That is not what happened .... the clip you posted supported everything we said. Then you back pedalled .... narratives.
Open-Only in PP2.0?
- Thread starter August Lagrange
- Start date
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Indeed - and the debate has attracted both proponents and opponents of Open only for Powerplay 2.0. Noting that Frontier have already confirmed that Powerplay 2.0 will be released as a pan-modal game feature.
No it didn't. You're just using mental gymnastics to interpret the clip in a way that supports your bias. Where did I back peddle? Please explain...
Saying 'most importantly it allows consensual pvp, that's why we've done it' is no different from saying it has been designed to allow consentual pvp.
Any emotion perceived is purely down to you.
If you'd like to know my emotional state - it's one of boredom with people who think they are so special, that they deserve more than the bonuses they already get.
And "Fdev" didn't suggest anything, a single dev did years ago after his boss (Michael Brookes) and his bosses boss (David Braben) said no to open only or open weighted bonuses. And Sandro isn't even on the project anymore, he got moved to another project and you all still bang on as if his word is the word of God.
I directly quoted the clip ... spin it how you like ...
You've done nothing but imply PP was solely added and based on PvP. When in reality PvP has only ever been an optional part of it.
And I hope PP2.0 also keeps PvP as an optional part of it. As not everyone wants to do PvP.
So you can't explain, ok cool.I directly quoted the clip ... spin it how you like ...
Sandro literally said in that video that allowing consensual PvP was the most important part of powerplay. Or do I need to post a full transcript for the viewers at home?
I think this topic gets you guys so riled up because there is a good chance FDEV do introduce some kind of weighting or system to prioritise open play in the context of powerplay. And they should... all we've had over the last few years is PvE content, and the game has had a rough time. They need to recapture the early momentum and feel the game had when open play was buzzing with activity and the open players hadn't yet been frustrated away from the game by poor design decisions.
If they stick to the 'all modes are the same' nonsense they've been dogmatically clinging to for years then PP2.0 is DOA in my opinion (for reasons I've already explained about not being able to find opponents in open). But hey, they once said they would never sell ships in the store... things change. Maybe they will wake up and prioritise open play a bit.
The days of SDC, Harry Potter, the Salome kill, The Code etc were way more interesting and drove attention and controversy to the game (resulting in gaming media coverage and higher player numbers). When those things all went away Elite lost a lot of it's allure and spice and now its largely a galaxy of tumbleweed. What a shame..
Maybe you should. You seem to be the only person here who doesn't understand what he was saying.
I'm not sure what you're arguing against at this point... All my responses have been consistent.
lol good grief... I've literally quoted him directly several times now. Ok fine...
8:03 Sandro : "It's player authored, and it's galactic-wide content, dynamic changing content... but importantly, most important of all it allows consensual PvP. At it's core of it, it's a way for players to work with eachother in teams against other players in teams, and that's going to crop up in questions as why we've done things in the way we have done them. So that's why we've done it"
8:46 Sandro : "Here's one right now, [player name from live-chat] says 'it allows consensual PvP What?' It does because you have to actively sign up to Powerplay, you have to go out on in a limb and say I'm in this, and by doing so you are accepting the fact you can be attacked in open, by players of opposing powers, so that's why it's consensual. You don't have to take part in it, if you are not part of a power, then no one has any legal authority to attack you, and they will be punished if they do, so that's one for the books"
9:22 Ed : "So alright, there you go, you heard it from Sandro Sammarco himself"
So there you go, pretty clear to me.. not sure what you guys are contesting.
I'm sorry I didn't understand the topic of the argument.
Are we talking about the PP1 project that was in the plans or the existing one?
I play PP1 in single player.
The problem is that the three modes are different, and as such should have that taken into account. If modes are to be 'equally valid choices' then you have to have a valid reason for being in Open for a feature about explicit rival groups- when you are fighting other commanders it is more often than not more difficult than an NPC.
For example, in Powerplay PG IMO is too easy to rack up wing merits given you don't have enemy players and that its potentially four top end ships being flown- IMO PG should halve the extra merits and have the full x4 in open, given what you could face.
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Frontier chose not to reward players simply for picking a game mode - and when they did include an aspect where players could gain a reward for attacking other players, players quickly found a way to collude.
Noting that a wing may face exactly the same player opposition in Open as it does in a Private Group, that is to say zero. It's very much an "it depends" scenario. For any risk/difficulty reward to be reasonably calculated it would, among other things, need to take into account actual opposition rather than a blanket "it's Open so there might be opposition" factor.
Yes, because the system they designed was flawed that became useful mitigating other systems that were flawed.
The chance in PG is zero, thus has no risk attacked to it.
Since player kills count for something in V2 (going by the UM requirements shown in the UI) the risk is there.
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Several historic Private Group incursions by those intent on breaking the rules of the PG beg to differ.
... or not, as the case may be, e.g. due to time of day, P2P connection quality, friends list, block list, being in a Wing, etc..
There is no guarantee that an opposing player will be encountered in Open, even if the probability of encountering one is greater in Open than in a Private Group.
The best way to meet is to add your enemy as a friend
Wow, well that was quite a read, seems that I'm not quite late to the party and that the fun is just beginning.
Curious situation, seems to me that the way that PvP is played currently breaks open mode, and now the open mode players, a vocal and boisterous minority, now want their world to effect the closed world as well, without the solo players having any say in it!
Kind of an extension of that which already runs, if you try to 'play the game' in open mode, and you just get repeatedly pulled into a deathmatch arena, ruining your game. Seems like such a waste, to use such a beautifully crafted model of the cosmos, with such a wonderful dynamic procedural system, as that ... a death match arena.
I can't wait to see how power play is going to develop! I'm grabbing a whole sack of corn to make popcorn with and am settling in for the long play. Would really like to see the Pilots Federation get involved in this, use some of the power of the monopoly that they hold on the equipment and comms systems.
Curious situation, seems to me that the way that PvP is played currently breaks open mode, and now the open mode players, a vocal and boisterous minority, now want their world to effect the closed world as well, without the solo players having any say in it!
Kind of an extension of that which already runs, if you try to 'play the game' in open mode, and you just get repeatedly pulled into a deathmatch arena, ruining your game. Seems like such a waste, to use such a beautifully crafted model of the cosmos, with such a wonderful dynamic procedural system, as that ... a death match arena.
I can't wait to see how power play is going to develop! I'm grabbing a whole sack of corn to make popcorn with and am settling in for the long play. Would really like to see the Pilots Federation get involved in this, use some of the power of the monopoly that they hold on the equipment and comms systems.
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And for a Power group that really vets people thats not going to happen. The Private in Private Group is a clue.
But the chance is more than zero, so you can never know. And given that even in V2 you will have systems that act as magnets (as in, strategic systems that other vulnerable systems rely on and that you have an uncapped tug of war for control) you can't say you'll see no-one.
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Indeed - noting that those intent on 5th column operations will do what they need to, once anyway, to get in.
While the chance is non zero, it is not necessarily going to be that much more than zero, for the reasons mentioned above and taking into account time of day. Then there's the relative risk/difficulty to those on each side posed by any encounter, noting the skill distribution of players (50% are at or below median skill), loadout, etc., etc..... It may be that the skilled player in the G5 optimised combat ship faces neither risk nor challenge - so would not reasonably get any enhancement to their effect / reward on the feature (it could even be a reduction).
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For any that did not watch the video, this link to a key moment does, I think, sum up the reason for Power Play.
Source: https://youtu.be/zoTnEZng-V8?t=2307
I find it hilarious that the same domineering folk who turn the open play cosmos into a deathmatch arena, focused only upon key sites for new PvE players, now want to be able to influence the closed world exclusively too.
The reverse psychology of Power Play is genius though, get them away from PvE key spots by convincing them that it was their own idea to do so; I for one really hope that it works. Well, to put that rather more politely, by giving them other status and power related things to do.
I absolutely love the engineering side of the game and would really love to be able to leave the game in open mode, currently I can't, I hope Power Play fixes this.
I find it hilarious that the same domineering folk who turn the open play cosmos into a deathmatch arena, focused only upon key sites for new PvE players, now want to be able to influence the closed world exclusively too.
The reverse psychology of Power Play is genius though, get them away from PvE key spots by convincing them that it was their own idea to do so; I for one really hope that it works. Well, to put that rather more politely, by giving them other status and power related things to do.
I absolutely love the engineering side of the game and would really love to be able to leave the game in open mode, currently I can't, I hope Power Play fixes this.
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