Citation needed
Powerplay in Solo
- Thread starter Aquaface
- Start date
Citation: Your anecdotal evidence is not better than my anecdotal evidence.
Ok, I've spoken to players outside here and your evidence is anecdotal. Good for you.
Still pretty anecdotal mate.
There's a brick wall outside that puts forward more edifying arguments by way that I can hear the echo of my own voice on it.
Have you got anything better than "no it isn't"?
Are you on multiple open house discords where players from multiple squad have expressed an interest in having a truly competitive multiplayer experience in this game or are you just arguing for the sake of arguing?
Can't agree more! I also think that both PP and BGS contributions should be higher in Open than in Solo or PG. It's frustrating and nonsensical that players in those modes have as much influence and can't be bothered.
Specially when a system's state is "War" involving at least one PMF, I think CZ wins in Open should be at the very least twice as important as CZ wins in other modes.
I typically see three different kinds of people.
The most common are those who never set foot in open, and advise others against doing so as well.
The next are those who claim to be in favor of things like open only Power Play, but then do all of their power play activities in secret.
The last are the people who are actually in favor of open only stuff. They walk the walk and talk the talk ... but I've never seen one of them actually doing anything other than PVP or ganking. For them, open only would just mean more targets, it would never actually mean more vulnerability on their behalf.
So you have the Practical, the hypocritical, and the self-centered. Honestly, it's a fairly refreshing slice of humanity pie.
The most common are those who never set foot in open, and advise others against doing so as well.
The next are those who claim to be in favor of things like open only Power Play, but then do all of their power play activities in secret.
The last are the people who are actually in favor of open only stuff. They walk the walk and talk the talk ... but I've never seen one of them actually doing anything other than PVP or ganking. For them, open only would just mean more targets, it would never actually mean more vulnerability on their behalf.
So you have the Practical, the hypocritical, and the self-centered. Honestly, it's a fairly refreshing slice of humanity pie.
now watch a goalpost teleporting:
so why do you ask in the first place?
indeed it doesn't really matter, no platform is representative, frontier's data mining is and we are never going to get even a glimpse on that. also, afaik this is a company developed product, not a democracy, so majorities are quite pointless, vocal or otherwise.
op's point is indeed strong and pretty incontrovertible. elite is a rarity in this unique design, it is something that puzzles/frustrates/marvels newcomers systematically. it ... sort of works, and it's what giving frontier lots of $$$$ so it will stay. some move on, some adapt, some like it, and from those ... a little tiny minority loves to bask around ...
no, that's your faulty logic ;-)
with proper logic they could of course enjoy their engineering ... in solo, which is where they would have gotten it.
now watch a goalpost teleporting:
so why do you ask in the first place?
indeed it doesn't really matter, no platform is representative, frontier's data mining is and we are never going to get even a glimpse on that. also, afaik this is a company developed product, not a democracy, so majorities are quite pointless, vocal or otherwise.
op's point is indeed strong and pretty incontrovertible. elite is a rarity in this unique design, it is something that puzzles/frustrates/marvels newcomers systematically. it ... sort of works, and it's what giving frontier lots of $$$$ so it will stay. some move on, some adapt, some like it, and from those ... a little tiny minority loves to bask around ...
uh huh.
Actually I think this is a great compromise. Don't remove it from solo but give it a boosted effect if done in open.
The trouble is, what would be a fair bonus for such a thing?
As many others have pointed out, your actual chances of running into another player in open are very small unless you are in a very specific set of locations. I've seen numbers like one in a hundred thrown around.
Using those odds, a fair bonus for open Play would be about 1%.
As many others have pointed out, your actual chances of running into another player in open are very small unless you are in a very specific set of locations. I've seen numbers like one in a hundred thrown around.
Using those odds, a fair bonus for open Play would be about 1%.
I was thinking about this same thing while driving to dinner earlier. It's a tough question to answer because you're 100% right. Outside of the popular and meta systems, encountering other players is rare. I'm not sure I have a good answer.
To me, the answer is pretty simple; base any rewards purely on whether or not you actually have a PVP encounter.
It's the only solution that fairly distributes rewards based on actual risk.
It's the only solution that fairly distributes rewards based on actual risk.
Unfortunately that can easily be gamed. Have some friends interdict and attack u numerous times. Maybe even let themselves get blown up. Rebuy is cheap in late game.
Only if doing so generates resources from nothing. If it just redistributes it, then it becomes little different from buying merits from a station to haul them.
But you can't really know that.
And I expect some players in ED as a whole don't have engineering. I just don't think thats for very long in the main game or in Powerplay. The latter especially, since you have to quickly move beyond a stock ship to do useful levels of work.
Which in Powerplay makes no sense, otherwise you are negating hostile territory and making it pointless. Something has to make hostile space hostile, otherwise- whats it for? Its yet more game left to rot.
The threat has to impact the player in either compromised loadout, ship, time etc, otherwise its not doing its job. Like I say above, whats the point of territory otherwise? Being safe in a hostile space is absurd, especially since NPCs seem incapable of doing that but players can.
It also suggests you view skill as being the same or below a player, while I like to view the skill ceiling being set slightly higher.
Its was more of a thought experiment than anything else. But again it is possible if you move players and NPCs away from stations. If NPCs are nasty enough and allowed to roam in POIs it would be ideal- the hidden trader POI is a perfect fit for that, since it randomises distances and locations, makes cargo transfer risky, allows engineered NPCs to attack freely.
You can go after Thargoids after an hour- would you? Its pretty representative of most pledges since most players get funneled though offical groups at one point. And since Powerplay is finding efficiency you really have to engineer to compete. When I started 10,000 merits was a multi week marathon. Today that can be done in a day- AFK turretboats in PG have been seen generating 300,000 merits a week- whats that, thirty times Rank 5?
You risk your ship to achieve that, in a more risky environment. Its like cycling on a path and then cycling on a road- the road with cars and more risks is the more dangerous to get where you are going.
See the flash topic; it wasnt just a discussion drowned out by the usual sneering, because it drew much wider opinion than the usual solo forumites, which is an unrepresentative minority, as I said in the first place. See also Obsidian Ants poll from the time, which flipped his attitude around. The results reflected the same ratio of pro/against replies as the flash topic did.
If a Lead Developer for ED thinks its a discussion worth having, then its really your "everybody except him" who's playing the wrong game. Just because you lot on this forum have managed to drive many who think the same way off the forum with forum ganking (lol) doesnt mean youre right, just that persistent harassment works as a way to silence people.
Open shouldnt be penalised in every aspect of the game. it demands more focus & compromised builds at a bare minimum, and being stopped altogether & requiring teamwork to overcome it, in a time of conflict. Which is ofc when you really want to get more done.
Actually, if you were around when the idea was floated by a member of FDev staff (and by your forum date you were), paying attention to those threads did show a majority of posters in favour of many of the proposed changes, but a lot of posts from less posters opposing any changes. So...
argh. stick them at the top. working the new format on this .... phone is gonna take a while.
sounds like youve found yourself a toxic wasteland there. I dont know what kind of actual experience you have to draw these conclusions but based on my years of experience, working with and against dozens of groups, it seems youve created a fantasy to support your preconceptions. It is so caricatured, cliched and far from reality, frankly, if you have any real experience of what you speak, then youve just gone and lied about it. If not, then you really need to get out of the toxic dumpster youve managed to find for yourself. it doesnt represent most groups, at all.
The pragmatic, hypocritical and self-centred Powerplayers are the ones ragging the mechanics in solo, and ignoring that those same mechanics they criticise and ridicule, only lead to quality gameplay when carried out in Open, with direct competition that drives tactics & strategy to a level beyond just a mindless grind-race.
Im in a Power that isnt and never has been PvP focused. We're 'The Gardeners of the Galaxy' lol, the first Power to 100% favourable control bubbles. We cant control who pledges, which is a good design decision imo; theres no dictating to pledges, only persuading. The vast majority haul & fight & BGS in Open, not least because if youre not bumping into other players you end up in forever-wars instead of being able to negotiate an arrangement where both sides get what they want, without having to overcome a stubborn opponent.
Can you persuade absolutely everyone to act against their pragmatic, self-centered best interests? Well no. when theyre focused on doing the best thing for the group, it does take some determination to ignore the single most effective measure : clicking Solo/PG.
Thats why there needs to be a counterbalance, its why the modes system fails Powerplay, not least because the simple opt-out of difficulty deprives the need to have properly organised defensive tactics, thus making it more likely players will get frustrated & opt-out, in a feedback loop that nerfs all the benefits of competing in Open.
A ratio of merit benefit to being in Open isnt ideal, as it simply kicks the opt-out option further down the road. At some point, wrecking the essence of the whole competition becomes an efficiency option, and it shouldnt ever be that. but it is far better than nothing
We do play open only.
Always.
This is why I serve the King of Pirates.
Always.
This is why I serve the King of Pirates.