NPC ships are too OP!

[Robert Roberts]

I've observed that the AI seems to cheat from time to time. I've been attempting to pirate trade ships, only for them to magically hyperjump away, even after I've shot out their drives. The NPCs have not shown any signs of 'rebooting systems' or such, and yet jump away defying all logic. There seems to be no point in targeting modules, such as the drive, which is quite frustrating since it has resulted in lost time due to the AI not following the same rules as players.
The main offenders seem to be Type 7 & 9 that have a habit of magically surging away, in spite of their drives being dead.

I'm sure others must have experienced this, although I'd note that it feels like this problem is not always consistent and varies from system to system. Although one major consistent offender is the type 9 that seems to always surge away despite having it drives shot out. This make pirating incredibly tedious, especially when the AI seems to be following its own set of rules, to the point NPC ships might as well just be combat logging too.

 

[Speedcuffs]

I would recommend a bit of googling as regards 'cheating' NPCs.

 

[Robert Roberts]

Like I said in another thread, I don't know what this KI Aasp is supposed to be.
Maybe you old timers have gotten too used to these "quirks" to see them as an issue, but as a new player, at least, it's disheartening for me to see the AI doing things that just seem like pure cheating. Maybe I've got this wrong, but my understanding is that you normally can't just magically have your drives be restored to operational state without rebooting and then happily fly away and escape with all my loot like nothing ever happened.

Coming here only to be laughed at doesn't give me a very good image of this community either.

 

[AgentGB]

I would recommend a bit of googling as regards 'cheating' NPCs.

Could imagine if you're a new player to ED & the 'ai' seemed to be preforming something that can't be explained, it would probably be frustrating. Tbh i haven't an answer for this, i have experienced this at times too & for the life of me, it would atleast be nice to know if its something i'm doing wrong or if the 'ai' is indeed operating on a different rule set.

 

[Speedcuffs]

Well, this community is made up of a lot of different people.
This subject of 'cheating' NPCs has come up a lot.
Lots of threads.

 

[Voracity_T]

Kill faster and target modules.


If your opponent is leaving before you kill them, work harder, and work faster.

 

[Bigmaec]

Two Words: KI Asp.

That dreadful abomination.
Those words shall never be uttered aloud.
The... you know what... is responsible for nearly as many dead CMDRs as the... gasp advanced docking computer!

 

[Ian Doncaster]

I've observed that the AI seems to cheat from time to time. I've been attempting to pirate trade ships, only for them to magically hyperjump away, even after I've shot out their drives. The NPCs have not shown any signs of 'rebooting systems' or such, and yet jump away defying all logic. There seems to be no point in targeting modules, such as the drive, which is quite frustrating since it has resulted in lost time due to the AI not following the same rules as players.
The main offenders seem to be Type 7 & 9 that have a habit of magically surging away, in spite of their drives being dead.

Broadly, NPCs fly approximately FA-off [1]. So if you shoot out their drives, they lose thrust input, and just keep flying away in whatever direction they were previously going like an FA-off player, while an FA-on player would come to a stop. You don't technically need operational drives to enter hyperspace or supercruise so long as you're already moving fast enough in the direction you want to jump - though you'll immediately crash out of supercruise again if you don't - so it doesn't stop them escaping.

Shooting out the FSD will stop them jumping out, but you have to get it down to 0%, whereas a player would probably have the charging reset by malfunctions before then. Railguns, multicannons or cannons can be good for this. If I'm expecting them to run, that's the module I go for first.

[1] They fly using direct thruster control like an FA-off player would, but mostly use this to mimic FA-on flight.

 

[Stealthie]

Like I said in another thread, I don't know what this KI Aasp is supposed to be.
Maybe you old timers have gotten too used to these "quirks" to see them as an issue, but as a new player, at least, it's disheartening for me to see the AI doing things that just seem like pure cheating. Maybe I've got this wrong, but my understanding is that you normally can't just magically have your drives be restored to operational state without rebooting and then happily fly away and escape with all my loot like nothing ever happened.

Coming here only to be laughed at doesn't give me a very good image of this community either.

The "KI Asp" thing is a reference to a bit of an oddball who claimed his ship was destroyed by an all-powerful NPC Asp.

As for "cheating NPCs", I'm afraid you'll just have to get used to it.
Honestly, the ways in which they "cheat" are mostly just "immersion breakers" rather than being anything important.
If you're struggling to win in combat with NPCs, any "cheating" they do probably isn't going to be the deciding factor most of the time.

You're probably better just enjoying this period, where combat against NPCs is still challenging because sooner or later you'll reach a point where you can swat them like flies regardless of any "cheating" they do.

Just have fun playing the game.

 

[Robert Roberts]

Kill faster and target modules.


If your opponent is leaving before you kill them, work harder, and work faster.

The problem is that I'm trying to loot them, which is mutually exclusive with quickly blowing them up with all their cargo inside. I destroy their drives like you're supposed to, but then they just "get fixed" on their own and the guy flies away. And no, he probably didn't reboot, as he was dropping mines in my face the whole time and still recharging shields.

Broadly, NPCs fly approximately FA-off [1]. So if you shoot out their drives, they lose thrust input, and just keep flying away in whatever direction they were previously going like an FA-off player, while an FA-on player would come to a stop. You don't technically need operational drives to enter hyperspace or supercruise so long as you're already moving fast enough in the direction you want to jump - though you'll immediately crash out of supercruise again if you don't - so it doesn't stop them escaping.

Shooting out the FSD will stop them jumping out, but you have to get it down to 0%, whereas a player would probably have the charging reset by malfunctions before then. Railguns, multicannons or cannons can be good for this. If I'm expecting them to run, that's the module I go for first.

[1] They fly using direct thruster control like an FA-off player would, but mostly use this to mimic FA-on flight.

I don't have this problem pirating ASPs, just with type 9s and type 7s, which are going slow and often wobbling around.

 

[Robert Roberts]

Just to reiterate, I don't have problems killing NPCs, just getting them to stay disabled after they've been disabled, and not just magically surging off into the sunset.

 

[Voracity_T]

The problem is that I'm trying to loot them, which is mutually exclusive with quickly blowing them up with all their cargo inside. I destroy their drives like you're supposed to, but then they just "get fixed" on their own and the guy flies away. And no, he probably didn't reboot, as he was dropping mines in my face the whole time and still recharging shields.



I don't have this problem pirating ASPs, just with type 9s and type 7s, which are going slow and often wobbling around.

Dont know if NPC's use AFM's but worth checking thier module list just to be sure. However if you kill thier FSD first, then thier drives, they are very unlikely to escape before the hatchreaker is engaged and forcing cargo out of thier hold. oreover unless you kill the Powerplant they will continue to gain shield regeneration though that is not an issue as hatchbreakers will ingore shields.

 

[Old Duck]

NPCs aren't OP, but they do cheat when it comes to the "Jump out with 1% hull and interdict you 30 seconds later with 100% hull".

 

[Voracity_T]

NPCs aren't OP, but they do cheat when it comes to the "Jump out with 1% hull and interdict you 30 seconds later with 100% hull".

Also they tend to cheat with thier power priorities.. No shields but operational weapons, FSD countermeasures and drives after a zeroed powerplant... Ships with a G5 OC plant can't bloody run that.

 

[Rick6549]

Ki asp takes out fully moddet corvette !!!!?!!

 

[Voracity_T]

Ki asp takes out fully moddet corvette !!!!?!!

Challege accepted!

Oh god I'm gonna regret this..

 

[Deleted member 38366]

Well... just for kicks today on a Mission I tried to get into the six of a Python NPC. In a G5 modded Krait II, which we all know is heaps & bounds more agile than a post-nerf Python throughout the flight envelope (whereas the Python even tends to enter a "high-speed stall" anytime it boosts to speed).

Hehe, thanks to their inertia-free Grade 8 Thrusters, that was virtually impossible. That Python NPC was able to turret me without any problems - it was easily able to turret my ELITE ranked Crew flying the Imp. SLF as well.

If I myself had a Python flying like that and flying circles around and perma-turret G5-modded Player Chieftains, Vultures and Krait II's, I'd find myself being accused of shameless cheating like a madman xD

In the end I finished the cheater (NPC) by just boosting into it head-on multiple times.

Of all their cheats, their inertia-free deceleration and acceleration & rotation throughout their entire flight envelope is probably amongst the worst - at least for me.
Seeing a Python or even Anaconda NPCs easily turret virtually anything (even my Chieftain or FAS on 4 Pips ENG) or perform impossible full-stop - back-to-speed - full-stop within 2 sec maneuvers really puts me off.

My Ships all take some time decelerating or accelerating (non-boost) even G5-modded.
Many NPCs though, especially in their fake/impossible-to-engineer-0% Power Plant-builds that somehow run Grade 10 Overcharged PowerPlants? Not so much.
It can be >very< annoying.

 

[NCFCpaul]

Whatever happened to those Anacondas that just sort of lazily spun on their axis? Just the right level of challenge I think!

No matter how tough the cheating NPCs can get, a capable Cmdr in a seriously engineered FDL presents a whole next level of problem...

 

[Robert Roberts]

Well... just for kicks today on a Mission I tried to get into the six of a Python NPC. In a G5 modded Krait II, which we all know is heaps & bounds more agile than a post-nerf Python throughout the flight envelope (whereas the Python even tends to enter a "high-speed stall" anytime it boosts to speed).

Hehe, thanks to their inertia-free Grade 8 Thrusters, that was virtually impossible. That Python NPC was able to turret me without any problems - it was easily able to turret my ELITE ranked Crew flying the Imp. SLF as well.

If I myself had a Python flying like that and flying circles around and perma-turret G5-modded Player Chieftains, Vultures and Krait II's, I'd find myself being accused of shameless cheating like a madman xD

In the end I finished the cheater (NPC) by just boosting into it head-on multiple times.

Of all their cheats, their inertia-free deceleration and acceleration & rotation throughout their entire flight envelope is probably amongst the worst - at least for me.
Seeing a Python or even Anaconda NPCs easily turret virtually anything (even my Chieftain or FAS on 4 Pips ENG) or perform impossible full-stop - back-to-speed - full-stop within 2 sec maneuvers really puts me off.

My Ships all take some time decelerating or accelerating (non-boost) even G5-modded.
Many NPCs though, especially in their fake/impossible-to-engineer-0% Power Plant-builds that somehow run Grade 10 Overcharged PowerPlants? Not so much.
It can be >very< annoying.

I hear what you're saying, Different ship classes should have their attributes clearly defined in their advantages and disadvantages, in order to portray those strengths and tradeoffs, that said I can also understand the devs applying buffs to the AI to make them more challenging. In the case that I'm describing, however, the AI is behaving in a way that crosses the boundary of buffs and enters the domain of cheats or magic with its ability to do things that go against the rules that the players are subject to. This is a great game, but I don't agree with this sort of thing. It's like someone who has lost his legs still sprinting off into sunset with my diamonds with no wheelchair replacement or anything of the kind.

I wouldn't mind it so much if it were at least somehow explained or justified. This would at least go some way to curb my frustration with some of the NPC behaviour.

 

[Melanthes]

I've been attempting to pirate trade ships, only for them to magically hyperjump away, even after I've shot out their drives.

I've also experienced that, but only when in the same instance as another CMDR. I think there is a problem in network communication between clients causing this.