Open letter to Devs, Why I am now combat logging and what to do with this pirate.

[uberdude]

Two wrongs don't make it right. Plus, I've been interdicted a few times trading in open by a player. You'd be surprised how quickly that 15 second timer ticks by. and is the only completely legitimate way to log off during combat or an interdiction.

I'm not ignoring everything else you've said about trying to kill a pirate and not being able to because they pull a combat log. I'm simply pointing out that it really isn't necessary for you to put yourself in the same boat as them and make yourself look that much less legitimate.

Now i can't say i don't condone pulling a combat log if you legitimately feel the other player is cheating/hacking or "experiencing network issues leading to undesirable effects." Id be a hypocrite if i said that. But just because they are doing it to you doesn't really give you an excuse to do it to them or anyone else.

Log out through the menu, sit there for 15 seconds and you're worry free.

 

[Snakebite]

As a pirate, I completely agree that the ease of wiping out your criminal record is gamebreaking. I never pay off bounties for this very reason.

Still, I would avoid combat logging (if only to prevent account action). In the meantime, why not trade in your cobra? You'll be able to fight back or escape if need be,

Funny thing is that no-one attacks the cobra.....

 

[Marshall...]

I agree mate. No wonder you weren't able to find many actual CMDR pirates, when they are just clearing the bounty as soon as they get it. This particular gameplay mechanic needs revisiting....

 

[Hump Johnson]

I agree it's very one sided at the moment, could you not play in solo while you are trading, then if/when they do fix the wanted mechanic go and repay the favour?

 

[huwthomas]

If I cannot treat him as a pirate when i'm playing BH[/COLOR] so now I will now refuse to allow him to act as pirate against me when i'm playing trader

Spot on.

The promised anti-griefing mechanism from the KS, if implemented, would deal with this too.

1. The offender will very quickly get a serious price on their head (bounty) and criminal record. That price on their head will attract bounty hunters.

2. Local police or military will respond very quickly and strongly to them.

3. It will be legitimate for other players to attack them for the attractive bounty without attracting a bounty for themselves, as once there is a bounty on their head they are officially a pirate and ‘free game’ for everyone.

4. If enough players complain about the offender's behaviour in a certain time, then they will be banned from this group.

Neither 1 nor 3 are effective if bounties are trivial to clear.

 

[Lobstris]

Every time you accrue a bounty, a small but permanent change to your overall 'alignment' should shift. Eventually, no amount of paying off your 'wanted' status should be allowed for an extended period of time.

 

[Vasious]

You raise an interesting point concerning the speed and ease anyone might clear one's criminal record.

Perhaps they too require a cool down or if paid off remain for a set period before clearing.

 

[Stein]

While I agree on the whole bounty being to easy to get rid off thing, and that combat logging could be "ethically" right in the situation you describe... +1 for that...

..what I don't get is that you - a professional and seasoned bounty hunter - had been patrolling Lave, rightfully, since that is probably the most pirate infested snake pit in the universe. Still, with all your knowledge of the habits and whereabouts of pirates, you choose to return to Lave in a virtually unarmed T6 full of rares - naked and covered in honey so to speak. I'm not gonna conclude this thought train...

 

[OldSalt]

Beyond the game incorporating Letters of Marque (at some considerable onerous consequence) The ability to wipe the slate clean as easily as it is causes a lot of serious problems. That said SB, even as a protest vote I am struggling to endorse combat logging, It just doesn't make anything better as I see it.

 

[Darth Ender]

Combat logging is never ethical. That kind of mindset is why fd needs to start coming down hard on detected and admitted abusers. It is cheating. There is no ethical cheating

 

[Bevz]

I think you have a fair point with the "paying off your bounty" thing; it's a fine line but there should be consequences in the game, not bad enough to mark you for life, but just enough for it to be more realistic. If i kill someone out in the open and get a wanted status it does seem immersion breaking that i can just pay that off no matter how bad-ass i was to earn it; i'd expect to be marked wanted for some period of time proportional to the lawless act i committed. If i wanted to change my ways i would then be forced to lay low for a bit while things cooled off (go off exploring and then come back with clean record again).

As for laying in wait for pirates; i've never seen this as something that actually works (it's never worked for me); your best bet is to buy some rares and go flying around stations like you own the place and wait to be interdicted.... When i do this, pirates are all over me like a rash even when i have a kick-ass ship! Then it's game on and usually death for me, but it's fun anyway and i get to give some pirates a slight run for their money!

 

[Snakebite]

Why after playing as a bounty hunter for months and after scanning and flying past this guy peacefully several times in my BH role. Should I now have to sit helplessly and watch him blow up my ship when playing in the trader role just because of some stupid easy-to-fix mechanic that he is exploiting ? And furthermore I would bet any money that he earned the creds for that Imperial Clipper by grinding away in safe mode before swapping to open to cause mayhem for others....

 

[Joe Spivey]

Changing mode is not a cheat or an exploit. It is designed into the game on purpose and with reason. I always understood that you could not change mode in combat but people have told me that you can. In that case, changing mode in combat should not be allowed. Combat logging, similarly, is cheating whatever your personal reason might be.

 

[Roraima]

I don't think I agree with you, OP. Let me say that I mostly play in Solo, so disregard my comments if you wish. My point is - this is also how NPCs operate. Just because you get interdicted by or meet one that is 'clean', you cannot tell if they are a pirate or not until they act. It is part of the strategy of the game - i.e. open fire too quickly without checking their status when interdicted and it is YOU who will be wanted (not fun in a Type 9 etc!). I think this is a valid and interesting part of the game.

I like trading because every time you buy a trading ship, you have to think carefully about tactics and weapons in the event of interdiction. This differs depending on the ship etc. I appreciate it must be a lot tougher going up against another commander, but that is the game. I would imagine you had so much trouble finding a 'wanted' commander because life gets really tough once you are wanted! Most people (well, definitely me) will high-tail it to the nearest anarchy outpost to pay off an accidental bounty on our heads.

 

[MaraJade]

Carebear. Play in Solo or learn to fight/run

END.

Try reading the post first. No need for this kind of comments.

OP,

Perhaps what needs to be implemented is some kind of Lightside/Darkside or an alignment type thing (Although different name because this isn't starwars).

As you kill without cause, your alignment changes. This could effect the places you can dock. Maybe in time of no killing it would align back or some way (just not pay a fine and good to go).

Good alignment's get you a discount as certain stations up to a max of ?

Just some thoughts.

 

[Snakebite]

I would normally agree, combat logging to avoid a fight is cheating. I am not doing it to avoid a fight, I am doing it because it seems so wrong to me that I cannot treat pirates as pirates when bounty hunting and yet have to accept their piratical activities when trading. As soon as the issue is fixed I will not feel the need to do it.

 

[Sandmann]

My opinions... combat logging is cheating, use of solo is not cheating, piracy is part of the game but so is bounty hunting and bounties for murder should only be wiped on the pirate's death (since the game has no concept of incarceration).

If you want to "punish" the cowardly pirate for wiping his record so he can't be hunted, don't start committing your own acts of piracy, instead trade in solo or group to deprive him of his target. Pirates are probably the most vocal supporters of moving people back into open where they can be shot at, and traders go to solo/group coz piracy has been left to develop on it's own rather than being supported within a balanced game system, so depriving them of targets so they complain more is probably the best way to get FDev to fix the issues pushing so many traders into solo/group in the first place.

Traders want to trade and make.profit, pirates want traders in open where they can be robbed, and bounty hunters want pirates with bounties to be hunted. Right now traders are going solo/group NOT because pirates exist, but because they flourish uncontrolled on lucrative routes. If pirates want traders in open the traders need to have a good chance (not 100%, but high) of trading the profitable routes unmolested. Yes traders should face some risk, but no trader is going to keep going keep going back to a route that he always gets robbed on. The whole "raison d'etre" for trading is profit not charity, losing profit occasionally can be absorbed as a "cost of doing business" but losing it too often will have the trader looking elsewhere. That is WHY pve groups are flourishing (mobius group is now over 5000!). We've all seen nature docos of zebras or wilderbeqst crossing an african river and getting eaten by crocodiles. Why do they keep doing it? Because there is something on the other side that they want but more so because 99.9% of them make it across safely. If they start losing 20-30% of their herd to the crocodiles they will go find another way across. That's what the traders have done - their losses were too high so they found another way to trade. A more boring way perhaps, but without the too high losses.

Of course, to give them their due the pirates feel justified in hunting on lucrative routes, for the same reason as sharks hang out where fish like to feed, coz that's where the prey is! Pirates, be they "gentleman pirates" or "psycopathic scoundrels" are proud of being hunters and see traders as their natural prey, but if they want to be part of a food chain though, they need to accept that they're not the lions, they are the jackals and that the bounty hunters see THEM as prey, and that if a predator is decimating their prey in a certain area the prey will either die out or move away. A pirate clearing his bounty so he's not hunted is exactly the same as a trader going to solo or group so he's not pirated. The only difference is that the pirates complain about the traders hiding, when the pirates are doing the same thing. Hypocrite much?

Put in systems to support a viable trader/pirate/bounty hunter ecosystem and trqders will start seeing pirates as "fun" rather than seeing them as circling sharks and may start returning to open, and pirates will in the same way see the bounty hunters as "fun" rather as a nuisance out to spoil their trader hunting ways.

 

[Snakebite]

Try reading the post first. No need for this kind of comments.

OP,

Perhaps what needs to be implemented is some kind of Lightside/Darkside or an alignment type thing (Although different name because this isn't starwars).

As you kill without cause, your alignment changes. This could effect the places you can dock. Maybe in time of no killing it would align back or some way (just not pay a fine and good to go).

Good alignment's get you a discount as certain stations up to a max of ?

Just some thoughts.

I certainly agree that for serious offences you should be barred from docking at *mainstream* spaceports. Or if they Did let you dock then why would they let you leave ?

 

[CMDR Thrope]

I cannot treat him as a pirate when i'm playing BH so now I will refuse to allow him to act as pirate against me when i'm playing trader[/COLOR]

Right. Exactly right. +1, and thanks for sharing.

 

[Skillet]

Stopped reading at --open letter..