Platform Wars

sirchick

S
Seandroid said:
Please, please God Mac compatibility.

I would love you forever. And if at all possible could it be developed in house? Aspyr is lovely and all, but RCT3 Mac, including the Platinum version which was JUST RELEASED, is the buggiest thing on the planet.

<3
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If it was made with MAC in mind it would had loads of things that could not be implemented it would be worse than RCT3. MACs are not for games. You should know that. It truly won't be worth considering MAC given the so few gamers on it. The cost to make it work on it does not really pay off.

Just emulate windows in MAC. Not that i see a logic to using MAC all specs and technical information about it is beaten by Windows 7.
 
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Seandroid

S
sirchick said:
If it was made with MAC in mind it would had loads of things that could not be implemented it would be worse than RCT3. MACs are not for games. You should know that. It truly won't be worth considering MAC given the so few gamers on it. The cost to make it work on it does not really pay off.

Just emulate windows in MAC. Not that i see a logic to using MAC all specs and technical information about it is beaten by Windows 7.
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I'm just going to say this right here:

1. You have no idea what you're talking about. Macs use the same processors and GPUs as PCs and support games just as well. They're just not developed for Macs as often because it's a smaller community, but the Mac community is constantly growing and it's definitely worth it to release a Mac version of the game. There is even Steam for Mac now, Portal 2, The Sims, Half Life, Call of Duty... all of these games are available on the Mac.

"All specs and technical information about it is beaten by Windows 7." That is the stupidest thing I have ever read. That doesn't even make any sense.

2. I'm not getting in a Mac VS PC argument with you on Frontier's forums. You don't know what you're talking about, it's useless and the discussion ends here, I'm sure the mods will appreciate that.

Dont criticize other people's suggestions, especially when you don't have any idea what you're talking about and have nothing meaningful to add.
 

coasttocoaster

C
I agree totally with the post above. Sirchick hasn't been around a MAC in a few years, has he?? Anyway, PLEASE make the game MAC compatible.
 

sirchick

S
Looks like I offended some fan boys of MACs. I own a mac but I use it for a specific thing but that doesn't mean I don't know what im talking about as I am a game developer myself on MMORPG's.

MACs have higher spec requirement than windows it always has probably always will - im not going to go into that you can use Google. But beside that fact im referring to game development which I guess you guys don't do where as I do.

In order to make a game work across different platforms you have to build the engine to do so, there in lies issues with what's possible and what's not. And what is possible in one OS is possible in another but approached entirely different this is where problems arise.

This is why MAC game support is not near the level of Windows because the effort is not worth the pay off.

Secondly there are 2 main choices in engine development. OpenGL and Direct X. I don't have to go into detail cos theres no way to dispute that DX is much further ahead than OpenGL and is much larger supported and allows easier port to Xbox, and is much more likely easier to use as its been around since windows. Simply fact is DX is better and better supported.

If the game is to be compatible across many platforms then OpenGL would be the choice but there in lies the limitations it provides. Now im not saying that we should not have a MAC compatibility, what I am saying is that if that is the case we are likely to sacrifice something for the game.

Its down to weather the sales of MAC games is truly worth the time and effort for cross platform. I would say most companies say it isn't and so don't bother or they wait longer to release a MAC version once they made enough money back to afford to.

Crysis has this problem with their cry engine 1 and cry engine 2 was the solution. Their second engine worked on consoles their first did not. How ever they received quite a backlash on cry engine 2 because it looked worse than the first and their Crysis 2 game scored less on most review sites than their first because it was far more limited.

Your welcome to cry about me talking down about your much loved MAC. Your probably too emotionally attached to it by sounds of your replies that you gave.... but these are cold hard truths about developing a game so get used to it.
 

Seandroid

S
sirchick said:
Looks like I offended some fan boys of MACs. I own a mac but I use it for a specific thing but that doesn't mean I don't know what im talking about as I am a game developer myself on MMORPG's.

MACs have higher spec requirement than windows it always has probably always will - im not going to go into that you can use Google. But beside that fact im referring to game development which I guess you guys don't do where as I do.

In order to make a game work across different platforms you have to build the engine to do so, there in lies issues with what's possible and what's not. And what is possible in one OS is possible in another but approached entirely different this is where problems arise.

This is why MAC game support is not near the level of Windows because the effort is not worth the pay off.

Secondly there are 2 main choices in engine development. OpenGL and Direct X. I don't have to go into detail cos theres no way to dispute that DX is much further ahead than OpenGL and is much larger supported and allows easier port to Xbox, and is much more likely easier to use as its been around since windows. Simply fact is DX is better and better supported.

If the game is to be compatible across many platforms then OpenGL would be the choice but there in lies the limitations it provides. Now im not saying that we should not have a MAC compatibility, what I am saying is that if that is the case we are likely to sacrifice something for the game.

Its down to weather the sales of MAC games is truly worth the time and effort for cross platform. I would say most companies say it isn't and so don't bother or they wait longer to release a MAC version once they made enough money back to afford to.

Crysis has this problem with their cry engine 1 and cry engine 2 was the solution. Their second engine worked on consoles their first did not. How ever they received quite a backlash on cry engine 2 because it looked worse than the first and their Crysis 2 game scored less on most review sites than their first because it was far more limited.

Your welcome to cry about me talking down about your much loved MAC. Your probably too emotionally attached to it by sounds of your replies that you gave.... but these are cold hard truths about developing a game so get used to it.
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This is the last thing I'm saying:

1. Mac is not an acronym, stop capitalizing all of it that drives me nuts.

2. Stop insulting me for my computer preference. I work at a computer store that retails PCs and you're calling me a Mac fanboy just because I want a game to work on my preferred platform? Are you a PC fanboy for wanting it to be on your computer instead of consoles?

3. You seem to be completely unaware of recent developments in technology for porting PC games to Mac: http://www.macworld.com/article/52176/2006/08/cider.html The games perform just as well as they do on Windows and it's completely transparent to Mac users. It manages the application calls on the fly and makes games work perfectly on Macs.

And your reasoning for the Cry Engine 2 looking mediocre is strictly because of consoles and absolutely has nothing to do with Macs requiring higher specs to run games. That doesn't even make any sense.

Michael Brookes said:
Lets keep platform wars out of this thread please. While we're not discussing release platforms yet, speaking generally we always look to support whatever platforms suit the kind of game we are making (of course publishers tend to have an input on this as well).

Thanks

Michael
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Good to hear! :) I didn't mean to start an argument I just felt it was pretty unfair to have someone freak out for suggesting the game be available on my computer platform.
 

sirchick

S
Seandroid said:
This is the last thing I'm saying:

1. Mac is not an acronym, stop capitalizing all of it that drives me nuts.

2. Stop insulting me for my computer preference. I work at a computer store that retails PCs and you're calling me a Mac fanboy just because I want a game to work on my preferred platform? Are you a PC fanboy for wanting it to be on your computer instead of consoles?

3. You seem to be completely unaware of recent developments in technology for porting PC games to Mac: http://www.macworld.com/article/52176/2006/08/cider.html The games perform just as well as they do on Windows and it's completely transparent to Mac users. It manages the application calls on the fly and makes games work perfectly on Macs.

And your reasoning for the Cry Engine 2 looking mediocre is strictly because of consoles and absolutely has nothing to do with Macs requiring higher specs to run games. That doesn't even make any sense.



Good to hear! :) I didn't mean to start an argument I just felt it was pretty unfair to have someone freak out for suggesting the game be available on my computer platform.
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I take back the fanboy comment I apologise... lets keep it intellectual...

I say MAC (cos its short for Macintosh) like i say PC (short for personal computer). It is not important.

Either way like i said my point entirely was DirectX vs OpenGL if you read half my post - guessing you didn't. Direct X is windows & Xbox. MAC may have DX but not the latest versions! And OpenGL is preferred choice for MAC because it also runs on Linux OS so you kill two birds with one stone. How ever OpenGL is behind DirectX by quite some way.

So it would impair the game by taking Linux and MAC into consideration much the same as my example of taking consoles into consideration. Only consoles is hardware issues, MAC/Linux and others is game software support issues.

And like i said i develop MMORPGs i develop on OpenGL for cross platform. But i would prefer DX when ever available because its much easier to use and is much more efficient and has more available features.

Your welcome to deny it all but its just how it is.

Additionally Nvidia cards do not support MAC computers for drivers see here:
http://www.nvidia.co.uk/Download/index.aspx?lang=en-uk

So incorporating MAC already eliminates Phys X engine as an option which is a great bit of software to use for game development.

I'm not aiming this at MAC specifically - but Linux would also cause it or console ports.. all 3 of them will cause limitations.

I'm not going to argue this any more this is just how it is dude. If frontier make it cross platform and then Atari make one with just windows in mind they have the advantage of using more features and thus out sell in the market its just a bad stragety when you know you got a close rival for this game.
 
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xnode

xnode
As a developer myself, the MAC argument of good and bad has always been on the front of what platform to develop something in. Sadly, MAC has one issue that most developers do know, it's called cost. Not just cost for designing an engine to work with a MAC OS directly, but the licensing is killer. The issue with Apple in general is they protect their assets religiously, so much so anyone willing to "or wanting to" develop within the MAC OS will pay threw the nose for it. Have you ever wondered why most MAC titles be it gaming or application cost so much? Well there is a big % take reason for it. In the end, if you want more things developed for the MAC, your best bet? Petition apple to be more open on licensing. Good luck with that however, that is their bread and butter.

Personally I love the mac for it's simple application and usuage, I hate it for development or developing for, beyond the licensing issues the restriction on what you can and can't not access in their OS alone is just a nightmare. Basicly everything works on their moduals and nothing else. Eh I am on a rant huh? Didn't mean too, but I have been with companies that have tried to work with apple on this and even myself selling a particular application I developed. In the end I converted to a browser base system to give the big finger to apple in a way. Avoiding the issue of an OS all togather.

Anyways, I get both side, I would again love to develop more for the MAC's they are great systems. Sadly, they are under lock and key as much as Itunes is, this won't change. The only saving grace is the Open CL, but even that only allows for older GL software to be cross-platformed. Eh hopfully we will see a change, but in all of apples history, this has never happened.

-xnode
 

Geraldine

Geraldine
pc-mac-amiga.jpg


Yaaay! Amigas still rock! :cool:
 

Spacegamer

Spacegamer
Pointless argument, as I have pointed out before when was the last time Frontier made a PC game never mind a Mac game.

It will probably be a console game.
 
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zmurf

zmurf
NOOOoooo! They HAVE to release it for the BBC micro... or else there will be no point of trying to play it.

...

Yeah... I believe platform wars are really silly. :p
 

gunbladelad

gunbladelad
Nah - they have to make sure it's able to run on the ZX80...

In all seriousness though, as long as a game I'm sure to enjoy is released on a format I actually have (or able to run on my ancient PC), then I'm happy

Now here's a thought - perhaps Frontier Developments could do the Elite trilogy on the handheld market - I'm sure the touchscreens would be ideal for the maps & menu screens, while the current batch of analogue controls could be utilised for the actual flight.
 
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