Python/Class 6 thruster issue? (Devs please have a look)

[CATPAIN KIRK]

Stat dump for those that care Just remember my percentages before were rough estimates. You might find solace or despair below:

Base Shield Health 390 - 260

0 Pips to engines
Maximum Speed 160 - 140
Max Boosted Speed 280 - 220

Max Forward Acceleration 32 - 30
Max Retro Acceleration 19 - 18
Max Transverse Acceleration 19 - 16

MaxPitchRate 30 - 22
MaxRollRate 100 - 90

4 Pips to engines
Maximum Speed 250 - 200
Max Boosted Speed 330 - 280
Max Pitch Rate 38 - 27

Hmm - certainly shifts it way more towards a trading vessel. Since used to be the Pythons original role, that brings it more in line with the traditional one.

Not something I personally fancy to fly, so I'll be looking forward to the upcoming ships. Thanks for taking the time to share .

 

[Starbuckz]

We know when, it's always the same answer I'm just not sure if Mike is allowed to use Michael's catchphrase

I would prefer sooner than later.. I love my Viper but I really could need some change of scenery ._.

 

[Logios]

This is the flight model if the optimal mass of the thrusters is exactly equal to the mass of the ship as a whole btw. Fit some better drives in their and it'll be faster.

It's top speed with A thrusters will be around 230 unless I'm missing something. That is VERY slow.

 

[Inodoro Pereyra]

Stat dump for those that care Just remember my percentages before were rough estimates. You might find solace or despair below:

Base Shield Health 390 - 260

0 Pips to engines
Maximum Speed 160 - 140
Max Boosted Speed 280 - 220

Max Forward Acceleration 32 - 30
Max Retro Acceleration 19 - 18
Max Transverse Acceleration 19 - 16

MaxPitchRate 30 - 22
MaxRollRate 100 - 90

4 Pips to engines
Maximum Speed 250 - 200
Max Boosted Speed 330 - 280
Max Pitch Rate 38 - 27

I have not a Python yet, but appears in the game in the shipyard screen that the actual boost is 280...

 

[Starbuckz]

No but that's been addressed already.

Ah alright, thanks for the heads-up.

 

[Mike Evans]

The problem with that statement is that applies to every single ship, the python isn't unique by being able to fit class A thrusters they all do, every single ship performs better than its statistics including the viper that is apparently the 100k measuring stick for balance.

Sure but different ships have different ranges of possibilities for it. The python is quite low on mass compared to the drives it can fit and thus pretty much gets a benefit no matter what. Other ships on the other hand get the short end of the stick unless they upgrade to the best drives they can.

 

[Toscaner]

Yarp. At least I think it is, it's been a very long time since that was implemented.

thanks. gonna sue you if it's not.

 

[MrReynolds]

So where's the chuffing expensive fighter now then?
The FDL when it gets released??????

 

[Starbuckz]

Hmm - certainly shifts it way more towards a trading vessel. Since used to be the Pythons original role, that brings it more in line with the traditional one.

Not something I personally fancy to fly, so I'll be looking forward to the upcoming ships. Thanks for taking the time to share .

As stated earlier, just because it will be a little more sluggish doesn't mean it won't be fit for combat. It still has strong shields and great weapon placement paired with really big guns.

 

[Derath]

Sure but different ships have different ranges of possibilities for it. The python is quite low on mass compared to the drives it can fit and thus pretty much gets a benefit no matter what. Other ships on the other hand get the short end of the stick unless they upgrade to the best drives they can.

Ok Ok.. your right I'm gonna step away for a while I think its making me really quite cross as I wanted something other than a tradeship and feel like I'm getting squeezed towards a conda which I know will handle better than the AI makes it appear. Thanks for pointing out what my angry brain should have seen.

 

[Vander Mey jr.]

This is gonna come out harsh because I've still got the bag on my head...

No problem there. I think you missed the crux of my post: There is an enormous spread in playstyles out there. You might be "back in an Asp in a day", and thus consider any issues with post-Asp balancing something that needs fixing today. I wanted to point out that there is a substantial fraction of the player base for whom even the playbalance of an Asp is pretty much a non-issue (unless said Asp is sitting on our six, with a bloodthirsty player at the controls, at which point even a well-balanced Asp will probably induce a visit at the insurance front-desk...). These players -- which probably aren't posting much, or even reading at all here -- will have little problems waiting a couple of weeks for such patching.

 

[Logios]

The problem with that statement is that applies to every single ship, the python isn't unique by being able to fit class A thrusters they all do, every single ship performs better than its statistics including the viper that is apparently the 100k measuring stick for balance.

It amazes me that that are trying to balance the Python with the Viper, a ship that costs 350 times less. This isn't a fighting game where all characters must be perfectly balanced, the asymmetry is part of what makes PvP so fun in this game. I don't mind some nerfing, I agree the Python needs it, but they are unloading WAY too much at once.

Oh well, after this patch I'll just use some pocket change and buy the best fighter ship, the Viper.

 

[lordg]

Stat dump for those that care Just remember my percentages before were rough estimates. You might find solace or despair below:

Base Shield Health 390 - 260

0 Pips to engines
Maximum Speed 160 - 140
Max Boosted Speed 280 - 220

Max Forward Acceleration 32 - 30
Max Retro Acceleration 19 - 18
Max Transverse Acceleration 19 - 16

MaxPitchRate 30 - 22
MaxRollRate 100 - 90

4 Pips to engines
Maximum Speed 250 - 200
Max Boosted Speed 330 - 280
Max Pitch Rate 38 - 27

Mike, i know you set your mind on this. But for Peet's sake at least make it faster than the Anaconda (and im not suggesting to reduce the anaconda's speed here). 17% will(or already) cause an outrage why im pertty sure that everybody could live with 10% reduction.

 

[Aleksej]

Mike, i know you set your mind on this. But for Peet's sake at least make it faster than the Anaconda (and im not suggesting to reduce the anaconda's speed here). 17% will(or already) cause an outrage why im pertty sure that everybody could live with 10% reduction.

I think 10% reduction in manoeuvrability would have been unnoticeable. However 17% reduction in top speeds is too much IMO. The issue is that probably you can't modify these values separately.

 

[Roadblock]

Ok Ok.. your right I'm gonna step away for a while I think its making me really quite cross as I wanted something other than a tradeship and feel like I'm getting squeezed towards a conda which I know will handle better than the AI makes it appear. Thanks for pointing out what my angry brain should have seen.

Yeah, I admit I'm feeling rather disappointed now as well. When I first saw Sandy's post about nerfing maneuverability 'a tad', I certainly didn't forsee this big a change.

I go bounty hunting sometimes in my Python, and also in my kitted-out Viper. The Python in its current state is by no means 'fast', nor is it anywhere as maneuverable as a viper. It may pitch fairly quickly, but there is far more inertia carrying the ship when you are trying to turn quickly, so it bleeds speed and 'slides'. To me, it 'feels' much heavier and I do have to use different tactics when engaging smaller ships with the Python than I do with the Viper. I like that I can fit 'more stuff' on the python though, and that it's a lot more survivable in combat.

I felt like it was a nice reward for all of the mindless trade grinding I did, to finally afford a Python, deck it out a little, and then take it hunting. I guess since I mostly play in solo mode, I never felt like it was massively overpowered, given the amount of time that I had to expend to get one.

I guess in the end, it's disappointing that the game went out with the ship in a state so far from what their intended vision was. It has been quite a big tease to have gotten to enjoy it the last couple of weeks.

 

[Logios]

You are adding nothing and you really should take your own advice, i own a Python and am absolutely fine with the changes, they are sorely needed as the ship is way to strong atm, maybe if it cost 100 mill+ then it should stay as it is.

So since you're fine with the changes I'm not allowed to have a differing opinion? ? At least add to the conversation as to WHY you think a top speed of 230 with A thrusters (slower than the conda) is ok with you. You're just stamping your feet and saying that anyone who disagrees is wrong. Learn to have a conversation by stating WHY you think the way you do.

 

[Starbuckz]

So since you're fine with the changes I'm not allowed to have a differing opinion? ? At least add to the conversation as to WHY you think a top speed of 230 with A thrusters (slower than the conda) is ok with you. You're just stamping your feet and saying that anyone who disagrees is wrong. Learn to have a conversation by stating WHY you think the way you do.

I believe it's 230 with the default thrusters, not A rated.

 

[Roadblock]

I think 10% reduction in manoeuvrability would have been unnoticeable. However 17% reduction in top speeds is too much IMO. The issue is that probably you can't modify these values separately.

I disagree, I could immediately tell a difference in 'feel' when I went from D6 thrusters to A6, and that was 'only' a 5% increase in pitch rate, and 6.3% increase in roll rate. It wasn't huge, but I was thinking "oh wow.. that's a bit more snappy".

Even 17% would be quite noticeable, but this change is going to be 26-27% change in pitch rate, which is going to kill it for trying to fight in it (it's still a great trading ship!). I'm not sure it will be fair to classify it as 'multi-role' after this change goes live. I just wish I'd never gotten to play with it in its current state, it is just too much fun!

 

[Starbuckz]

I disagree, I could immediately tell a difference in 'feel' when I went from D6 thrusters to A6, and that was 'only' a 5% increase in pitch rate, and 6.3% increase in roll rate. It wasn't huge, but I was like "oh wow.. that's a bit more snappy".

How could you measure that? As far as I could see there are no numbers indicating anything in this game when upgrading internal componenents

 

[Aleksej]

I believe it's 230 with the default thrusters, not A rated.

But would not that meant that A rated are also going to be reduced by 17%? Otherwise, there is no sense in any changes if A thrusters would provide the same performance as before.