Please Preserve the Status of Elite

[Zaphod Beeblebrox IV]

For many of us class of '84 players the hard yakka needed to rise through the ranks was a big attraction and we got a huge amount of satisfaction and feeling of pride when we eventually got that founders world permit. It was a slog but we welcomed the grind for a year or more to get there and when we did we were experienced pilots and had a good understanding of the game mechanics. Now with the new mining and exploration tools and help from social media you can get to Elite in trade or exploration in a matter of weeks. I can understand that Frontier want to cater to the instant gratification brigade and also make the game more playable for those people who can only spare a few hours a week and I have no problem with that. I don't care if someone who has been only playing a few months has a billion credits (an unthinkably large sum for the vast majority of pilots a few years ago) and all the big ships but I do care that they are able to rise up the ranks in the pilots federation with such ease. It cheapens that aspect of the game and it does them a disservice in that they will now be facing elite NPCs and they don't have the skills to do that.
Please increase the cost of ranking up in the pilots federation to balance the ease with which credits can now be earned or come up with a different mechanic to measure a pilots competence.

 

[Robert Maynard]

The three rankings are not a measure of a CMDR's competence - as there are no setbacks to progress in them.

They're more akin to service medals than skill indicators.

 

[rum punch]

For many of us class of '84 players the hard yakka needed to rise through the ranks was a big attraction and we got a huge amount of satisfaction and feeling of pride when we eventually got that founders world permit. It was a slog but we welcomed the grind for a year or more to get there and when we did we were experienced pilots and had a good understanding of the game mechanics. Now with the new mining and exploration tools and help from social media you can get to Elite in trade or exploration in a matter of weeks. I can understand that Frontier want to cater to the instant gratification brigade and also make the game more playable for those people who can only spare a few hours a week and I have no problem with that. I don't care if someone who has been only playing a few months has a billion credits (an unthinkably large sum for the vast majority of pilots a few years ago) and all the big ships but I do care that they are able to rise up the ranks in the pilots federation with such ease. It cheapens that aspect of the game and it does them a disservice in that they will now be facing elite NPCs and they don't have the skills to do that.
Please increase the cost of ranking up in the pilots federation to balance the ease with which credits can now be earned or come up with a different mechanic to measure a pilots competence.

I totally agree that todays mining of opals or low temp diamonds makes it too easy to become elite in trade. Its not fair to older players who had to grind out an elite in trade the hard way, The devs have given a free pass to new players this way by making large amount of credits too easy to get. I and the players who have been on for a long time had to grind credits and elite in trade, now its way too easy to become credit wealthy and elite trade.
CMDR RUM PUNCH

 

[Igor[Rock]]

The three rankings are not a measure of a CMDR's competence - as there are no setbacks to progress in them.

They're more akin to service medals than skill indicators.

Well, if they are too easy to get, they are basically worthless. And I'm quite sure they are not like "service medals", because of how the ranks are named.

To say it in another way (with a movie quote):

If everybody is super, nobody is.

Don't get me wrong, it's not that I want others to suffer - but if everybody can get to the highest rank in the pilot's federation in no time (with just a few days of playing the game), then that "highest rank" isn't "high" anymore, but more or less an implicitness of just playing the game for a few hours (read: nothing which feels like you actually achieved something, and as such completely devaluating the whole game experience). You are suddenly not a member of an Elite group of experienced pilots anymore, but just a normal member of that group, since everybody can get to that rank in not time, and as such "being Elite" is more or less something everybody is actually expecting from you to be in no time.

Just my 2ct as an old time gamer as well (who really thinks that that whole "instant gratification" nonsense which is growing like a cancer in our society and in newer games is quite bad for everybody in the long run).

 

[Robert Maynard]

Well, if they are too easy to get, they are basically worthless. And I'm quite sure they are not like "service medals", because of how the ranks are named.

It's not that they are easy, or hard, to get - all they have ever taken was time, even in the original (the original being a game where a player could revert to a previous save at any time).

 

[Vasco Sapien]

I will support any initiative or idea that works against the gradual dumbing down of ED.
Ive been vocal on these forums for years about how easy ED is becoming and how unrewarding the gameplay is subsequently getting.

 

[Ian Doncaster]

Don't get me wrong, it's not that I want others to suffer - but if everybody can get to the highest rank in the pilot's federation in no time (with just a few days of playing the game), then that "highest rank" isn't "high" anymore

The first triple Elite - in the original 1.0 when earnings were a lot lower - only took about a month. It could certainly be done quicker nowadays - road to riches, void opals, Thargoid Scouts - but it was never exactly slow if you went all-out at it. (Me, I didn't go all out, so I'm still only Deadly in combat and don't expect that to change for a while)

And some fast approaches - park AFK next to a friendly CZ capship, for example - have been removed since 1.0

 

[Zaphod Beeblebrox IV]

It's not that they are easy, or hard, to get - all they have ever taken was time, even in the original (the original being a game where a player could revert to a previous save at any time).

No you are wrong. Rank progression is directly related to credits earned in trade, exploration or combat you, therefore, have to successfully participate in these disciplines to advance. When payouts were a lot lower than now days that was a lot of participation and consequently your competence in performing these tasks improved. By accepting higher ranked and more highly rewarded missions you could accelerate your progression while increasing the risk of going to rebuy screen, failing the mission and losing rep with the faction that gave you it. As stated above it is now so ludicrously easy to earn credits that it has made a mockery of the ranking system and Fdev need to rebalance this. It's not like it is a difficult thing to do in a coding sense.

 

[Dave G]

I think FD should introduce a Mining ranking, so all mined metals/minerals can count towards that instead of trade.

 

[Roybe]

This relates directly back to my original discussion about the economics of any game!

When there are not enough economic sinks...the game loses its luster.....

 

[NoFans]

Its always been a piece of p*ss to get to trade Elite.
Stacked Robigo runs any one?

 

[Zaphod Beeblebrox IV]

Its always been a piece of p*ss to get to trade Elite.
Stacked Robigo runs any one?

Yes we know but that is deliberately choosing to take advantage of a legitimate in game exploit, like going to Daves Hope for mats. This is now just part of the normal game play.

 

[Zaphod Beeblebrox IV]

I think FD should introduce a Mining ranking, so all mined metals/minerals can count towards that instead of trade.

I quite like that suggestion and maybe we could add a requirement for a number of first to fully map systems to the exploration.

 

[dm06]

OP, do you want some kind of "age" in the game and unlock access to some game "features" (systems/planets/ships) according to that grade?
It would be nice, really.
- I want to visit Sol!
- not permitted, you have not played 5000 hours yet, sorry!

 

[Bowak]

I and the players who have been on for a long time had to grind credits and elite in trade, now its way too easy to become credit wealthy and elite trade.

I can understand that view, but for those of us who are returning and who bounced hard off the original grind after release, the recent changes are an absolute godsend. If I'm understanding correctly, combat elite is still a huge task, and that used to be the only elite available back in the day!

 

[CMDR Thorn]

What does it matter how long it takes to reach Elite and get to the Founders World? Yes I used Void Opals to get Elite in trading (although I was already 80% in Tycoon from pre-opals so...). I still felt a sense of accomplishment getting there. Not long after that I went exploring and got Exploration Elite (I was already Ranger). I also felt a sense of accomplishment doing that (I didn't do Road to Riches either).

I hate to tell you this, but taking a week or two to do something isn't instant gratification. Sure its faster than usual, but dedicating a week or more of your life to purely void opal mining would be INCREDIBLY tedious.

IMO people who think that stuff should be harder "Just because it took me ages" sound super Elitist and just want their trophy to be hard to get so that they can still feel special.

 

[pzykozomatik]

Yesterday I was very surprised when I already got to Exploration Elite on a relatively fresh CMDR who's on DW2, only half way to Colonia.

It seems Combat is the only rank left that takes a bit more time and effort to reach Elite (although I guess you could dive into a week or two of mindless Thargoid Scout killing and be done with that one too).

 

[count_headshot]

Well, one thing is for sure: attention spans as well as the number of games on offer have changed since 1984. Personally, available time to play has changed a bit in the past 30 years (I played Elite from 1988 or 89 when I got my first Amiga). In fact, ED is risky these days because it does involve a lot of grinding. It takes up a lot of time. And people want gratification at some point.

If you stretch the point of gratification even farther, you'll lose players left and right. I think ED is for determined players only anyway. But we live in a world where casual games are abundant, with even lots of AAA titles fitting that bill. Compared to ED, even other open world games like Assassin's Creed or Horizon Zero Dawn are 'casual'.

 

[Lateralus]

Seen as the ranks are a measure of grind not skill, who cares?

 

[Fake Newts]

There is no 'status' to having Elite beyond whatever internal narrative you've invented for yourself. As others have said, being Elite in a particular area has never actually been a good indicator of mastery of the game's mechanics, just that you did something repetitively for a long time. A big problem with Elite is that it genuinely has a very high skill ceiling, but very rarely does this actually tie in to the progression mechanics. Possibly the best example of this is ranking up with superpowers, when people post things like "I finally got [Cutter/Corvette]!" all it really tells us is that they have an enormous amount of patience, not that they have acquired it through the application of any skill. (unpopular opinion: this also applies to the Hutton run, sorry... but the Hutton run is just saying, OK I had the time/sufficient TV or podcast backlog/marijuana to essentially wait for a progress bar to complete.)

Many players have to ask themselves whether they actually enjoy the bones of the game enough to spend this inordinate amount of time enabling the things they do enjoy by doing thousands of menial tasks with zero stakes and zero skill. Arguably this isn't particularly good game design. I accept that part of the game's unique charm can genuinely be the downtime, the podcastability and that I am probably not representative, but regardless of your personal preferences I still think looking on your rank/Cutter/permits with pride is a strange concept, given it doesn't require any actual mastery to achieve.

On top of this, Elite is a multiplayer game and, given the progression systems just revolve around accruing numbers, over a long enough time period any player of any skill can achieve the same 'level' as you. This is something games in the past have struggled with, like that Star Wars MMO that made the ill-judged decision to try and limit the number of people who could be Jedi (I can't remember the exact details of this... but it was dumb and bad). Credits, ships and ranks become entirely meaningless for any player who sticks around long enough - this is inevitable... and you're not special.

One of the funniest moments I had in Elite was while trawling a CG in a reverb-mining DBS not long after 2.1 dropped, and someone in a Cutter started chatting to me in local (clearly not understanding my intentions as I approached them) and said these actual words: "hey little guy, maybe one day you too can fly one of these " at which point I stripped his shields off and he combat logged. The funniest part of this being that I already owned a Cutter and was flying a DBS by choice, because Cutters are f*cking boring.

TL;DR, it's meaningless and imaginary, get over yourself