Newcomer / Intro newbie combat dilema

Bogdan D

B
Hello,

I just had a nasty "why am I still playing this game" moment, where my IMPERIAL CUTTER was blown up in aprox 2 seconds after my shields when down, by an NPC. I do know some things about combat and engineering, made it to 'dangerous' rank with my CORVETTE, but I'm a person who likes to learn, even from failures, so my questions are: "how can an NPC blow up an IMPERIAL CUTTER hull in 2 seconds?", and "how can you see details of combat, after your ship was destroyed?".
I am aware about some neet builds that are PVP specific, to destroy large ships very fast, like D2EA's Alliance Chieftain with cryptoscramblers+pacifiers, even the thermal conduit 'hot anaconda', but this was a transport mission interdict NPC, not a prolific player/streamer.

I do have a carrier and several billion credits, so I dont mind paying 19 millions for my cutter's insurance, but I kinda dont see the point in all of this. Imperial Cutter suppose to be a grinded end-game ship, not you're regular street dealer's merchandise, why grind it if it goes down so fast? A transport mission that yields 10k credits reward (I was doing it for reputation) should not have power-play modules packing NPCs.. I rarely see these in high conflict zones, I usually get bored with my FDL before finding any.

So, I ask to please keep your messages constructive, and focus on the two questions.

Notes:
  • I do know about hull engineering, and hull reinforcements, and escaping interdicts, and running away from combat, but why play 'scared' and/or 'evasive'
  • I do play other games, wont mention the names here, where you have a detailed combat report, even the angles of your received hits, so an ammo rack hit there, could explain a '1 shot kill', maybe similar to power plant explosion in ED (but I very much doubt this was the case, since it takes several seconds for the ship to blow up).
 

Factabulous

Factabulous
No shields, but you have shield boosters and shield reinforcement modules? Might be an idea to fit shields. Or at least get a better hull ...
 

Bogdan D

B
Factabulous said:
No shields, but you have shield boosters and shield reinforcement modules? Might be an idea to fit shields. Or at least get a better hull ...
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Yes, I forgot to synch inara. I did has shields. The whole story: one anaconda and one FDL interdicted me, destroyed the FDL, got anaconda shields down and it's hull to about 20%, my shields went down (I had prismatics), thought I can hull it to finish the combat, but surprise surprise: 1, 2, kaboom!
Again, my questions are: "how can you destroy an Imperial Cutter, full hull, in 2 seconds", and "how can you see details about combat", like what did they hit me with (anti-matter?), where did they hit me so I went down that fast?
 

Ashnak

Ashnak
Bogdan D said:
"how can an NPC blow up an IMPERIAL CUTTER hull in 2 seconds?", and "how can you see details of combat, after your ship was destroyed?".
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1) were you in a CZ? In that case, NPCs can (and will ) use combat engineered ships
2) Assuming you play on PC, EDDiscovery is your friend. Ok, the data is also available for your perusal in your logfile on your PC, but EDD will present to you the XML in an easier to read format

3) were there any players in the instance, i.e. have you been playing in Open or in Solo/PG? A player can soften up (or kill) your ship from 6 km out, but if the NPC delivers the killing stroke, that's what you will see reported
 

Thwarptide

Banned
Thwarptide
Bogdan D said:
how can an NPC blow up an IMPERIAL CUTTER hull in 2 seconds
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If you’re cutter sheild and hull set up is very weak an Elite NPC in a T9 or Anaconda with turn you into a big Kaboom in seconds (been there.
Bogdan D said:
but why play 'scared' and/or 'evasive'
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Because, cutters aren’t really designed for combat purposes. You’ll never see them in a combat zone. (Oh I wish they did! ) You’ll occasionally see them in high rez sites though. Your best bet is to take a retreating posture and jump out.
Best thing you can do for a cutter without wasting space with hull reinforcement packages is to fill all your utility slots with shield boosters and engineer em for each dmg type (they stack).
install either a bi-weave or prismatic shield generator and engineer for thermal. All these will buy you plenty of time to flee the situation. I use bi-weaves on my cutter. Works quite well.
If you want to fight in a CZ the Cutter is the last ship I’d use. For that, look into a Krait 2 or if you have to have a large ship, get an expensive Anaconda.
 
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TiberiusDuval

T
Bogdan D said:
Yes, I forgot to synch inara. I did has shields. The whole story: one anaconda and one FDL interdicted me, destroyed the FDL, got anaconda shields down and it's hull to about 20%, my shields went down (I had prismatics), thought I can hull it to finish the combat, but surprise surprise: 1, 2, kaboom!
Again, my questions are: "how can you destroy an Imperial Cutter, full hull, in 2 seconds", and "how can you see details about combat", like what did they hit me with (anti-matter?), where did they hit me so I went down that fast?
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Lots of lightweight stuff, no real armour, no module or hull boosting modules.
 

Dragsham

Dragsham
Another paper plane build.
No reactive or military armour for huge hp increase?
No hull reinforcements
Module reinforcements?
Just waiting to get hammered.
Build it right and you can run easily.
Never lost my cutter or vette not once. Cept as a noob stuck in the sodding letterbox.
But having learned to fly manually that's never happened since...crap AI auto landers grrrr.
 

aRJay

aRJay
If you are on PC there are journal files/logs* that can be read with difficulty in a text editor or much easier by using something like EDDiscovery which might give you a clue about what happened after your shields collapsed.

Not a build I would go with but that is differences in play style.

* I am sure someone will be along to mention where they are, I am not on the right machine to look at the moment.
 

YORKSH1RE NEO

YORKSH1RE NEO
Bogdan D said:
Yes, I forgot to synch inara. I did has shields. The whole story: one anaconda and one FDL interdicted me, destroyed the FDL, got anaconda shields down and it's hull to about 20%, my shields went down (I had prismatics), thought I can hull it to finish the combat, but surprise surprise: 1, 2, kaboom!
Again, my questions are: "how can you destroy an Imperial Cutter, full hull, in 2 seconds", and "how can you see details about combat", like what did they hit me with (anti-matter?), where did they hit me so I went down that fast?
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You say “full hull” but from your build you are running lightweight alloys (weakest of all armour) and no hull reinforcement packages. Thats the reason right there.
 

Bogdan D

B
Just got the EDDiscovery installed and apparently there was a lot of heat damage, next to the hull damage. Still a bit astonished about how fast the ship went down, even with basic hull, but I will do a test tomorrow with a friend, to shoot at my Cutter and time it to destruction.

I know the game looks realistic, but an option to show damage values, ingame, on screen, would be much appreciated, instead of looking into journal.

Thanks for the comments, I got back to the game after a long break, I was used to shoot several seconds at ship hulls, before they were destroyed, but apparently I was dealing with combat ship builds, not transport builds like this cutter is.
 

TiberiusDuval

T
Bogdan D said:
Just got the EDDiscovery installed and apparently there was a lot of heat damage, next to the hull damage. Still a bit astonished about how fast the ship went down, even with basic hull, but I will do a test tomorrow with a friend, to shoot at my Cutter and time it to destruction.

I know the game looks realistic, but an option to show damage values, ingame, on screen, would be much appreciated, instead of looking into journal.

Thanks for the comments, I got back to the game after a long break, I was used to shoot several seconds at ship hulls, before they were destroyed, but apparently I was dealing with combat ship builds, not transport builds like this cutter is.
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Honestly your Cutter is paper under its shields. More like glorified min-maxed T9....
 

YORKSH1RE NEO

YORKSH1RE NEO
Take it from me, I’ve trashed a few cutters when I’ve been hauling max cargo (no shields or hull upgrades) usually due to the ever so kind (supposedly advanced) flight computer deciding to ram head on into the star port. The hulls are weak af with no upgrades hence the term paper hull.
 

Trollymctrollerson

T
Early on in the game I made a similar mistake flying an asp exploder. Had been flying a vulture and got complacent. It happens. Base hull values are super flimsy. On a ship the size of a cutter that's impossible to miss, getting shot by an anaconda, a ship with the most firepower of all ships, I can see it going wrong.
 

TiberiusDuval

T
Trollymctrollerson said:
Early on in the game I made a similar mistake flying an asp exploder. Had been flying a vulture and got complacent. It happens. Base hull values are super flimsy. On a ship the size of a cutter that's impossible to miss, getting shot by an anaconda, a ship with the most firepower of all ships, I can see it going wrong.
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Cutter basically relies on its capability to fit truly humongous amount of shields. It is not a hull tank even at its best. Mine can take some fire to hull, but usually I think combat is over when shields reach 0%.
 
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