Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Was meant to be available today, unfortunately:
New Thrustmaster SOL-R Flightstick and HOSAS
- Thread starter CMDR MAIN SEQUENCE
- Start date
You have been unlucky, I have 3374 hours according to steam on my Hotas X and it is still working perfectly, I have another new one waiting in the loft for when this one eventually fails.
Looks like Virpil are coming out with a new budget option https://virpil-controls.co.uk/cdt-aeromax-r-flightstick.html
Budget market seems to be hotting up - and me with a mostly broken T16000 to maybe replace ...
Budget market seems to be hotting up - and me with a mostly broken T16000 to maybe replace ...
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Contrary to Amazon's delivery estimate, my SOL-R1 arrived today:
Tension mounts .... what will be the verdict 
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
I'm in the "I've really got to redo a large chunk of my bindings, without losing the lot" phase of pre-installation of trepidation.
The stick is a nice weight (it arrives separate from the base) and the base feels huge (but it's really only a squared off version of the T.16000M's base). It comes with four corner "extension feet" pieces that make the footprint even bigger.
The stick is a nice weight (it arrives separate from the base) and the base feels huge (but it's really only a squared off version of the T.16000M's base). It comes with four corner "extension feet" pieces that make the footprint even bigger.
Ordered Sunday, arrived yesterday. 6 years with mouse and keyboard making it a challenge to switch but I felt the same after switching from first month with a couple of old MS Sidewinders to mouse
There are a lot of keys. I have changed settings several times already and most likely will change further. Of note
- 20-23 have no suggestion. I tried 0/25/50/75 throttle but zero prevents the throttle slider from resuming. Have switched to FSS scanner and Wing 1 / 2 / 3
- 7 also has no suggestion
- I was unsure what to do with second stage of primary trigger. I will try Rotational correction
- I couldn't see a suggestion for boost, or forward + reverse thrusters
- 9/10 I tried forward/reverse thrusters before moving these to 5/7 as didn't feel right on the dial
- I tried to keep non-combat selections to the right side of the base as have to release the stick or cross hands
- I have not set up menu navigations yet
- This is my current mapping - I had it on a piece of paper yesterday but hoping the image will help
After adding it all in I had to re-do my mouse binds because I'd changed the selection, and "Disable Relative Mouse" bind no longer appears to work. Possibly because I have mouse and stick as two options on one control rather than using "Alternate Flight Controls"
I'm a few days in now, key mappings revised several times (an ongoing work). A few more thoughts on the controller after general use (no combat, minimal FA Off, no experience of other flightsticks to compare against). Hope this is of use to others
General
Base controls
These are great
The game supports 2 actions for each (press, and hold)
I have set Toggle FSD (up), Hyperspace (hold up), Supercruise (hold down), target next system in route (down) on one switch as an example
They are the same layout on both sides so could work as well for left handed players
The rubbery DJ (upmarket ZX Spectrum) buttons are easy to use, I've set them up as single or dual (hold) use. Examples
Throttle Slider
This feels like an add-on, with no detents. I don't think it would replace a dedicated throttle
I use -100 to +100 and any position in-between is guesswork for me. I use those two positions only, and set button positions for
Encoder
This is the rotary dial at the bottom left of the base. Suggested setting for Elite Dangerous was increase or decrease sensor zoom. I have mapped them as a secondary use of thruster up/down and find them OK for fine control (using switches 3/4 when larger vertical thrust is required). Unlike the thottle slider this feels precise and I have assigned the click action to toggling Flight Assist. I'd be interested in hearing how else it can be used
4 way switch
This is on the bottom right of the stick. There is no suggested use for Elite Dangerous. I tried 0 / 25 / 50 / 75% throttle settings but at 0 it blocks the throttle slider. It feels better than the throttle slider too, with a nice action to it. I often fly with another CMDR so will be trying it for Wing/Team selection, and think it could work really well in a Wing of 4. I've assigned the first position to activate the FSS, and exit FSS when the second position is selected and I like this FSS enablement
FSS Scanner
I reverted to mouse and keyboard for this. It is workable, but not precise for me and slower. I didn't try changing the FSS settings so it might be easily improved and is probably similar to any other stick
Surface Scanner
Felt a bit less natural than mouse and keyboard, but workable and probably similar to any other stick
Game profiles
I set up a Thrustmaster profile and removed all mouse flight controls, for two reasons
Weapon triggers
I found it difficult to set up triggers in a suitable way
The lower trigger 24 for Primary Fire is perfect
The second stage of the lower trigger was left unbound as I couldn't think of a suitable action
The upper trigger is easy to operate pressing up/out, a bit of an un-natural stretch to pull towards the stick but both clicks are good
Using both triggers together could be done via index and middle finger, but to do this I would want the bottom trigger to be lower on the stick. Could use second hand but that feels very awkward
I tried various options for secondary fire on another button or the upper trigger 26/27 but everything I tried felt really clumsy
After thinking about it, I decided I wanted
The game did not allow this option as setting point 3 had to be done on both Primary Fire and Secondary Fire. When you add the second it clears the first and vice-versa. Eventually I got it to work as below, see spoiler for detail. I did have to unbind the mouse buttons for this
A quick test and this felt perfect. I checked that "hold" weapons, such as Plasma Chargers, did not fire when depressing the trigger from stage 1 to stage 2
Lights
These can each be set to any colour so can be all the same or single colours, or lit as pairs etc.
TARGET software
I tried this after recommendation from another CMDR, had a quick testbut decided not to use it at this time. Believe it offers several benefits
Key Mappings
Attaching an zipped editable PPTx file of the image below (I used LibreOffice to create the file) in case anyone else wants to make use of it. After searching around I realised edrefcard.info provided a way to do this automatically from a bind file and have requested this controller be considered for that, since it is easier than doing it manually (and no chance of error)
Edit 11 May:
The scroll wheel on the stick is not ideal for next/previous weapon group as sometimes it moves 1 group and other times it moves 2. Not sure if this is specific to me / this stick or a more general issue. As incorrect weapon fire groups are annoying I am using the completely accurate encoder actions 9+10 for this. Then the scroll wheel for other functions - heatsink and highest threat might be good candidates but it is irritating to be rebinding keys to work around quirks
General
- All the buttons have a good feel to them
- I find Button 28 (pinky button on lower part of stick) is too easy to accidentally press so have assigned an action I want but is not disruptive if accidentally pressed (rotational correction). I'd prefer this button to be harder to press or adjustable but it might work perfectly OK for most people
- I set a lot of controls with many dual actions (press, and hold). After more use I have simplified this as found it too hard to remember, and too easy to perform unwanted actions. The controller has enough buttons to allow a decent setup without requiring everything to be fully used
- I haven't added the extension feet. The base sits stably on my desk and has not tilted or slid. I think it will be the same in combat situations
Base controls
These are great
The game supports 2 actions for each (press, and hold)
I have set Toggle FSD (up), Hyperspace (hold up), Supercruise (hold down), target next system in route (down) on one switch as an example
They are the same layout on both sides so could work as well for left handed players
The rubbery DJ (upmarket ZX Spectrum) buttons are easy to use, I've set them up as single or dual (hold) use. Examples
- 6 / 8 set up for single. Cycle next subsystem and Cycle previous subsystem
- 6 / 7 set up for dual. 0 / 25 hold, and 50 / 75 hold throttle percentages
Throttle Slider
This feels like an add-on, with no detents. I don't think it would replace a dedicated throttle
I use -100 to +100 and any position in-between is guesswork for me. I use those two positions only, and set button positions for
- 0% Use thrusters with more control
- 25% Final stage of planetary approach, as I reach 2500m/s
- 50% Will try this for combat as in the "blue zone"
- 75% Used for the "7 second" method to avoid loops of shame
Encoder
This is the rotary dial at the bottom left of the base. Suggested setting for Elite Dangerous was increase or decrease sensor zoom. I have mapped them as a secondary use of thruster up/down and find them OK for fine control (using switches 3/4 when larger vertical thrust is required). Unlike the thottle slider this feels precise and I have assigned the click action to toggling Flight Assist. I'd be interested in hearing how else it can be used
4 way switch
This is on the bottom right of the stick. There is no suggested use for Elite Dangerous. I tried 0 / 25 / 50 / 75% throttle settings but at 0 it blocks the throttle slider. It feels better than the throttle slider too, with a nice action to it. I often fly with another CMDR so will be trying it for Wing/Team selection, and think it could work really well in a Wing of 4. I've assigned the first position to activate the FSS, and exit FSS when the second position is selected and I like this FSS enablement
FSS Scanner
I reverted to mouse and keyboard for this. It is workable, but not precise for me and slower. I didn't try changing the FSS settings so it might be easily improved and is probably similar to any other stick
Surface Scanner
Felt a bit less natural than mouse and keyboard, but workable and probably similar to any other stick
Game profiles
I set up a Thrustmaster profile and removed all mouse flight controls, for two reasons
- Firstly when switching from mouse to stick (e.g. exiting FSS scanner) the mouse sometimes added continual movement causing drift. Initially I used the "Reset mouse" function but then I ran into the second item
- You can only map two buttons to an action in Elite Dangerous, and I wanted to map two stick buttons and a mouse button to one action. See Weapon Triggers
Weapon triggers
I found it difficult to set up triggers in a suitable way
The lower trigger 24 for Primary Fire is perfect
The second stage of the lower trigger was left unbound as I couldn't think of a suitable action
The upper trigger is easy to operate pressing up/out, a bit of an un-natural stretch to pull towards the stick but both clicks are good
Using both triggers together could be done via index and middle finger, but to do this I would want the bottom trigger to be lower on the stick. Could use second hand but that feels very awkward
I tried various options for secondary fire on another button or the upper trigger 26/27 but everything I tried felt really clumsy
After thinking about it, I decided I wanted
- Secondary fire only, on the top trigger
- Primary fire only, on the lower trigger, stage 1
- Primary and Secondary fire together, on the lower trigger, stage 2
The game did not allow this option as setting point 3 had to be done on both Primary Fire and Secondary Fire. When you add the second it clears the first and vice-versa. Eventually I got it to work as below, see spoiler for detail. I did have to unbind the mouse buttons for this
A quick test and this felt perfect. I checked that "hold" weapons, such as Plasma Chargers, did not fire when depressing the trigger from stage 1 to stage 2
In the game, flight controls, weapons, set a Primary Fire to stage 2 of the primary trigger, and apply the changes
Close the game
Use Windows Explorer to find your bind file - it should be in %localAppData%\Frontier Developments\Elite Dangerous\Options\Bindings
Make a backup of the file as a precaution
Open the file in Notepad or similar
Copy the Primary Device value (in green below) from Primary Fire to Secondary Fire
Save the file
<PrimaryFire>
<Primary Device="044F0422" Key="Joy_25">
<Modifier Device="044F0422" Key="Joy_24" />
</Primary>
<Secondary Device="044F0422" Key="Joy_24" />
</PrimaryFire>
<SecondaryFire>
<Primary Device="044F0422" Key="Joy_25">
<Modifier Device="044F0422" Key="Joy_24" />
</Primary>
<Secondary Device="044F0422" Key="Joy_26" />
</SecondaryFire>
Close the game
Use Windows Explorer to find your bind file - it should be in %localAppData%\Frontier Developments\Elite Dangerous\Options\Bindings
Make a backup of the file as a precaution
Open the file in Notepad or similar
Copy the Primary Device value (in green below) from Primary Fire to Secondary Fire
Save the file
<PrimaryFire>
<Primary Device="044F0422" Key="Joy_25">
<Modifier Device="044F0422" Key="Joy_24" />
</Primary>
<Secondary Device="044F0422" Key="Joy_24" />
</PrimaryFire>
<SecondaryFire>
<Primary Device="044F0422" Key="Joy_25">
<Modifier Device="044F0422" Key="Joy_24" />
</Primary>
<Secondary Device="044F0422" Key="Joy_26" />
</SecondaryFire>
Lights
These can each be set to any colour so can be all the same or single colours, or lit as pairs etc.
TARGET software
I tried this after recommendation from another CMDR, had a quick testbut decided not to use it at this time. Believe it offers several benefits
- Setting of deadzones. I haven't felt a need for this as the stick feels good with no "slop"
- Setting of curves. Again I've not felt the need
- Macros. e.g. requesting docking sequence
- Changing one or all lights when keys are pressed. I can see this being nice for many people but I don't look at the stick when playing
Key Mappings
Attaching an zipped editable PPTx file of the image below (I used LibreOffice to create the file) in case anyone else wants to make use of it. After searching around I realised edrefcard.info provided a way to do this automatically from a bind file and have requested this controller be considered for that, since it is easier than doing it manually (and no chance of error)
Edit 11 May:
The scroll wheel on the stick is not ideal for next/previous weapon group as sometimes it moves 1 group and other times it moves 2. Not sure if this is specific to me / this stick or a more general issue. As incorrect weapon fire groups are annoying I am using the completely accurate encoder actions 9+10 for this. Then the scroll wheel for other functions - heatsink and highest threat might be good candidates but it is irritating to be rebinding keys to work around quirks
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Ongoing but thought I would put an update here in case anyone else starts down the same path
What I wanted to address
Smallporint caveat, none of this is very complicated but was a lot of fiddly experimentation, and there may be much better ways to achieve similar outcomes
Scroll Wheel
A friend and I struggled with this for several hours
From what we could see a single detent of the wheel would result in 1,0 (press, release) or 1,0,1,0 (press, release, press, release) with typically 40-62ms intervals
I had tried the Press event in T.A.R.G.E.T which still had the same issue
I tried the Release event instead, and no action was taken
Eventually he found we could check for a press and release, and not check again for a short time so any second 1,0 would be ignored. This appears to work
As coded it presses the N key (default ED value for Next Fire Group) once then waits a few hundred milliseconds
He did similar for Previous Fire Group, but I went to change binds and broke it. Then decided I wouldn't use that function anyway
Encoder Dial
I had dabbled with using this for forward/backward thrust but it took a long time as each click only increased speed by 1
This was ideal for fine control, but not so good when you wanted to apply a larger amount of thrust
I wanted to retain small movement initially and increase it the further away from "0" I went
In Windows "Set up USB Controllers" I enabled the virtual encoder axis
Then further changes in T.A.R.G.E.T, and the game as below
A quick test and I found I had a dial that started off making slow increments and increased at faster rates as I scrolled further
(a nice to know aspect is that if you unbind the encoder dial click button 11, pressing it zero's the virtual axis and the game responds accordingly by changing thrust to 0)
Clicking on the Dial Axis I changed the zoom and curve (from the initial red diagonal to the curved orange values)
Once saved, I ran the profile and launched the game. Changing these settings (I had to add Joy Z-Axis manually as I did not know what name it would use)
From the Bind File
<AheadThrust>
<Binding Device="ThrustMasterWarthogCombined" Key="Joy_ZAxis" />
<Inverted Value="0" />
<Deadzone Value="0.00000000" />
</AheadThrust>
<ForwardThrustButton>
<Primary Device="ThrustMasterWarthogCombined" Key="Joy_9" />
<Secondary Device="Keyboard" Key="Key_W" />
</ForwardThrustButton>
<BackwardThrustButton>
<Primary Device="ThrustMasterWarthogCombined" Key="Joy_10" />
<Secondary Device="Keyboard" Key="Key_S" />
</BackwardThrustButton>
Triggers
In my previous post I mentioned how the front trigger activated secondary fire, and the rear trigger activated primary fire at stage one and secondary fire at stage two
This worked perfectly so why did I want to "improve" it
The downside was it required two mappings for each of Primary Fire and Secondary Fire
That meant I could not use mouse buttons to fire
This was a pain if you want to use the mouse for DSS scanner, Surface Scanner, etc.
It would also affect SRV / On Foot if the mouse was used for them (I have not tested these as yet)
As I had T.A.R.G.E.T. up and running I created actions for these, and in a brief test they appear to work as I intended
What I wanted to address
- Scroll wheel inconsistency (sometimes a scroll action did 1 action, and sometimes 2)
- Making better use of the encoder dial (making movement increase the further away from "0" it went)
- Remapping the triggers (so the mouse buttons could be used as well)
Smallporint caveat, none of this is very complicated but was a lot of fiddly experimentation, and there may be much better ways to achieve similar outcomes
Scroll Wheel
A friend and I struggled with this for several hours
From what we could see a single detent of the wheel would result in 1,0 (press, release) or 1,0,1,0 (press, release, press, release) with typically 40-62ms intervals
I had tried the Press event in T.A.R.G.E.T which still had the same issue
I tried the Release event instead, and no action was taken
Eventually he found we could check for a press and release, and not check again for a short time so any second 1,0 would be ignored. This appears to work
As coded it presses the N key (default ED value for Next Fire Group) once then waits a few hundred milliseconds
He did similar for Previous Fire Group, but I went to change binds and broke it. Then decided I wouldn't use that function anyway
Added a Press event, followed by a Release event with a delay of 200ms
Encoder Dial
I had dabbled with using this for forward/backward thrust but it took a long time as each click only increased speed by 1
This was ideal for fine control, but not so good when you wanted to apply a larger amount of thrust
I wanted to retain small movement initially and increase it the further away from "0" I went
In Windows "Set up USB Controllers" I enabled the virtual encoder axis
Then further changes in T.A.R.G.E.T, and the game as below
A quick test and I found I had a dial that started off making slow increments and increased at faster rates as I scrolled further
(a nice to know aspect is that if you unbind the encoder dial click button 11, pressing it zero's the virtual axis and the game responds accordingly by changing thrust to 0)
Clicking on the Dial Axis I changed the zoom and curve (from the initial red diagonal to the curved orange values)
Once saved, I ran the profile and launched the game. Changing these settings (I had to add Joy Z-Axis manually as I did not know what name it would use)
- Mapping the throttle in-game
- Closing the game and editing the bind file in Notepad
- Finding the throttle, and identifying the name as "AheadThrust"
- Changing that value to Joy_ZAxis which is the scroll dial
- Note I have left buttons Joy_9 and Joy_10 assigned in case I disable the virtual axis at any point. The curve above would not be used by them
From the Bind File
<AheadThrust>
<Binding Device="ThrustMasterWarthogCombined" Key="Joy_ZAxis" />
<Inverted Value="0" />
<Deadzone Value="0.00000000" />
</AheadThrust>
<ForwardThrustButton>
<Primary Device="ThrustMasterWarthogCombined" Key="Joy_9" />
<Secondary Device="Keyboard" Key="Key_W" />
</ForwardThrustButton>
<BackwardThrustButton>
<Primary Device="ThrustMasterWarthogCombined" Key="Joy_10" />
<Secondary Device="Keyboard" Key="Key_S" />
</BackwardThrustButton>
Triggers
In my previous post I mentioned how the front trigger activated secondary fire, and the rear trigger activated primary fire at stage one and secondary fire at stage two
This worked perfectly so why did I want to "improve" it
The downside was it required two mappings for each of Primary Fire and Secondary Fire
That meant I could not use mouse buttons to fire
This was a pain if you want to use the mouse for DSS scanner, Surface Scanner, etc.
It would also affect SRV / On Foot if the mouse was used for them (I have not tested these as yet)
As I had T.A.R.G.E.T. up and running I created actions for these, and in a brief test they appear to work as I intended
In game I set Primary Fire to Mouse 1, and Secondary Fire to Mouse 2 plus Joy26 (front trigger)
In T.A.R.G.E.T I set the rear trigger actions as below
In T.A.R.G.E.T I set the rear trigger actions as below
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Same. I've run the T16000M with HOTAS for yonks. I don't care what technology it uses, it just works, with zero issues.
Edit: I did have to expand dead zones in the game control settings to correct unintended drift, but this was minor and had no real game impact overall.
like a car you just tend to instictivley go without paying much attention to controls as your looking outside 95% of the time if not your doing somthing wrong.........
you only tend to examine car controls, bike gears, chain, peddles, handelbar, etc if something isnt instictivley feeling " right" this should be no different methinks
the less time you spend looking at a control device the better it is
(as for examining beautiful heavenly bodies as you go that can lead to accidents so fly and drive safe
)
you only tend to examine car controls, bike gears, chain, peddles, handelbar, etc if something isnt instictivley feeling " right" this should be no different methinks
the less time you spend looking at a control device the better it is
(as for examining beautiful heavenly bodies as you go that can lead to accidents so fly and drive safe
)
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