Engineers Multi-Cannons - Experimental Effects Question: Corrosive vs Incendiary

So trying to figure out the best type of experimental (if any) for my 4x2F Multi-cannons.

All the MC's have G5 Overcharged to them. One of them has Corrosive Shells and want to know what to use for the other 3.

I've heard that corrosive doesn't stack so there's no point in wasting that on the other MC's. Is that true? If so, would it be useful to use Incendiary Rounds on the others? Or should I just leave the other MC's as is without any experimental effects on them?

I've also read that Incendiary Rounds got the ax in previous updates, so as of 2.3, are they worth it? Plus in older posts they state they raise your own heat, but the description in the actual game doesn't say anything other than it increases damage and converts a large portion to thermal which I assume is against the targeted ship.

Thanks
 
1. yes, you only need one corrosive MC to distribute the debuf.
2. yes, incendiary MC raises your heat and depletes your WEP capacitor like a laser would. They also have lower DPS.
Personally I don't like them. I'd rather take one or two lasers to deal with shields and let the MCs to be good at what they're good at - shredding hulls.
 
This is just my opinion, I don't try to over-analyze engineering effects. :)

I had an incendiary effect on a C3 MC (on a Vulture), but found it a waste of space as all that thermal effect makes it very efficient against shields, but seemed to make it weak on hulls, and I had a laser on the Vulture for shields so it was redundant. In the end I moved that to a Python in place of a large laser, and find it works well there.

I have upgraded other MC's (C2 and C3) with corrosive, and IMO they eat through hulls after I have taken shields down with thermal weapons, so that is my preferred special effect.
 
Ok good to know before I added it to my other MC's. I've only upgraded one with Incendiary so far, but now at at McQuinn right now. I'm wondering if I should just re-roll it or keep it then. Might try the auto-loader, if it doesn't reduce the clip size too drastically, though with G5 Over-charged already, thinking I don't want to take any more of a hit off of it if I can help it...
 
Ok good to know before I added it to my other MC's. I've only upgraded one with Incendiary so far, but now at at McQuinn right now. I'm wondering if I should just re-roll it or keep it then. Might try the auto-loader, if it doesn't reduce the clip size too drastically, though with G5 Over-charged already, thinking I don't want to take any more of a hit off of it if I can help it...

the bottleneck will be the corrosive.
 
I use multicannons as the primary weapons on all of my ships, all with grade 5 overcharged rounds and either incendiary or corrosive experimental effects so I can probably help with some of the advantages and disadvantages of either weapon option.

So trying to figure out the best type of experimental (if any) for my 4x2F Multi-cannons.

All the MC's have G5 Overcharged to them. One of them has Corrosive Shells and want to know what to use for the other 3.

I've heard that corrosive doesn't stack so there's no point in wasting that on the other MC's. Is that true? If so, would it be useful to use Incendiary Rounds on the others? Or should I just leave the other MC's as is without any experimental effects on them?

For PVE combat the choice is really between corrosive or incendiary. Emissive rounds are useful for PVP to stop players from disappearing by going into stealth mode, but NPCs don't use stealth, and the other MC round effects are not particularly useful to have on a single weapon (i.e., auto-loader, smart rounds, etc. don't help much on individual weapons unless your entire build is based around them).

In terms of deciding between incendiary and corrosive, I would think of them almost like completely separate weapons.

Incendiary multicannons are essentially like plasma repeaters, they inflict thermal damage and generate high heat. They're very useful against shields and less useful against hull compared to regular multicannons. The main drawback is that they have 3X normal heat gemeration (shown in outfitting as a 200% thermal load increase). I generally try to use 2/3 of my multicannon loadout with incendiary rounds on most ships to ensure that I can take shields down effectively.

Corrosive muulticannons inflict kinetic damage and are better than incendiary rounds against hulls, plus they generate a corrosive effect that increases hull damage to the affected ship by 25%. The corrosive effect lasts 5 seconds and doesn't stack, which is why many players only use a single corrosive. The drawback to corrosive rounds is that ammo capacity is decreased by 20% from 2100 rounds to 1680 rounds. I generally try to use 1/3 of my multicannon loadout with corrosive rounds on most ships. If I only have a single large or huge hardpoint (such as the Diamondback Explorer or FDL) then I usually put the corrosive rounds on the largest multicannon to ensure that I don't lose the kinetic hull damage against large ships.

In terms of optimal loadout, most players will suggest a single corrosive multicannon and the rest with incendiary rounds, but there are a few issues where this won't always be optimal. First, you want to ensure that you keep enough corrosive multicannons that you can still do enough hull damage and on some ships this might involve using more than one corrosive multicannon. This is really just to preserve the kinetic hull damage (since the corrosive effect itself doesn't stack) but other than the ammo capacity reduction there's no other drawback to the corrosive rounds so in most cases you might as well add the effect if you're not using incendiary rounds (plus you can chose to fire corrosive multicannons only once shields are down which generally makes up for their lower ammo capacity). The second issue is that on some ships using widely-spaced or poorly-positioned hardpoints for corrosive multicannons can run into issues with convergence or field of fire where the weapon is only firing part of the time. This means you will be potentially losing that 25% hull damage bonus and having a second corrosive multicannon to improve the firing arc means you will always have at least one multicannon with corrosive rounds able to hit the target. The third issue is that FD has said that they want to re-work how corrosive weapons work to make it beneficial to have more than one corrosive weapon. They haven't given any timeline or details for this but eventually it might be beneficial to have multiple corrosive weapons and this is another good reason to incorporate more than one of them into your weapon loadout.

I've also read that Incendiary Rounds got the ax in previous updates, so as of 2.3, are they worth it? Plus in older posts they state they raise your own heat, but the description in the actual game doesn't say anything other than it increases damage and converts a large portion to thermal which I assume is against the targeted ship.

I use incendiary multicannons as the primary weapon on all of my ships so I have followed the changes quite closely since incendiary rounds were introduced. I usually combine them with corrosive rounds but I do have some ships, such as my Vulture, which are armed entirely with overcharged incendiary multicannons as that happens to fit my overall loadout best. The incendiary rounds (as well as the overcharged mods themselves) went through a number of nerfs which are rather complicated, but I can summarize all the changes for you.

Incendiary rounds when originally introduced in 2.1 were quite useful when combined with the overcharged mod because they converted most of the damage to thermal but also retained an additional 20% kinetic damage. Effectively they had 20% "bonus" kinetic damage compared to regular multicannons which offset much of the reduced hull damage from being converted to primarily thermal damage. This meant they were good against shields but didn't actually lose much hull damage as the extra 20% kinetic damage made up for much of the thermal vs. kinetic drawback against hulls. This original version had no effect on increasing heat generation and this is the factor that made them rather OP compared to other weapon options. This original version, however, only lasted a short period of time from 2.1 and 2.1.02 before being dramatically nerfed by FD shortly afterwords. They were essentially seen as being the most effective weapon overall as they could generate high shield damage as well as good hull damage for minimal thermal load and capacitor draw.

The second version of incendiary rounds, i.e., the first incendiary nerf, was introduced in the 2.1.03 patch and involved increasing the heat by 3X (200% increase) and decreasing the ROF by 10%. Essentially they still inflicted significant shield and hull damage (despite the slightly 10% ROF reduction) but their use was now limited primarily by heat buildup. This was a substantial issue for many ships as the ROF was still high enough that it could overheat some ships rather quickly. The overall dps vs. the original version of the weapons however was only reduced by around 10% which was due entirely to the ROF reduction and they remained effective weapons against both shields and hulls despite the reduced ROF. This was probably the most "balanced" version of the incendiaries as they remained powerful weapons but required builds that could deal with the high thermal load. Subsequent versions of incendiaries were nerfed to make them less effective weapons overall (especially against hulls) as part of the overall goal of weapon "rebalancing" that occurred during the 2.2 patch.

The third version of incendiary rounds, i.e., the second incendiary nerf, was introduced in the 2.2 patch and involved removing the additional 20% kinetic damage (that it originally received as "bonus" damage compared to regular multicannons) and improving the ROF from a 10% penalty to a 5% penalty. Essentially this reduced the overall damage by around 15% again compared to the nerf in 2.1.03. In this case the dps reduction was due to reducing the extra 20% kinetic damage and was slightly offset by improving the ROF by 5%, which overall meant that the damage was around 15% less overall. The incendiary rounds were still an effective weapon but now were much less effective against hulls. They had essentially become specialized as thermal weapons at this point making them function much like plasma repeaters overall due to the loss of the kinetic damage against hulls.

The fourth version of incendiary rounds, i.e., the third incendairy nerf, occurred with the 2.2.03 patch. It wasn't actually a direct nerf to incendiaries but was rather a dramatic nerf to the overcharged mods that incendiary rounds were generally used in combination with. This involved a slight increase in damage of 5% to the overcharged mod blueprint but also a complete removal of the ROF increase from the blueprint which had previously contributed around 15-20% of the overcharged dps bonus. The incendiary rounds however still retained their 5% ROF penalty (relative to normal rounds) and were hit particularly hard by the loss of the overcharged ROF bonus. There was also a variable clip size penalty applied to overcharged mods as well. Effectively this combination of changes decreased the dps of incendiary rounds by another 15% overall when applied to overcharged mods. The removal of the ROF increase for overcharged mods had the slight benefit of making the heat from incendiaries somewhat more manageable but the overall dps reduction also made incendiary rounds even less useful against hulls.

It's worth mentioning that corrosive rounds were also hit by the effects of the overcharged blueprint nerf in 2.2.03 as well, but since most builds only included one or possibly two corrosive multicannons the impact was less noticeable on those weapons compared to the impact it had on incendiary rounds. There's also the issue that the new rapid fire mods remained a possibility for re-rolling corrosive multicannons but were very suboptimal for incendiaries due to the impact that relying on a ROF-based blueprint had on heat generation, not to mention that the changes to heat mechanics and the increase in module damage from overheating made it even more important to be able to manage the increased heat from incendiary rounds. You could possibly consider the heat mechanic changes a "fourth incendiary nerf" but only indirectly as the heat changes really affected SCB use more than they impacted incendiary rounds (especially since you can simply stop firing temporarily to reduce heat buildup but can't stop a SCB once you're triggered it).

If you go overall all of the incendiary round changes and compare their dps when originally introduced they went down a total of around 35% in terms of their dps from their introduction in 2.1 to the most recent nerf in 2.2.03. This occurred in a series of stages where they first lost 10% ROF, then 20% kinetic damage, then regained 5% ROF. They finally lost a massive 15-20% ROF and gained a slight increase of 5% to base damage from the overcharged mod changes. Overall that makes them around 65% less effective then when originally introduced. They are still useful weapons but compared to corrosive rounds, which retain full damage against hulls, plus have 5% better ROF and the corrosive 25% hull damage bonus, they are really primarily useful against shields instead of being a true "multipurpose" weapon at this point.
 
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Thanks for the detailed explanation and clearing a lot of things up with regards to the nerfing of the Incendiary rounds. I guess the big thing was explained that I can't stack corrosive anyways do now the question is not between that and Incendiary, but if it's worth getting the Incendiary rounds in the first place. I noticed the drop in DPS and with my FDL and a 4A (gimbled) Beam I really don't have issues taking down shields and need more power to take out the hulls instead which is the opposite of what the Incendiary rounds would do.

So think right now it's best not to have anything on my MC's (other than the one that already has corrosion on it) then and just leave them be as I want the most fire power possible. Plus it saves me from having to save the mats for the G3-4 weapons every time I manually add the effect on my weapons. The G5 overcharged that I have on all my weapons draws enough heat as it is, and sometimes in heavy combat I can get a bit high with the heat, so Incendiary would just add more to that.

But still great to know how the details of how these work...
 
Thanks for the detailed explanation and clearing a lot of things up with regards to the nerfing of the Incendiary rounds. I guess the big thing was explained that I can't stack corrosive anyways do now the question is not between that and Incendiary, but if it's worth getting the Incendiary rounds in the first place. I noticed the drop in DPS and with my FDL and a 4A (gimbled) Beam I really don't have issues taking down shields and need more power to take out the hulls instead which is the opposite of what the Incendiary rounds would do.

So think right now it's best not to have anything on my MC's (other than the one that already has corrosion on it) then and just leave them be as I want the most fire power possible. Plus it saves me from having to save the mats for the G3-4 weapons every time I manually add the effect on my weapons. The G5 overcharged that I have on all my weapons draws enough heat as it is, and sometimes in heavy combat I can get a bit high with the heat, so Incendiary would just add more to that.

But still great to know how the details of how these work...

If you already use a class 4 beam laser on your FDL then it would make sense to go with normal rounds on the remaining medium overcharged multicannons. It definitely isn't worth putting four corrosive multis on the FDL but you might consider two corrosive multis on the left and right to ensure that you have at least one corrosive multicannon firing at any given time.

When I was outfitting my FDL I was determined to make incendiary rounds work (this was prior to the most recent nerf) and I currently use 4X medium incendiary multicannons combined with a class 4 corrosive multicannon. The medium incendiary multis are particularly effective against small and medium ships as they strip the shields very fast and still inflict decent hull damage against smaller ships. The class 4 corrosive multi ensures that I use the huge hardpoint for a weapon with kinetic damage as this helps quite a bit against medium and large ship hulls. The reduced ROF for the class 4 multi compared to the class 2 multis counterbalances the reduced ammo capacity of the corrosive mod nicely as well. Effectively I can fire all 5 multis continually and they all tend to run out of ammo around the same time so there's no need for me to optimize the firegroups at all for when I'm taking down shields vs. hull. The issue here is that when I first tried this build I overheated in around 5-10 seconds of continuous fire. I was going to give up on the build as unworkable due to heat issues but noticed that some of my incendiary multis had reduced thermal load secondary effects that in some cases significant reduced the impact of the incendiary thermal load effects. I eventually got a full set of four medium incendiary multis which each had around 30-35% reduced thermal load prior to applying the incendiary rounds which basically meant that the overall thermal load was doubled rather than tripled which was much more mangeable. I was outfitting my FDL as a stealth-capable build so I had also put a low emissions power plant and clean drive tuning to improve the thermal load as well and now I can fire all my weapons continuously without overheating. The issue here is that I was already rolling a large number of medium incendiary multis for my other ships so I could select only the ones with reduced thermal load to use for my FDL build. This also required discarding rolls with thermal load penalties as secondary effects (which occurred about as frequently as the reduced thermal load secondaries) as adding additional thermal load on top of the incendiaries was generally unsuitable unless the penalty was quite small (i.e., 5% or less). This means that I had to roll at least 20-30 mods to get a set of four medium multis with reduced thermal secondaries and that required a fair bit of MEF and zirconium for the grade 5 overcharged mods, not to mention the other mats needed to re-grind rep lost from favors to select the incendiary rounds. This really wouldn't have been worthwhile to attempt except that I was using the incendiary multicannons I was generating for my other ships so I was going to be making the rolls anyways. Otherwise if I were just relying on standard medium incendiary multilcannon mods for my FDL build it really wouldn't have been feasible going with a full set of four medium incendiary multis due to the heat issues that would have dramatically limiting the firing time.

The other issue that makes my current build not really worth the effort to create it in 2.3 is that with the grade 5 efficient laser blueprints you can produce energy weapons with moderate heat buildup and capacitor draw that have very similar performance to incendiary multicannons. This effectively comes very close to what I'm currently achieving with the incendiaries on my FDL with their reduced thermal load secondaries. I actually think that an efficient pulse laser build would replicate a good equivalent to my current multicannon build quite well and would have the added advantage of not being ammo-dependent. If I had to rebuild my FDL loadout again I would probably go with 4X medium efficient pulse lasers combined with an overcharged corrosive multicannon on the huge hardpoint. I have actually been tempted to try this build to see how close it comes to what I currently use but the main drawback here is finding the proto heat radiators and cadmium to generate the efficient mods. The cadmium can be obtained from gathering planetary mats in the SRV but I haven't found a reliable way to get all the proto heat radiators I would need to generate top-end efficient laser mods. I have a lot of experience in doing base runs to get MEF for the overcharged mods which is why I'm still using overcharged incendiaries on most of my ships instead of switching to efficient pulses as I can get the mats for overcharged mods relatively efficiently. The lack of ammo dependence with pulse lasers would be a nice benefit on many of my ships however and if I ever find a good way to get proto heat radiators I will probably experiment a bit with efficient laser builds as an alternative to incendiary multis.
 
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I use one main mod on my MC's, the HICAP. It increases the magazine and total capacity quite substantially which in practice results in continuous fire on target (I have 4 MC's on my Corvette and all MC's on my Python).

The other benefit is that neither ship will overheat and both can run 402 pips for better shield protection. If you need thrust just re-arrange the pips temporarily to recharge engines.

I have a corrosive fixed 4MC and a incendiary gimballed 4MC on the Corvette and this balances the lesser ammo effect of corrosive as I tend to focus targeting w/ the gimballed 4MC and use a 2nd trigger to bring the corrosive into action.

I think it would be nice to have an armor-piercing round as the standard round as IRL then add corrosive and thermal/tracer as mods.

To Devari:

I'm surprised that you can't find proto heat radiators, that is all I find when looking for the other proto materials, I find them in bunches of 4 and 3 in anarchy, boom, ag/tourism, hi pop, independent, hi-sec.
 
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To Devari:

I'm surprised that you can't find proto heat radiators, that is all I find when looking for the other proto materials, I find them in bunches of 4 and 3 in anarchy, boom, ag/tourism, hi pop, independent, hi-sec.

I used to find proto heat radiators frequently as well during 2.1 and 2.2 and I had stockpiled around 20-30 of them from prior activities. I recently used them all up however from rolling efficient beam lasers for some of my ships plus several attempts at the grade 5 the thermal resistant armor mods (I use a thermal resistant armor mod combined with reactive surface composite for the stealth builds on my FDL and Asp Scout and have ended up going with the grade 4 mods but had already used my remaining proto heat radiators on some grade 5 rolls). For some reason I haven't been finding proto heat radiators anywhere since 2.3 dropped despite checking a lot of USSs. Even encoded emissions USSs don't seem to drop them any more. Apparently they do show up in high grade emissions USSs but I haven't come across any of those for a while so I will have to start looking specifically for high grade emissions USSs. I actually still have a good supply of cadmium from prior SRV mat gathering so it's really just the proto heat radiators that are limiting for me right now.
 
If I had to rebuild my FDL loadout again I would probably go with 4X medium efficient pulse lasers combined with an overcharged corrosive multicannon on the huge hardpoint..

running 3 efficient beams and 1 efficient pulse + huge corrosive MC on my FDL... brilliant.
 
running 3 efficient beams and 1 efficient pulse + huge corrosive MC on my FDL... brilliant.
Does sound like just about the most effective loadout. I couldn't run it for aesthetic reasons... my aim, once I engineer up, is a huge fixed beam, then four multi-cannons, two with corrosive, because:

1. That Huge slot being a multi-cannon always strikes me as ugly and disappointing. If it's kinetic, it has to be a cannon! Huge multi-cannons just don't feel punchy enough for me.
2. Second corrosive for bloody symmetry. : /

I envy those of you who can handle an asymmetric loadout.
 
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1. That Huge slot being a multi-cannon always strikes me as ugly and disappointing. If it's kinetic, it has to be a cannon! Huge multi-cannons just don't feel punchy enough for me

The class 4 multi is actually quite a nice gun (both aesthetically and functionally) as it actually uses a unique reciprocating quad-barrel design. Rather than being a gatling weapon (like all the smaller multicannons) it fires with two of its four barrels simultaneously. The action uses the recoil from the firing of each pair of barrels to load the alternate pair, meaning that the shots will alternate between the top and bottoms barrels as you fire. It's still a multicannon (as it uses multiple barrels) but the reciprocating design uses relatively larger-calibre rounds with a lower ROF. This has quite a solid "feel" to it (since you're firing two large shots at the same time) and also avoids the spin-up time of the smaller gatling multicannons. This means that as soon as you pull the trigger it will fire without any delay. It really is sort of a cross between the gatling multis and the larger cannons and fills a rather unique "niche" in terms of the kinetic weapons.
 
Does sound like just about the most effective loadout. I couldn't run it for aesthetic reasons... my aim, once I engineer up, is a huge fixed beam, then four multi-cannons, two with corrosive, because:

1. That Huge slot being a multi-cannon always strikes me as ugly and disappointing. If it's kinetic, it has to be a cannon! Huge multi-cannons just don't feel punchy enough for me.
2. Second corrosive for bloody symmetry. : /

I envy those of you who can handle an asymmetric loadout.

FDL has 4 Efficient Pulse Lasers but the Grades are 3-4. That's not the issue though. The actual issue is that it's 3 on one side and 4 on the other. More on point though. I have a Grade 4 Rapid Fire Corrosive Multicannon and get 36.8 DPS out of it. Plus, Anacondas and Clippers aren't an issue for my FDL due to the damage increase from the shells and the Rapid Fire mod firing 4.6 rounds per second.
 
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Does sound like just about the most effective loadout. I couldn't run it for aesthetic reasons...

a very valid reason :D

for me it is about the same ... i love the muffled sound in a FDL cockpit, and running as many beams as possible adds to luxury combat sound experience.... need to look into 5 efficient beams ... but i don't think that would be in any way functional...
 
I was finding the large Beam and 4 MC's were taking down other ships faster than my modded out large MC and 4 pulse's. I have the pulse's and MC now stored in case I want to go back to it, but was finding it was faster with the other loadout instead. I haven't tried the All-Pulse build at all, but don't think it would do more than the large Beam/4xMC.

Of course maybe I'll try out the 3xbeam, 1xpulse and the large MC and see how that works too, but currently with the large beam, shields aren't a problem, and I need more damage to hulls than anything else which is what is the slow part...
 
I too have worked on some alternatives to the all Incendiary MC (+1 Corrosive of course) build in PvE and came up with 1 Huge MC (Cor) and 4 Med Focused Burst. Based on my time on target, this has been more effective than the 5xMC build or the 1xBeam/4xMC builds. The focused mod makes the medium burst hit hulls like a large weapon due to increased armor piercing and the damage falloff increase keeps full damage of the energy weapons out to a greater distance. On paper, it's probably slightly less damage against small/med targets (which die quickly anyway) but against the rest, it feels stronger.
 
I use multicannons as the primary weapons on all of my ships, all with grade 5 overcharged rounds and either incendiary or corrosive experimental effects so I can probably help with some of the advantages and disadvantages of either weapon option.



For PVE combat the choice is really between corrosive or incendiary. Emissive rounds are useful for PVP to stop players from disappearing by going into stealth mode, but NPCs don't use stealth, and the other MC round effects are not particularly useful to have on a single weapon (i.e., auto-loader, smart rounds, etc. don't help much on individual weapons unless your entire build is based around them).

In terms of deciding between incendiary and corrosive, I would think of them almost like completely separate weapons.

Incendiary multicannons are essentially like plasma repeaters, they inflict thermal damage and generate high heat. They're very useful against shields and less useful against hull compared to regular multicannons. The main drawback is that they have 3X normal heat gemeration (shown in outfitting as a 200% thermal load increase). I generally try to use 2/3 of my multicannon loadout with incendiary rounds on most ships to ensure that I can take shields down effectively.

Corrosive muulticannons inflict kinetic damage and are better than incendiary rounds against hulls, plus they generate a corrosive effect that increases hull damage to the affected ship by 25%. The corrosive effect lasts 5 seconds and doesn't stack, which is why many players only use a single corrosive. The drawback to corrosive rounds is that ammo capacity is decreased by 20% from 2100 rounds to 1680 rounds. I generally try to use 1/3 of my multicannon loadout with corrosive rounds on most ships. If I only have a single large or huge hardpoint (such as the Diamondback Explorer or FDL) then I usually put the corrosive rounds on the largest multicannon to ensure that I don't lose the kinetic hull damage against large ships.

In terms of optimal loadout, most players will suggest a single corrosive multicannon and the rest with incendiary rounds, but there are a few issues where this won't always be optimal. First, you want to ensure that you keep enough corrosive multicannons that you can still do enough hull damage and on some ships this might involve using more than one corrosive multicannon. This is really just to preserve the kinetic hull damage (since the corrosive effect itself doesn't stack) but other than the ammo capacity reduction there's no other drawback to the corrosive rounds so in most cases you might as well add the effect if you're not using incendiary rounds (plus you can chose to fire corrosive multicannons only once shields are down which generally makes up for their lower ammo capacity). The second issue is that on some ships using widely-spaced or poorly-positioned hardpoints for corrosive multicannons can run into issues with convergence or field of fire where the weapon is only firing part of the time. This means you will be potentially losing that 25% hull damage bonus and having a second corrosive multicannon to improve the firing arc means you will always have at least one multicannon with corrosive rounds able to hit the target. The third issue is that FD has said that they want to re-work how corrosive weapons work to make it beneficial to have more than one corrosive weapon. They haven't given any timeline or details for this but eventually it might be beneficial to have multiple corrosive weapons and this is another good reason to incorporate more than one of them into your weapon loadout.



I use incendiary multicannons as the primary weapon on all of my ships so I have followed the changes quite closely since incendiary rounds were introduced. I usually combine them with corrosive rounds but I do have some ships, such as my Vulture, which are armed entirely with overcharged incendiary multicannons as that happens to fit my overall loadout best. The incendiary rounds (as well as the overcharged mods themselves) went through a number of nerfs which are rather complicated, but I can summarize all the changes for you.

Incendiary rounds when originally introduced in 2.1 were quite useful when combined with the overcharged mod because they converted most of the damage to thermal but also retained an additional 20% kinetic damage. Effectively they had 20% "bonus" kinetic damage compared to regular multicannons which offset much of the reduced hull damage from being converted to primarily thermal damage. This meant they were good against shields but didn't actually lose much hull damage as the extra 20% kinetic damage made up for much of the thermal vs. kinetic drawback against hulls. This original version had no effect on increasing heat generation and this is the factor that made them rather OP compared to other weapon options. This original version, however, only lasted a short period of time from 2.1 and 2.1.02 before being dramatically nerfed by FD shortly afterwords. They were essentially seen as being the most effective weapon overall as they could generate high shield damage as well as good hull damage for minimal thermal load and capacitor draw.

The second version of incendiary rounds, i.e., the first incendiary nerf, was introduced in the 2.1.03 patch and involved increasing the heat by 3X (200% increase) and decreasing the ROF by 10%. Essentially they still inflicted significant shield and hull damage (despite the slightly 10% ROF reduction) but their use was now limited primarily by heat buildup. This was a substantial issue for many ships as the ROF was still high enough that it could overheat some ships rather quickly. The overall dps vs. the original version of the weapons however was only reduced by around 10% which was due entirely to the ROF reduction and they remained effective weapons against both shields and hulls despite the reduced ROF. This was probably the most "balanced" version of the incendiaries as they remained powerful weapons but required builds that could deal with the high thermal load. Subsequent versions of incendiaries were nerfed to make them less effective weapons overall (especially against hulls) as part of the overall goal of weapon "rebalancing" that occurred during the 2.2 patch.

The third version of incendiary rounds, i.e., the second incendiary nerf, was introduced in the 2.2 patch and involved removing the additional 20% kinetic damage (that it originally received as "bonus" damage compared to regular multicannons) and improving the ROF from a 10% penalty to a 5% penalty. Essentially this reduced the overall damage by around 15% again compared to the nerf in 2.1.03. In this case the dps reduction was due to reducing the extra 20% kinetic damage and was slightly offset by improving the ROF by 5%, which overall meant that the damage was around 15% less overall. The incendiary rounds were still an effective weapon but now were much less effective against hulls. They had essentially become specialized as thermal weapons at this point making them function much like plasma repeaters overall due to the loss of the kinetic damage against hulls.

The fourth version of incendiary rounds, i.e., the third incendairy nerf, occurred with the 2.2.03 patch. It wasn't actually a direct nerf to incendiaries but was rather a dramatic nerf to the overcharged mods that incendiary rounds were generally used in combination with. This involved a slight increase in damage of 5% to the overcharged mod blueprint but also a complete removal of the ROF increase from the blueprint which had previously contributed around 15-20% of the overcharged dps bonus. The incendiary rounds however still retained their 5% ROF penalty (relative to normal rounds) and were hit particularly hard by the loss of the overcharged ROF bonus. There was also a variable clip size penalty applied to overcharged mods as well. Effectively this combination of changes decreased the dps of incendiary rounds by another 15% overall when applied to overcharged mods. The removal of the ROF increase for overcharged mods had the slight benefit of making the heat from incendiaries somewhat more manageable but the overall dps reduction also made incendiary rounds even less useful against hulls.

It's worth mentioning that corrosive rounds were also hit by the effects of the overcharged blueprint nerf in 2.2.03 as well, but since most builds only included one or possibly two corrosive multicannons the impact was less noticeable on those weapons compared to the impact it had on incendiary rounds. There's also the issue that the new rapid fire mods remained a possibility for re-rolling corrosive multicannons but were very suboptimal for incendiaries due to the impact that relying on a ROF-based blueprint had on heat generation, not to mention that the changes to heat mechanics and the increase in module damage from overheating made it even more important to be able to manage the increased heat from incendiary rounds. You could possibly consider the heat mechanic changes a "fourth incendiary nerf" but only indirectly as the heat changes really affected SCB use more than they impacted incendiary rounds (especially since you can simply stop firing temporarily to reduce heat buildup but can't stop a SCB once you're triggered it).

If you go overall all of the incendiary round changes and compare their dps when originally introduced they went down a total of around 35% in terms of their dps from their introduction in 2.1 to the most recent nerf in 2.2.03. This occurred in a series of stages where they first lost 10% ROF, then 20% kinetic damage, then regained 5% ROF. They finally lost a massive 15-20% ROF and gained a slight increase of 5% to base damage from the overcharged mod changes. Overall that makes them around 65% less effective then when originally introduced. They are still useful weapons but compared to corrosive rounds, which retain full damage against hulls, plus have 5% better ROF and the corrosive 25% hull damage bonus, they are really primarily useful against shields instead of being a true "multipurpose" weapon at this point.

I'm planning on getting a huge MC with G2 Overcharged and the Incendiary Rounds for the Cutter that I'm also planning to buy :p I prefer a Plasma Accelerator except read the Cutter is the slowest turning ship in the game, hence liked your comment about the equivalent of an engineered MC to a PA. It's a bit disappointing that Incendiary Rounds are now nerfed, except Overcharged already reduces clips size ... don't wanna reduce it further with Corrosive Shell :rolleyes:

Anyone know how much does Corrosive Shell reduce ammo capacity?
 
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