Open "bug report" to FD on the DSS in Odyssey

[jagsj]

I'm hoping that I'm not being too harsh and only Cmdr that feels that this "feature" is wrong. Below is the open "bug report" I just sent to FD. I also include screenshots with my report but I haven't included here, as we have all probably seen them before.
I should add, I'm happy to be proven wrong and pointed to the right "how to" (but I've spent considerable time looking in and out of game)

Using the DSS in Odyssey, is pointless. A cmdr fires the probes and gets back a "heat map" that is entirely blue. If there are blue "gradients" there is no possible way to know what they mean. I've heard that the "heat map" has been modified due to confusion, well we have more confusion now. If I want to look for Phosphorus on a planet in Horizons I'd DSS a planet and get the locations of the Geological sites... in Odyssey I have to guess where they are on a blue globe, there is no locations added to the Navigation panel, and the broken heatmap shows nothing. Changing the filter of the findings in the DDS does nothing visible. Not that it would help, with all the same blue shades, but there is no key to at least give cmdrs a fighting chance.

Cmdrs currently have two options. Hunt for years (Thats real life years) around planetary bodies in Odyssey and hope you find the most basic of natural materials or change back to Horizions and actually find the materials. The grids can be lengthy in ED, but asking cmdrs to grid just to find the location with no directions let alone the material is beyond ridiculous.

I would like to suggest that this functionality be looked at urgently as this impacts every component of Engineers and crafting as well as extends to those who do exploration, as without the ability to successfully find materials for synthesis, ships on long expeditions will break unable to find materials.

For those players that like game emersion, the fact that is is 330x and we can travel between the stars but a planet scanning probe can only colour code a scanned planet blue as a result is dismal.

In the meantime, don't update the DSS in Horizons, its all the cmdrs have got...but please fix this it is not right.

EDIT: Gamma

 

[varonica]

I'm hoping that I'm not being too harsh and only Cmdr that feels that this "feature" is wrong. Below is the open "bug report" I just sent to FD. I also include screenshots with my report but I haven't included here, as we have all probably seen them before.
I should add, I'm happy to be proven wrong and pointed to the right "how to" (but I've spent considerable time looking in and out of game)

Using the DSS in Odyssey, is pointless. A cmdr fires the probes and gets back a "heat map" that is entirely blue. If there are blue "gradients" there is no possible way to know what they mean.

It isn't a heatmap, FDEV have acknowledged that this is a "location map" and not a heatmap, it only shows areas on the planet where bio of a certain type could exist, not density, they changed it from a heatmap during the alpha test because of player complaints, here is the pre-updated heatmap.

You can see clearly this is a heatmap, the darker areas having a lower density bio count, the lighter colours being higher density, it worked well at the time and I wish they would bring it back, or at least give us a choice. The current system is a location map with the underlying geo causing the changes in colours and there really is no guarantee that you will find bio anywhere in the blue.

In the meantime, don't update the DSS in Horizons, its all the cmdrs have got...but please fix this it is not right.

I expect the DSS will only be changed if you update to 4.0, if you stay on the 3.8 code base it would still work with the old POI system.

 

[Dragsham]

+1
Yup the dss blue map thingy (so called heat map) is pants!
The blue hues atm just refer to geological features, rather than what we're looking for.
Personally I always land at the lightest shade of blue. Darkest being mountains or deep gorges etc.
It's crap!
For collecting mats (raw mats) or bio scanning it's just broken.

 

[Bigmaec]

All that exobiology gameplay is just nuts.

DSS showing literally only the biome where things could perhaps be found
No interaction whatsoever with other ship sensors
No interaction whatsoever with SRV sensors
That stupid range rule (which isn't even shown in the short summary on the scanner when you scan things) instead of that minigame*

This is all screaming placeholder like nothing else.

Seriously, why is there no advanced sensor suite for our ships to get better readings of the biomes?
Why is there no dedicated exobio SRV???

Gaaaaaah, I scanned ONE planet yesterday and was again mad as f... because this is all so barebones, and it could be so great.

* I liked it more than what we have now, sue me.


/ rant over

 

[metatheurgist]

, they changed it from a heatmap during the alpha test because of player complaints, here is the pre-updated heatmap.

If we ever needed proof that players shouldn't be listened to.

 

[Dragsham]

I hated the idea of scanning weeds on planet surfaces when oddity dropped so didn't embark on the loop.
Since then I kinda like it.. the principles are ok. But the gameplay loop defo needs a rethink/pass with accompanying map rethink too cos that's crap.

 

[Bigmaec]

If we ever needed proof that players shouldn't be listened to.

They just listened to the wrong players (=not me)

 

[Northpin]

Yeap, this is one of the biggest letdowns of EDO, imo ofc.

They should really work on this and bring proper heat maps (or at least POIs)

 

[Dragsham]

Horizons raw poi's nailed it. Rather simplified yeah but you knew what to expect, apart from the topographical problems making farming really hard, or the poi's always being on the darkside which again made farming problematic.
Now! Raws farming is adhoc at best.
If l land at a bio site and raws are lying about locally I'll grab em.
Otherwise it's a trip to the forest for me! Sod that as it is raws collection is just awful.
As for exobio well.
Those bacteria patches look tosh tbh.
And their almost always only ever found on flat ground.
The rest you can pretty much find on any topographical surface.
Most of us use a dbx or something to hop from one node to another. Or srv whichever..if they imagined us doing it all on foot then that's realised when 4 varietys are ALL in the steep crevices/mountain slopes, which make ship landing impossible.
So in srv and fly up there having landed as close as possible.
I'm guessing that's how they want it.
And I'm ok with it.... sort of.
To date I'm about 2/3 towards elite and its getting a bit dull.
Is it me or do all the planets seem the same? Yeah some are green or blue or pink purple hues to atmospheres, but essentially it's all identical? The surfaces I mean...and the loop scanning 3 gets me over 1000s of em

 

[jagsj]

Thanks all for the responses, its good to know I'm not the only one thinking the DSS mechanic is broken, I just hope FD know and see this too.
While my gripe is currently with finding raw mats only, it is interest (and concerning) that the bio functionality is also a problem. I haven't focused on this yet and now I know, I'll be waiting (always hopeful ) until there is an improvement before starting...

 

[Jack Schitt]

I've started selecting the smallest isolated blue areas for biologicals, which are usually but not always large craters, then using an SLF to scout for actual flora which is awesome fun.

If you find something of interest you can position the SLF just above the surface near to the object, turn on the lights and maximise shields, then deactivate the thrusters so the SLF sits on the ground and acts as a targetable beacon. You can then switch to the mothership and fly to the SLF's location. (If you don't turn off the thrusters the SLF autopilot will leave the ground regardless of any Follow Me or Hold Position instructions.)

The main annoyance with this method is that you can't land the main ship with an SLF deployed, so you can't go up to it on foot or with an SRV. You have to position the mothership over the top of the SLF, switch controls, quickly order the mothership to hold position (a keybind helps here) and hope that you can dock the fighter without the mothership's position moving too much.

(I guess you could also switch to the SLF, enable the thrusters, quickly switch back to the mothership and order the autopilot to retrieve the fighter. But it would be a faff and you'd still likely lose eye contact with the thing you were looking for in the first place).

What we really need are deployable surface beacons. Or, failing that, an SLF with a cargo bay and scoop so we could use any old canister as a surface beacon...

 

[Tikanderoga]

All that exobiology gameplay is just nuts.

That stupid range rule (which isn't even shown in the short summary on the scanner when you scan things) instead of that minigame*

Make range 10m and call it a day.
The range rule is one of the main reasons I gave up on it.
Also the inability to scan from the SRV if we are out of the range just yet.

PLUS: I want a 2nd and a 3rd container!
Can't be that hard.

 

[varonica]

Make range 10m and call it a day.
The range rule is one of the main reasons I gave up on it.
Also the inability to scan from the SRV if we are out of the range just yet.

PLUS: I want a 2nd and a 3rd container!
Can't be that hard.

Too simplistic, make it beneficial to scan bio from different locations. Sure you can scan 3 plants next to each other, but if you scan from plants from different areas you get a bonus, over 100mtrs 25% bonus, over 500mtrs 50% bonus, over 1000mtrs plus 100% bonus. And yes multiple samples, just change the container to set the scanner to that species.

 

[Tikanderoga]

Too simplistic, make it beneficial to scan bio from different locations. Sure you can scan 3 plants next to each other, but if you scan from plants from different areas you get a bonus, over 100mtrs 25% bonus, over 500mtrs 50% bonus, over 1000mtrs plus 100% bonus. And yes multiple samples, just change the container to set the scanner to that species.

I'd be ok with that. Bonus for distance for diversity.
But sadly even the first discover bonus doesn't count towards the exo rank, only the base pay.

 

[Jack Schitt]

This isn't a defence of FD's strange design choices -- quite the opposite -- and some people will already know this, but the third-party tool Elite Observatory / Elite Observatory Core will, among other things*, overlay a HUD-like element on the screen that tells you the type of organic you currently have in the sampler, how many you've scanned, and how large each colony size is. It's not perfectly integrated but it may be as close as we're likely to see, and it can give you a clue as to whether it's worth switching from EVA to a vehicle when scouting out the next target.

Other tools may offer equivalent functions -- EDDiscovery has similar if you set it up correctly -- but EO is the simplest one I've used.

*another nice feature is that a voice can read out the presence of interesting things, such as landable atmospheric planets, as they are picked up by the DSS. It can save a few seconds at the end of a DSS scan not having to go into the system map to check. Again, similar functionality is available with other apps.

 

[Walter2]

I don't know why I don't have the same problems with the DSS that other people have. The cyan overlays work the way they're designed to (mostly) and it doesn't bother me that I might have to do some exploration to find the more elusive specimens - isn't that what exploration is about?

My biggest gripe with the system is it's lack of recall of what it has discovered and integration with other ship systems.

1 It's a pain to have to launch and enter SC just to find the plots for the next subject. I would be nice to have the plots overlaid on the planet surface in the System Map (where the surface features can be seen whether the planet is mapped or not). A "You are here" marker would also be useful if you are landed. But that's probably wishing for the moon.

2 When you've mapped a planet, the DSS is quite capable of listing the different types it has scanned and showing the overlay plots of where each subject can be found (mostly). But if you're down on the surface having found one or two subjects and want to find what's next on the list, you discover that there is no list. The "Organic Information" panel in the planetary description in the System Map will tell you what you've found, but it has forgotten what the DSS scanned and marks the undiscovered specimens as "Unknown". You have to launch and engage the DSS to relist the unknowns to find what you and the ship have forgotten. Pencil and paper memory beats the computer.

I suppose it's just highlighting the difference between a game and a simulation.

 

[Old Duck]

If we ever needed proof that players shouldn't be listened to.

I'd happily withdraw all my suggestions if we could go back in time to the early days of Elite's realistic markets, meaningful credits, and all the other challenges that have long since been nerfed or removed because someone complained and Frontier listened to them.

 

[vanFace]

I'd happily withdraw all my suggestions if we could go back in time to the early days of Elite's realistic markets, meaningful credits, and all the other challenges that have long since been nerfed or removed because someone complained and Frontier listened to them.

Don't forget engineering. That was actually a buff. We might still be better off without it.

 

[Genar-Hofoen]

This isn't a defence of FD's strange design choices -- quite the opposite -- and some people will already know this, but the third-party tool Elite Observatory / Elite Observatory Core will, among other things*, overlay a HUD-like element on the screen that tells you the type of organic you currently have in the sampler, how many you've scanned, and how large each colony size is. It's not perfectly integrated but it may be as close as we're likely to see, and it can give you a clue as to whether it's worth switching from EVA to a vehicle when scouting out the next target.

Other tools may offer equivalent functions -- EDDiscovery has similar if you set it up correctly -- but EO is the simplest one I've used.

*another nice feature is that a voice can read out the presence of interesting things, such as landable atmospheric planets, as they are picked up by the DSS. It can save a few seconds at the end of a DSS scan not having to go into the system map to check. Again, similar functionality is available with other apps.

You haven't seen the BioTracker system Captain's Log has?

I may be a bit biased - because I programmed it - but it's pretty damned good

 

[Lugh]

You see a functional heat map was too confusing for a small handful of players so fdev decided a useless one would be easier to use.