No Single Player offline Mode then?

[Armour]

Ironic you mention game of thrones, because they are fine with the piracy because they still earn a fortune and if anything it just shows how high the demand for their product is ( they don't condone it nor do they not submit take downs but they have got a good business model and it works )

They have a subscription model. The game doesn't. (Imagine the size of the thread that would result from that decision!)

Broken mechanics, dominant strategies are not due to data-mining but bad game design.

As far as I can tell, the physical characteristics of the galaxy are stored locally. Bulletin boards, news feeds, markets, outfitting, and faction status are not local data. There's almost certainly some special spoilery system stuff stored server-side to stop snoopers. (Try saying that with a lisp)

 

[Ian]

During the KS, DB started a Reddit AMA for the sole purpose of advertising the KS. During that KS he clearly stated, as he had done many times before and since, that the game will have an offline mode. His advertising efforts on the KS, Reddit as well as on many other gaming publications explicitly stated there will be an offline version of Elite Dangerous. This is indisputable - ED was advertised as having an offline mode.

Based entirely on this advertising by Mr Braben and Frontier staff, many (like me) decided to pre-purchase the game whether through the KS, or through the store, or through Paypal, or whatever.

I understand FD will fail to deliver on their advertised product, and I have no control over that. Surely, it is a matter of professional courtesy for them to just say everybody who pre-purchased this game who was expecting a refund, will get a refund. Instead they use the legalistic 'you can apply for a refund' which hardly fills us with hope.

You need to consider the time, effort, and money many of us backers have sacrificed for this project for no return. FD have stated that they have not come to this decision easily, and neither have we. Many of us have gone out of our way to help them market the game, and now that the rug has been pulled from under our feet, it would be nice if they would offer us a hand up, just as we have offered them a hand up over the past 2 years. Until confirmation of that happens, it is natural that we will continue express our views, as predictably as you will attempt to dismiss or refute them. This is after all, a community forum where diverse and sometimes opposing views are discussed.

If they came out in a few days and said they are reversing their decision and will develop an offline version within 6 months, then I will immediately cancel my refund request. Its not like I want to do this ... I have been given no choice by a very late decision by FD.

It seems to me that the older, loyal, original Elite, Frontier E2 and FFE fanbase, (the people who were milked to Kickstart the Elite Dangerous project) who requested the offline mode and were led to believe it would be a feature for a very long time, have been royally sacrificed. But why this change of direction? Well, I'd say FD have had their sights on the console market for a long time. Money and maximizing profits from the game are the reason, nothing more, nothing less, despite what excuses are forthcoming. I'd say FD started out with good intentions, but when the money started rolling in... well, you know the rest. I don't think I'll be playing the 'rent-a-skin' game again, or any other money game which involves supporting a console version of ED. Look on the bright side folks... more appeasements in the form of freebies next Newsletter!

 

[Snuble]

Note the proviso "... but you will lose the richness of multiplayer.", so an entirely self-contained ED offline, never updated or patched, will be as sophisticated as FE2 or Oolite is in world depth (visuals prettier, obvs)

Not reading just a little bit too much into that? It could just as well be refering to the training missions...

 

[duwoaoaw]

They have a subscription model. The game doesn't. (Imagine the size of the thread that would result from that decision!)

As far as I can tell, the physical characteristics of the galaxy are stored locally. Bulletin boards, news feeds, markets, outfitting, and faction status are not local data. There's almost certainly some special spoilery system stuff stored server-side to stop snoopers. (Try saying that with a lisp)

Subscription or not games don't need DRM to succeed. DRM just saddles paying customers with restrictions and limits options (things like offline play, modding, ...)

Replacing Elite Dangerous' hosted server side content with static data would remove the need for a server (I'm sure a lot of solo players would like a disconnected galaxy where the market doesn't have some invisible hand which is other players in the online mode). All real content is client side and the server simulation is about as critical as Sim City (5)'s cloud simulation.

All the missions, NPCs, ships, parts are local the seed values are just controlled by the server. Changing this is not impossible. Nor would just having a different set of random values so the procedurally generated content (random missions, random parts, random prices) wouldn't match up with online play and wouldn't spoil anything and special online events are obviously only for online play.

Not to mention the way the game works the server cannot actually stream anything substantial (the bandwidth requirements would be insane) more than parameters for the client to generate. So unless the spoilery stuff is a never seen giant big number I don't see how they are going to prevent people from data mining the actual content.

The server is literally feeding updates on online statistics, market info, and seed values for the client. It is exactly like Sim City (5), I just hope they don't launch with a disaster watch.

 

[WeirdWizard]

I don't think people could have realistically expected any more than FFE depth. It could have even been a selling point/driver toward the online game for some, and a fallback for others. Now we'll never know.

Oh I dunno I would of hoped that technology has moved on in more ways than sound and visuals in the last 20 years.... The offline universe could of "faked" dynamics and evolution just fine with a little bit of effort. In fact because you can focus the simulation on the single player I wouldn't be surprised if you could create a greater sense of depth and richness for that one player than the online version where player actions and interactions with the galaxy will be lost among the chaos of tens of thousands of other players.

 

[duwoaoaw]

The only interesting thing about the online mode is the ability for the devs to manually inject event parameters other than that the dynamic universe automatically responding to tons of random players is going to lead to some illogical and game breaking situations. Offline play with a single player is easy to create the illusion of a responsive universe and provide the player with a sense that they effect things even if that isn't totally realistic (it is a game after all).

 

[Suicidal Tendencies]

Refunds may be requested here and are on an as per request basis.

Two schools of thought here:

1. FD - Don't give in to the claptrap of a few disgruntled players who cannot accept that developing a game requires; evolution, changes and making tough decisions. They are part and parcel of the whole thing
2. Give them their money back and remove them from the Beta and all future benefits should they endeavor to come back

 

[Armour]

(Stuff)

It's an online game. You are free to install the game anywhere, as many times as you like. You can log in from any of the installed copies. You can run as many concurrent server sessions as you have paid accounts for. That's how online gaming has worked for quite a few years. What do you mean by DRM?

I think you will say anything that supports your desire for an offline only game, regardless of how technically accurate or even feasible it is. You have no more of an idea about how the game is partitioned than I, but I would posit that my speculation makes more sense re: the galaxy background simulation's metadata.

Look, I would be happy to own or even play an offline version of the game, as long as it didn't use the same galaxy data that the online game relies upon. I can't see that ending well. And I can understand why they wouldn't want to generate another galaxy for solo play and deal with all the issues that might entail.

 

[Kicks]

Good morning Commanders! Time to catch up on the 100+ pages that occurred overnight!

I have my cup of tea, and a bacon sandwich. There's some going spare if anyone else wants some?

 

[Skulldugg3ry]

Welp, here we are at 3200 posts. My my.

Here's the reality of the situation. Offline is gone. If you bought the game only because you could play it offline without connection as was mentioned in the kickstarter, that has changed. If that's really the only reason you bought the game, as many are saying in this MOAT (Mother of All Threads), and you didn't buy it because of internet spaceships and an entire galaxy to explore, well, that's kind of weird, but then this game is no longer for you. You might as well stop visiting the forums and set about finding yourself a different game to play, because the only reason you backed is no longer a part of it.

If you are disappointed that the offline mode is gone, but you're still into the game, then that's fine - I think that feeling has been expressed probably several hundred times - message received. So how about a moving on to a different topic? Of course it's just a suggestion, and you're free to continue to display your displeasure - but offline will still be gone. Might I suggest going on about it is probably just a waste of time?

If you don't care about offline mode, or if you would like to see what the limitation of this forum's thread length is, well then knock yourself out. Turn it up to 11. Let's see how far this sucker goes.

I for one, will be enjoying the hell out of whatever is released, secure in the knowledge that it is Elite, I will enjoy it (I already am) and it will only get better with time. But as for the forums, I'm outta here for a good while. They aren't fun anymore.

Peace.

 

[kilvenny]

@kicks - No need - just eaten mine with tomato sauce.

 

[Kicks]

Welp, here we are at 3200 posts. My my.

Here's the reality of the situation. Offline is gone. If you bought the game only because you could play it offline without connection as was mentioned in the kickstarter, that has changed. If that's really the only reason you bought the game, as many are saying in this MOAT (Mother of All Threads), and you didn't buy it because of internet spaceships and an entire galaxy to explore, well, that's kind of weird, but then this game is no longer for you. You might as well stop visiting the forums and set about finding yourself a different game to play, because the only reason you backed is no longer a part of it.

If you are disappointed that the offline mode is gone, but you're still into the game, then that's fine - I think that feeling has been expressed probably several hundred times - message received. So how about a moving on to a different topic? Of course it's just a suggestion, and you're free to continue to display your displeasure - but offline will still be gone. Might I suggest going on about it is probably just a waste of time?

If you don't care about offline mode, or if you would like to see what the limitation of this forum's thread length is, well then knock yourself out. Turn it up to 11. Let's see how far this sucker goes.

I for one, will be enjoying the hell out of whatever is released, secure in the knowledge that it is Elite, I will enjoy it (I already am) and it will only get better with time. Bus as for the forums, I'm outta here for a good while. They aren't fun anymore.

+1
Well said commander. That really is the end of it, really.

 

[Armour]

+1
Well said commander. That really is the end of it, really.

Really???

 

[Rubix]

Welp, here we are at 3200 posts. My my.

Here's the reality of the situation. Offline is gone. If you bought the game only because you could play it offline without connection as was mentioned in the kickstarter, that has changed. If that's really the only reason you bought the game, as many are saying in this MOAT (Mother of All Threads), and you didn't buy it because of internet spaceships and an entire galaxy to explore, well, that's kind of weird, but then this game is no longer for you. You might as well stop visiting the forums and set about finding yourself a different game to play, because the only reason you backed is no longer a part of it.

If you are disappointed that the offline mode is gone, but you're still into the game, then that's fine - I think that feeling has been expressed probably several hundred times - message received. So how about a moving on to a different topic? Of course it's just a suggestion, and you're free to continue to display your displeasure - but offline will still be gone. Might I suggest going on about it is probably just a waste of time?

If you don't care about offline mode, or if you would like to see what the limitation of this forum's thread length is, well then knock yourself out. Turn it up to 11. Let's see how far this sucker goes.

I for one, will be enjoying the hell out of whatever is released, secure in the knowledge that it is Elite, I will enjoy it (I already am) and it will only get better with time. But as for the forums, I'm outta here for a good while. They aren't fun anymore.

Peace.

here here!

 

[Kicks]

Really???

Yes, really Unless, of course, you have something new and interesting to add?

 

[duwoaoaw]

Two schools of thought here:

1. FD - Don't give in to the claptrap of a few disgruntled players who cannot accept that developing a game requires; evolution, changes and making tough decisions. They are part and parcel of the whole thing
2. Give them their money back and remove them from the Beta and all future benefits should they endeavor to come back

I'm an edge case of sorts since I have two copies right now and was planning on buying more for friends but now one is in refund and no more plans for future copies either.

It's an online game. You are free to install the game anywhere, as many times as you like. You can log in from any of the installed copies. You can run as many concurrent server sessions as you have paid accounts for. That's how online gaming has worked for quite a few years. What do you mean by DRM?

I think you will say anything that supports your desire for an offline only game, regardless of how technically accurate or even feasible it is. You have no more of an idea about how the game is partitioned than I, but I would posit that my speculation makes more sense re: the galaxy background simulation's metadata.

Look, I would be happy to own or even play an offline version of the game, as long as it didn't use the same galaxy data that the online game relies upon. I can't see that ending well. And I can understand why they wouldn't want to generate another galaxy for solo play and deal with all the issues that might entail.

No you can't install the game without logging in. You can install the launcher but the game client download is locked behind the login prompt. Without offline play the fact the local files have no client side DRM monster changes nothing since the game can't function without the always online server. Which breaks what was added in the kickstarter after user requests and devs listening.

It was specifically advertised as having an offline mode which you do not need to connect online to run. Many people quoted, linked, imaged the exact words that literally say no server needed from the creators themselves.

The offline game doesn't need to use the same data as the online game because all the values are randomly generated anyways so the seed values and defaults can be different. Because of the way the game is designed altering the parameters so that when the server isn't connected a default table is used would prevent people from seeing the exact same stuff the server would deliver.

The main benefit of being online is that the devs can inject or tweak server data on the fly while the offline play's parameters for the game engine would be following static tables and a client side PRNG.

I've done network traces and digging into the client data to figure out why certain bugs happen on my machines/networks so I do have a crude idea of what they are doing even without much effort. My network has logging capabilities at the router to capture network data and computer runs low level trace based backed by disk because sometimes the game hard locks a machine and no logs or crash is produced to submit. These traces provide me with enough detail to say the server isn't doing much and looks very similar to how Sim City (5) used its cloud server.

 

[WeirdWizard]

Yes, really Unless, of course, you have something new and interesting to add?

I think his point was that you have been one of the most prolific posters in here.

 

[lysan]

First of all I do understand some people, who are upset regarding the off-line version is ditched.
Personal I do not play in SOLO or Single or Off-line mode. Never! I want to have PVP options. The good the bad and the ugly ones.

Now FD, you need to make this universe FEEL like a living breathing universe, for now it seems a bit dead. So you need to get us out of the commander seat and able to walk around ASAP!
Interaction with NPC's should also be a focus point for the game. Living and breathing also means a lot of stuff going on.

Docking staff, unloading\loading your haul, tower controller talking to you, able to see people in the building moving inside, go to a bar and watch the chicks dancing. You get the picture.

 

[Armour]

Yes, really Unless, of course, you have something new and interesting to add?

Saudi Arabia imports camels from Australia.

 

[Kicks]

I think his point was that you have been one of the most prolific posters in here.

But how is that a point of note? Also, morning commander!