those other small fry won't advance your rank perceptibly any more after some time. Which is why, at least for some time, 'goid killing was supposed to be the way to go for rank grinding - scouts specifically. They pop easily (with the right loadout) and used to come tagged as "Elite" opponents.

But since you specified the fastest TTK for non-goids, I'd propose a triple Pacifier (fully engineered) Krait Mk.II. The Krait Mk.II is agile enough to get most larger opponents within range of the Pacs, and any opponent agile enough to give you a headache can be dealt with a couple of gimbals or turrets on the chin mounts (I prefer beams here, but MCs work as well).
The downside is, of course, that those Pacs go through their ammo at least as fast as they go through NPC's hulls (especially with the rapid fire/screening shell engineering), and it can be a real downer to run out of ammo just when that juicy pirate Type-10 jumps in to join the fun (from stacking delivery missions) and you need to kill that one with a couple of efficient beams...

 

[Galecwulf]

My combat Krait has bi-weaves of around 1400, so it can have somewhat strongish shields. The only time I am in danger of dropping shields in a HazRes is when I take on strong wings (Elite and two Dangerous) and can't shake them quickly enough because I cannot land my shots - wings with two dangerous DBS can be very annoying. But for anything but wing assassinations or those massacre POIs where eight ships turn on you at once, the Krait should be pretty much unkillable in PvE.

That’s exactly what I’m talking about. I never intended to knock the Krait Mk II. It really is a good ship, I just like the Corvette better.

 

[Northpin]

The Vette is still the most efficient to chain kill everything seconded by the Conda
Make sure you use an all beams setup, eventually with 1 corrosive MC and helped by a multicannons SFL - and you can go non-stop killing with no need to rearm (mc refills are really cheap if going for a corrosive mc in the setup)

A different approach is to use a mixed setup: 2 huge fixed long range burst lasers, 3 beams, 2 small high capacity corrosive MC (used one at a time for ammo conservation) also helped by (this time) a fixed pulse laser SLF.
The 2 huge fixed long range bursts can act like ammo-less repeater-rails (imperial hammers) - they can really wipe out enemies PP from 6 km away.
But this setup works best at range

 

[Aleks Zuno]

But I was wondering, what build is considered to have the fastest time to kill Dangerous/Elite non-goid NPCs in 2024?

It has been the Mamba with Fragment Cannons for a while, with which I achieved several top ten combat Community Goals, and one confirmed first place after Frameshift Live started revealing them. The concise reason is that the Mamba reduces time between encounters by moving the largest weapons around at the fastest speed, though to answer for @TheWebmage these excellent points a bit:

I would guess a Frag Mamba will delete NPCs the fastest, but it might not be the most efficient if you factor in reload time - a Frag Mamba can quickly run out of ammo. Other than that, maybe skill is also a factor; highest theoretical DPS doesn't neccessarily translate into efficient killing if you don't manage to keep your time on target high.

Definitely ammunition efficiency is lower if the Mamba pretends to be a Chieftain and uses all Fragment Cannons, and very low if one uses the very fun Rapid Fire version, but I find my usual loadout efficiency to be very good with class 4 Beam Laser and class 1 Cytoscrambler. At present I use Inertial Impact with a lot of stabbing and grappling to remove shields without spending the lovely Fragment ammunition.

The question of its ammunition efficiency arose once in the context of Conflict Zones; after I started using the Cytoscrambler, I found that it could complete two High Intensity zones without restocking. To demonstrate this, I recorded a High zone versus Spec Ops while using no more than half ammunition, admittedly using it a bit more reservedly. It is faster and more economical without enemy Spec Ops, and even more so with allied Spec Ops.

Indeed pilot skill and knowledge is also very, very much a factor—I consider gear-boosting to be required for Mamba agility! A gear-boosting Mamba is a wonderful combination, because:

• The Mamba has around the highest boost acceleration and duration at 380 m/s² and 3s, two quantities which are overlooked almost universally, but both of which contribute to agility in a way which is not captured by existing agility measures. They are there to be used!
• All the Mamba hardpoints deploy upwards, unlike with the Fer-de-Lance and how its landing gear blocks the class 4 hardpoint physically. As an aside, having all hardpoints deploy upwards is also very nice for their gimbal arcs overlapping well and allowing both Fragment Cannons to strike a Power Plant at short focus.

A good example is here, where one gear-boost with an early retraction results in a controlled flip plus well over 400 speed in the new direction.

I hope at least some of that becomes inspiring!

 

[Kayvan]

Ah right. ^^ I do intend to fix up a Mamba one of these days and try it out. Only tried it stock once around the station and was appaled by the non-existent maneuverability. Although the design is very nice -- much prettier than this mix of a bowling shoe and a clothes iron that is the FDL.
My tendency is to try it out with Pacifiers, but I'll have to see about the details.
Now that's a good new project for this week. =)

 

[xxx]

I would toss a 4 SRB plasma slug rail and 1 TV beam Mk2 into the mix. Pretty solid alpha strike if you get 2 to 3 shots off first. Lasts forever in a Haz Rez and super quick reloads at a CNB. You can fiddle with the internals to get shields and hull to where you like them and the option to include a fighter if want to bring a AI pilot or friends along is nice.

 

[Aleks Zuno]

I feel always quite mixed regarding the Fighter Hangar—as a pilot who stabs targets a lot, that module space feels as if it would result in greater destructive means if it were simply more shielding, be it Cell or Guardian. There is a case for preferring the fighter with a Krait 2 because its weaker boost makes stabbing less consistent, and indeed a counter-case for preferring more stab-ammunition shielding because its stab is that much more heavy than with the Mamba!

Not to disappoint the Krait 2 club though, here is a mostly Incendiary Multi-cannon video!