PvP features for Elite and an actual PvP system

[Crimson Kaim]

Since the removal of CGs, there haven't been many reasons to log on for PvPers. There is only one hotspot left, which is founder's world and no, the PvP there is nothing really meaningful and more something of a sport than a strategic encounter where you have to improvise.

PvP is underrepresented in Elite, especially since it is advertised as MMO. It's a massively co-op at best right now. PvP is implemented soley by the possibility to attack other players. There is nothing more to it. It's neither lucrative or has any influence on anything. Maybe powerplay if you manage to shoot some merits out of someone's hold but that's really about it.

And since we have alot of time for theories and discussions until end of 2020, I'd like to ask what you PvPers would like to see in Elite.
For example, I'd like to see players dropping materials depending on the garde and value of heir ship they died in. PvP only conflict zones that reward you with a special currency which you can use to purchase PvP exclusive stuff like specialized ship variants or weapons or modules.
Squad carriers, for obvious reasons.
A draconian punishment for high notoriety PvPers (100% rebuy*[Grade of module]) to make being a criminal more fun and dangerous.
Better ruleset for professional PvP (5 minute logout-timer, instancing priorizes recent PvP encounter participants, etc.).

And some other thigns that do not come into my mind as of now. But what else could possibly happen to make PvP meaningful in the current state of the game? I know we had this topic already but the game never stops changing and so does (not) this topic. Just brainstorm your ideas, the more the better.

 

[Vedmo]

100% opposed to PvP only currency and rewards. A road that inevitably splits games into two things that never really mesh.

100% for player ships dropping materials like any other ship.

I like the idea of players and npcs functioning the same so far as mechanics, to the point I don't think there should be hollow squares denoting a difference, limits on bounties, nor do I think any game play like CZs should be player only.

How to create more PvP in a game that doesn't go out of its way to create much of anything so far as structured content? I'd say that's up to the players who want to pvp, just as explorers and traders and racers create their own content through expeditions, station repairs, and races. Otherwise, take it as it comes in a galaxy where running into other people isn't exactly a common occurrence.

Hopefully though, the new CGs will arrive soon with plenty of player engagement.

 

[Bloodsign]

Vedmo put it nicely, everyone finds their own path in Elite, PvPers need to do so as well. I do think it's reasonable to have material drops and no special rules for player bounties, but beyond that, PvPers must define their own purpose.

I'd like to see some stuff like pitched battles, organized by squadrons. PvP Group A challenges PvP Group B to an SRV battle on such and such a planet, etc. The sides deploy at fixed coordinates and then go at it.

Or massive fleet battles, where you set a tag in your ship name to designate your side. It seems like the only real limitations that PvPers are dealing with is their own imagination.

 

[ethelred]

I'd like to see the careers of pirates, terrorists and bounty hunters/white hats given some love, perhaps with a meta Power play framework.

Some ideas:-

In high and med sec systems BH should be able to jump in and pilot security ATR ships.

Terrorists should have anarchy/invite only engineers and systems that are "safe", everywhere else they are hunted

Leaderboard for stolen cargo sold, to incentivise piracy over simple ship destruction. Stolen goods should be worth a lot more.

As we're wishing for unicorns, I'd also like to see smuggling given some love!

 

[Old Duck]

Just brainstorm your ideas, the more the better.

I can't take credit for any of the following ideas, I'm just taking tried-and-true concepts from other successful PvP games.

1) Teams. Sure, Battle Royale is all the rage, but everyone starts off on an equal footing in BR. ED PvP always favors those with the best ships. Teams can help "even the odds". The easiest way to do this IMO is war-based CGs with PvP-only CZs. A bigger rework of the game would separate the Pilot's Federation from a new Pirate's League. One could even make PF "safe" (no friendly-fire) and the PL "brutal" (FF on, since pirates stab each other in the back all the time).​

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2) Goals. Give me a megaship to escort to a jump point, or a orbital asset to breach, etc. "Deathmatch" is one valid style, but we need more.​

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3) Reduced cost of death. If I'm fighting for a powerful faction at a CG, then they should help pay for ships lost in combat. Air Force pilots aren't expected to buy their very expensive jet every time they are shot down.​

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4) Some sort of matchmaking. Not CQC style, but again the CG seems the perfect tool for this, as it gives players something to sign up for and a location to go fight. Expecting me to join Discord and arrange my own PvP out-of-game is stupid - I'd rather just fire up Overwatch or any other PvP game I own.​

That's pretty much all that comes to mind. FWIW, CQC doesn't do it for me, even though it has some of the elements listed about. If CQC had a much broader array of ships to choose from (like Overwatch's character roster), and other people actually played it, and it wasn't just CLOSE quarters (I like the space in space, or even the space in an asteroid field), then it might be my go-to for spaceship PvP.

 

[Gaarp Kobayashi]

100% opposed to PvP only currency and rewards. A road that inevitably splits games into two things that never really mesh. (...)

My friend, literally all major MMOs out there are having those!

I was a PvPer in Star Wars the Old Republic for few years, while enjoying PvE raids alongside 32 players same time. That was hell of a times!!!

It was so addicting had to cut out from the game at some point.

Dedicated PvP areas and PvP dedicated rewards should be a must-be for any successful MMO.

It would also totally resolve many other issues with ED, like ganking by bored PvPers etc.

 

[Old Duck]

My friend, literally all major MMOs out there are having those!

I'm not a fan of separate PvE and PvP armor and weapons. PvP-only rewards, like being able to win Prismatic shields or Guardian Weapons would be cool IMO as long as PvEers can still grind those out the old-fashioned way. I'd much rather PvP than deliver stupid pamphlets.

 

[Wargfoot]

My friend, literally all major MMOs out there are having those!
Dedicated PvP areas and PvP dedicated rewards should be a must-be for any successful MMO.
It would also totally resolve many other issues with ED, like ganking by bored PvPers etc.

Please no.
Just no.

Let's take a closer look at a couple of items:

Dedicated PvP areas …... should be a must-be for any successful MMO.

How busy is the arena these days?

It would also totally resolve many other issues with ED, like ganking by bored PvPers etc.

No, it wouldn't.
The PvP crowd would grind out the rewards and go back to clubbing seals - people who club seals like it.

Honestly, I'm totally on pins and needles anymore.
The game is near perfect the way it is and I'm terrified that FD will actually read some of these suggestions and implement them.
Gah, just GAH.

 

[Vedmo]

My friend, literally all major MMOs out there are having those!

I was a PvPer in Star Wars the Old Republic for few years, while enjoying PvE raids alongside 32 players same time. That was hell of a times!!!

It was so addicting had to cut out from the game at some point.

Dedicated PvP areas and PvP dedicated rewards should be a must-be for any successful MMO.

It would also totally resolve many other issues with ED, like ganking by bored PvPers etc.

I realize that, and if I want to play literally any other mmo for PvP there are plenty of options.

I don't want Elite to be every other MMO. I place an immersive believable environment over mechanics to appease those who need every game to be a reskin of the same sales proven architecture.

ED is the closest I've come to finding something like the earliest days of WoW, in regards to being just another person making their way through a massive sandbox.

When pve and PvP rewards begin to get split (usually in the name of balance) it leads to fractured games, and when structured PvP instancing is introduced, it often further depletes open world, organic interactions.

I don't want those things in ED. Just my opinion.

 

[Gaarp Kobayashi]

Aight, lemme try something different for our PvPers then... Hold my beer!

 

[Old Duck]

The game is near perfect the way it is and I'm terrified that FD will actually read some of these suggestions and implement them.
Gah, just GAH.

You need to distract them. If Frontier is busy fixing bugs like the terrible shadows in PS4, they won't have time to implement these ideas you don't like. Join the cause, "Abolish Elephant Butt Leather!"

 

[Chaparral]

I 100% support a PVP rewards structure. CZs are legit pvp zones, but they don't seem to attract PVPr's - I wonder why?

1) An entirely new title/achievement badge based on level even or above pvp kills needs to be created.
2) Pvp combat in CZ's that result in a player death pay out 10x the base ship rating, and contribute double to ranking credit.
3) A ranked pvp leaderboard must be published and available through Glanet.
a) Displayable titles /skins/decals for PVP kill achievements should be made available (only level even or above kills count).
4) A pvp galmap-wide flag should be made an option.
5) PVP scenarios beyond CZs should be publicized with CG type rewards for participation.
6) Eliminate rebuy penalties (including insurance, restart location, lost cargo, missions etc.).

I hate to say it, but it is flatly impossible to distinguish between legit piracy and ganking for dunking sake under the current model. The only remedy I see would be to have transport missions that are Open only with an accompanying bubble-wide flag saying "fat cargo target here" and a commensurate huge payoff for misison completion. Those would be legit piracy targets (and no rebuy protection for cargo carriers).

 

[cmdr Ramius007]

I 100% support a PVP rewards structure. CZs are legit pvp zones, but they don't seem to attract PVPr's - I wonder why?

I don't want to sound negative, but with engineers any kind of balance has been lost forever, personally i was participating in any CG with conflict zone, but you enter CZ and see wing of 4 Cmdr's in pvp ships, i m alone what you can do... if highest ranked npc is worth 1/4 or even less of Cmdr flying same ship we can forget about any kind of balance. Only balanced pvp is prearranged duel when both opponents fly same loadout, or are informed about each other loadout
Too not waste dev's time best solution is to evolve MEANINGFUL pvp around power play with adjusted rules, like long log out timer, penalties for clogging, TBH i don't understand requests for lowering re-buys, not much we can do with money right now, there are evidence people with billions of credits in game clog, credits are not an issue really, not much can be done with credits now directly. Adjust rules in power play, perhaps create new game mode that offers those rules.

 

[Krash]

4) Some sort of matchmaking. Not CQC style, but again the CG seems the perfect tool for this, as it gives players something to sign up for and a location to go fight. Expecting me to join Discord and arrange my own PvP out-of-game is stupid - I'd rather just fire up Overwatch or any other PvP game I own.​

We've been talking about this for as long as I've been in the game. I created my own CG/PvP system in Eravate:
1. 2-6 massacre missions stacked, in process (20mil - 40mil)
2. Stack pirate assassination missions of the same faction (1.5mil - 2.5mil)
3. Travel back and forth (Eravate/LHS 3447) working on these missions offers PvP opportunities (including coop).
4. Collecting G5 mats (mission rewards and combat by-products)
5. Practice combat with different ships/weapon loadouts
6. Help noobs as the need arises.

An FDev system dedicated to this with formal matchmaking, leader boards and CQC type structures would take it to the next level, but i'm not holding my breath.

 

[Wargfoot]

I 100% support a PVP rewards structure. CZs are legit pvp zones, but they don't seem to attract PVPr's - I wonder why?

1) An entirely new title/achievement badge based on level even or above pvp kills needs to be created.
2) Pvp combat in CZ's that result in a player death pay out 10x the base ship rating, and contribute double to ranking credit.
3) A ranked pvp leaderboard must be published and available through Glanet.
a) Displayable titles /skins/decals for PVP kill achievements should be made available (only level even or above kills count).
4) A pvp galmap-wide flag should be made an option.
5) PVP scenarios beyond CZs should be publicized with CG type rewards for participation.
6) Eliminate rebuy penalties (including insurance, restart location, lost cargo, missions etc.).

I hate to say it, but it is flatly impossible to distinguish between legit piracy and ganking for dunking sake under the current model. The only remedy I see would be to have transport missions that are Open only with an accompanying bubble-wide flag saying "fat cargo target here" and a commensurate huge payoff for misison completion. Those would be legit piracy targets (and no rebuy protection for cargo carriers).

I think recognition for PvP activity is spot on but I wouldn't want additional in-game power for it.

 

[Gaarp Kobayashi]

Aight, lemme try something different for our PvPers then... Hold my beer!

Done! Enjoy and thank me latter!

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/threads/calling-out-all-pvpers.508847/

 

[Marra Morgan]

The game is near perfect the way it is and I'm terrified that FD will actually read some of these suggestions and implement them.

Lol I wouldn't be worried about that!

Have you read the Suggestions forum?

 

[Old Duck]

All this talk about PvP will likely make me play Elite less, because now I'm missing all my "real" PvP games. I just need to update / redownload them all. Limited bandwidth sucks!

"I'm the quick, you're the dead!"

 

[Crimson Kaim]

Some really nice stuff here, though I don't understand the fear about some PvP improvements.

I also thought about one thing, an "outpost" bubble that just has a hand full of systems, maybe to a maximum of 10, where all systems are anarchy but offer a wide variety of locations to do PvP for example CZs, military instalaltions, rings, planet surface objectives, etc.
There would need to be one larger station that offers somewhat good equipment and has a good shipyard, etc. The other systems may just be filled by a single, underdeveloped outpost that offers refuel, rearm and repair services.

The mini-bubble would be located 500-1000 lightyears or whatnot away from the actual bubble. Within the mini-bubble, FDev can experiment with new PvP features such as PvP CZs and objective based PvP.

 

[Wargfoot]

All this talk about PvP will likely make me play Elite less, because now I'm missing all my "real" PvP games. I just need to update / redownload them all. Limited bandwidth sucks!

"I'm the quick, you're the dead!"

I'll add you to my private group.
You can come blow me up, I'll post salt, life is good.