New Engineers is basically bass ackwards

[Factabulous]

I'm happy enough to try it out - though it was funny in the livestream when they kept doing rolls and sandro kept saying 'oh, that wasn't very good' as the meter hardly moved Looked more RNG than he was expecting...

 

[GG7]

I think you need to go back and watch the stream AGAIN.

Might also be a good idea to actually try using the new system before spouting off like a lunatic who lacks any tangible proof that their predictions are even remotely accurate.

 

[jasonbirder]

Better is better. Doesn't matter how marginal

Ahhh...the joys of miin/max'ing...where would MMOs be without it
Hint: More focused on Play, LESS Focused on Acquisition...

 

[Factabulous]

I think you need to go back and watch the stream AGAIN.

Might also be a good idea to actually try using the new system before spouting off like a lunatic who lacks any tangible proof that their predictions are even remotely accurate.

Man, I hope that was aimed at me, as I do spout off like a lunatic. Anyone else want to see CMDR suits based off Sandy's velour togs

 

[sgurr]

Ah, here it is:

What you've quoted is just wrong, or not using terms the way I would.

I take a maxer as a god roller, someone willing to spend hundreds or even thousands of rolls to get the mythical best module. The new system is great for them, a god roll can be achieved, or gotten close to, in 20-30 rolls.

Someone who wants an average G5 roll, who would have been happy with good enough under the old system, has to put in more effort in the new, as per the OP's post.

 

[andrak]

Ahhh...the joys of miin/max'ing...where would MMOs be without it
Hint: More focused on Play, LESS Focused on Acquisition...

Or you play your game and others can play theirs.

 

[sgurr]

Fake news!!!!

They want to "make engineering accessible to more players." They want to get more players to engineer their ships, also casual players.

Engineering took a bit too long. So they want the shorten that for the average player. That's what they said several times.

Surely they wouldn't lie to us?

If shortening that for the average player means 3+ times more mats to be gathered (click here for the numbers) after the first ship to get a similar result then no they wouldn't.

That's right isn't it

...

Might also be a good idea to actually try using the new system before spouting off like a lunatic who lacks any tangible proof that their predictions are even remotely accurate.

My predictions, in the link above, are based on the actual numbers we've been shown and told about.

Edit: is there an /s missing at the end of your post?

 

[Deleted member 115407]

Dude, low level mats are so easy to come by in this game that I can't not fly around with my storage maxed out. Seriously.

You people whine too much.

 

[Quantis Trap]

What you've quoted is just wrong, or not using terms the way I would.

I take a maxer as a god roller, someone willing to spend hundreds or even thousands of rolls to get the mythical best module. The new system is great for them, a god roll can be achieved, or gotten close to, in 20-30 rolls.

Someone who wants an average G5 roll, who would have been happy with good enough under the old system, has to put in more effort in the new, as per the OP's post.

Exactly! I clarified that also above.

 

[jasonbirder]

Or you play your game and others can play theirs.

True, but its a fair comment to point out that Frontier could spend their development time on other things (storyline, Exploration, Planets, Puzzles, Improved Enemy AI, Improved AI/Station Comms etc etc) rather than waste yet another patch cycle messing about with Engineers so a tiny fraction of the Player Base can get incrementally more and more and more powerful modules...

 

[NascentChemist]

Dude, low level mats are so easy to come by in this game that I can't not fly around with my storage maxed out. Seriously.

You people whine too much.

This, a thousand times. Play the game for a few days with the new storage system. And with material broker you'll be quickly convert the piles of low grade mats into the 3-5 you'll need for those grade 3 or 4 rolls everyone is complaining about.

 

[Starkiller_]

Dude, low level mats are so easy to come by in this game that I can't not fly around with my storage maxed out. Seriously.

You people whine too much.

Dude I guess you are just used to mind numbing activities then that are not fun whatsoever after the first 10 hours of work.

 

[Deleted member 115407]

Dude I guess you are just used to mind numbing activities then that are not fun whatsoever after the first 10 hours of work.

Oh, zing! You sure got me!

 

[IndigoWyrd]

I think they should keep engineering as it is, except remove all secondaries and put them into focus crystals.

Yep, focus crystals. You take 5 focus crystals to the tech dealer, and he offers (for a fee or other materials) to create a Grand focus crystal that enhances some aspect of technology. Blue focus crystals give heat reduction, red focus crystals increase damage, etc etc. Each module has a balanced number of slots for said crystals and we can craft and fit whatever secondaries we like, either three of the same mod with diminishing returns or using three different bonuses.

This also allows handling of grandfather modules, as you simply remove all secondaries and populate that modules slots with the crystals that get it as close as possible to what it originally was.

Just a thought

And what about Master Materi... err... focus crystals?

Yeah, that was an FF7 flashback on purpose.

I think we should still have secondary effects, which exist as "Packages" like we are getting for Experimental Effects, with the exception that you HAVE to pick a Secondary package, and these always include some sensible penalty.

So if your Primary Engineering Modification is, let's say, Overcharged for a Multicannon, you pick a Secondary Package that includes penalties like "Increased Power Draw", "Increased Heat Production", and and a random Damage/DPS modifier. Then, if you want to stack an Experimental Effect on top, go for it. Want "Incendiary Rounds"? Take it, along with an additional "Heat Production" and perhaps a little "Integrity Decrease" to go with that "Convert a portion of damage to Thermal" effect.

Really want that "+1 ton of fuel per jump" Secondary for your FSD? Sure, it just comes with an "Increased Boost Time" and "Mass Increase". If you're daring, tack on a "Faster Reboot" Experimental effect to add some "Distributor Draw" and "Heat Production" with it. Oh, look - Increased Boot Time with a Faster Reboot.. one cancels the other, for a net of Heat Production. Seems a fair trade though. Runs hotter, reboots at normal speed, jumps further and eats more fuel. Not a bad deal at all really.

But what I do I know... I just play the game.

 

[CMDR IPL Victim]

Pretty much as I posted in the Focused Feedback. Newgineers is a means on converting players from ‘good enough’ to ‘min-max’. The group that benefits the most? min-max players who spam hundreds of rolls for the golden bb. Players who suffer the most? Those willing to take whatever they get and move on to enjoying the rest of the game.

I am one of the latter, so this is potentially a very frustrating and disappointing increase in the grind.

Sadly, I expected this, though I was foolishly optimistic that this feedback thread wasn't a waste of network space.

Instead of catering to the individuals that find any roll (usually less than 5) is enough for a satisfactory upgrade, Frontier pandered to the min-max crowd who insisted on rolling hundreds or thousands of times for a single module to get the 'perfect' upgrade.

Thanks.

In 'reducing the grind' for the min-max group, they've exponentially increased the grind for the 'good-enough' crowd.

My 'sense of accomplishment' at being able to go to an engineer and quickly upgrade a good-enough module and get on with my game will be no more. Instead, I may as well complete the grind and max it out. Very little sense of accomplishment if everyone has the same module.

Congratulations. Objective to convert 'good-enough' to 'min-max' accomplished.

 

[sb413197]

Wait, what's going on here? It seems like it would take far LESS rolls to max a module. From what I've seen it only takes like 10 rolls to get a G5 under the new system with common and easily found stuff, and then you can roll that to your heart's content...under the old system I felt like it usually took at least 100 G5 rolls to get a high end module (and even then was no guarantee)

 

[NascentChemist]

I'm sorry, how is this min/max? The negative penalties are fixed for each grade. You can complain that everyone is ending up at the same place (if you want) or that secondaries are going away yet being grandfathered in. With the new system, you can do a few rolls and get improvements every time.

 

[CMDR IPL Victim]

I'm sorry, how is this min/max?

Minimum penalties/maximum benefit.

I do not disagree that there are some improvements. However, the ‘few’ rolls will have gone up, drastically, for players that have a similar approach to rngineers as I do. I go, run 1-2 per module, and move on. I do not collect hindreds if rolls then spam them for the perfect god roll. Those that do so are getting a GREAT system. Far far fewer rolls and less time in the engineers. For players like me, it is a travesty of increased grind and time.