Python Fighters ???

[GraXXoR]

The python do not need fighters, that is said by someone who truly loves the Python and own a heavily modded one.
if any ship need more love it's the T7, totally forgotten and utterly useless.

Someone who actually gets it.

T7 is an unmitigated disaster of a flying coffin with no redeeming features. Heck, it's now been shown up even worse by its once equally-ugly sister, the Keelback, who is currently as we speak on a date with a Ship Launched Fighter.

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And here I was, thinking a new "fighter" variant of the Python was being trialled...

Z...

What on Earth gave you that idea?

 

[DragoonKnight]

Engineers would be pointless as a lateral move. I am glad they are upgrades. They have allowed me to make some old ships worth flying again.

I am starting to see the nature of our disagreement. You see the fighters as a balanced thing. Equivalent to an SCB or HRP of the same class, if it was possible to quantify each of these things. I see them as an overall enhancement/upgrade. Having a fighter deployed not only gives you more offense, but more defense because if the enemy is trying to shoot down your fighter then they are not shooting at you.

 

[GraXXoR]

Putting a fighter on a ship essentially allows you to add the equivalent damage of a class 4 Multicannon. That is a pretty big deal right there.

Yes, and a mobile one that distracts and syphons off damage from enemies at the same time.

What I want to know is why can't we just have 20 batteries of SLF weapons on the corvette.

 

[Agony_Aunt]

Wait a min. We talking about the Python here? The ship that is often lauded as one of the best ships in the game. Comparable with the FdL for combat (oh, the arguments that have raged over that!), best non-large trader, and can fill almost any role... and people want to make it even stronger??? And people even dare to say that its a bad design decision on FDs part?

I'm gobsmacked.

 

[m1dane24]

Got the Python last week and so far, from my limited experience flying it - it's already OP as it is now (have been flying smaller ships these past few months and didn't want to get the Anaconda right away, so as my first venture into the bigger, multi-role ships - got the Python instead). My Python is fairly modded (long jump range, great speed, resistant shields and modded beams) and i can easily massacre Anacondas with it while still not being fully combat fitted; because it's fitted to be multi-role. Adding fighters will just make it more OP.

In my opinion it is the best multi-role ship at the moment, an entry level or stepping stone before you actually move up to the big three. It sits at a fairly odd place in ship progression but it sits there nicely nevertheless.

So, no. The Python does not need to be able to launch fighers

 

[Kastor]

Anyone who's worried about the big three becoming OP should speak out against the nerf to reverberating cascade, their most direct counter. #shamlessplug

But seriously, the Python doesn't need fighters. It's arguably the best versatile trader in the game. It doesn't need the extra power like the Keelback and Gunship and it's fast enough (from an acceleration point of view) to deal well with bombers unlike the big three. (though that point is null if aforementioned nerf goes through)

 

[Devari]

Engineers would be pointless as a lateral move. I am glad they are upgrades. They have allowed me to make some old ships worth flying again.

I am starting to see the nature of our disagreement. You see the fighters as a balanced thing. Equivalent to an SCB or HRP of the same class, if it was possible to quantify each of these things. I see them as an overall enhancement/upgrade. Having a fighter deployed not only gives you more offense, but more defense because if the enemy is trying to shoot down your fighter then they are not shooting at you.

Yes, that's the issue here. I think that all the options in the game should be well-balanced choices. At this point we have auto-includes and sub-par choices, particularly with the Engineering mods. I expect we will see much the same issue with the ship launched fighters in 2.2.

 

[Faybs]

The one medium ship that does need a fighter bay is the Asp Explorer, to defend itself against weird stuff out in the black.

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Yes, and a mobile one that distracts and syphons off damage from enemies at the same time.

What I want to know is why can't we just have 20 batteries of SLF weapons on the corvette.

https://static.greybox.com/dreadnought/static/images/home/team-dreadnought.png

I'd settle for four small or medium hardpoints on each side, pointed outwards to use for broadsides.

 

[Zambrick]

They aren't physically big enough.



Did you even read my post? I'm guessing no.



First, you have no idea how big the fighter bay internal are because they never show you the bay size other than the door. Second, if that were the case then how exactly do fighter bays fit in the Keelback and Gunship? They both have much less internal volume than a Python or Clipper.



No, they don't. As I mentioned above, you can check this with RenderDoc. Cockpit areas are designed, the rest is empty space. I can literally look into the rendered 3D models, aside from the cockpits it is empty space. You would have known this if you read my posts.



Yes, they do. All the time.



Please take some immodium for your own verbal diarrhea, and maybe read my posts before replying next time.

O have read them all sir. All they state is that somehow you are correct and everyone else on the planet are idiots.
Yes I have seen how big the bays are I have tried them out on all the new ships in the beta. All of the ships that it is in have the height needed to fit the bays Width wise a bay could fit in almost all the ships.

Also why are you hacking into the game files and posting it on the forums. Not very smart of you. The rest of the space is currently empty because we cant walk around yet. When we can they will add them. Why render a full interior right now when we cannot walk in them. This was stated at the beginning of the project and FDEV have not come out and said that its canceled. I did read all your posts and am still surprised anyone bothers to listen to you. Research the game a little before you start to spout off and make assumptions. I have been with this game since pre alpha and they have always said they are designing the ships with interiors in mind.

Again I read your posts. You have nothing to offer. You want a fighter inside your fighter so you can fight more. Thats some real inception level stuff. Calling people White Knights as you so colorfully call it only points out your insecurity on the subject. You have have no leg to stand on in regards to this. The Python is a combat trader. It can do one or the other pretty well but it cant do both well. If you want to trade with the ship you will have to take up a cargo bay slot for the fighter bay effectively making it worse than an ASP explorer for trading purposes. So obviously you want it for combat purposes.

The only reason you have a mad on about this is you want more of an advantage for a middle tier ship especially one you like. Your biased attitude and lack of rational thought is to be expected. Please continue putting people down who dont agree with your insane view on how you want all ships to have everything and be the same. Maybe one day people like you will get to ruin the game just enough that you can stand around in a circle angrily stroking each others egos all by yourselves. Until that time if you want balance an fairness in combat go back to CQC or better yet go play some other mindless FPS.

 

[Devari]

O have read them all sir. All they state is that somehow you are correct and everyone else on the planet are idiots.
Yes I have seen how big the bays are I have tried them out on all the new ships in the beta. All of the ships that it is in have the height needed to fit the bays Width wise a bay could fit in almost all the ships.

Height wise the Python is around 18 m vs. around 15 m for the Keelback. Did you miss this part?

Also why are you hacking into the game files and posting it on the forums. Not very smart of you.

It's not "hacking". It's a graphics debugging tool, the 3D equivalent to taking a rendered "screenshot". Do you even know what RenderDoc is?

The rest of the space is currently empty because we cant walk around yet. When we can they will add them. Why render a full interior right now when we cannot walk in them. This was stated at the beginning of the project and FDEV have not come out and said that its canceled. I did read all your posts and am still surprised anyone bothers to listen to you. Research the game a little before you start to spout off and make assumptions. I have been with this game since pre alpha and they have always said they are designing the ships with interiors in mind.

Yet they have no interiors whatsoever except for the cockpits, which we can only even see fully with a VR setup. They suggested they would do a lot of things in this game, and so far they have underdelivered on their current content, much less having any real plans in place for developing full interiors for all 30 ships in the game.

Again I read your posts. You have nothing to offer. You want a fighter inside your fighter so you can fight more. Thats some real inception level stuff. Calling people White Knights as you so colorfully call it only points out your insecurity on the subject. You have have no leg to stand on in regards to this. The Python is a combat trader. It can do one or the other pretty well but it cant do both well. If you want to trade with the ship you will have to take up a cargo bay slot for the fighter bay effectively making it worse than an ASP explorer for trading purposes. So obviously you want it for combat purposes.

Yes, of course I want a fighter primarily for combat, although it does have some secondary uses for planetary exploration as well as to simply have the option available. What else did you expect that we were going to use fighters for?

The only reason you have a mad on about this is you want more of an advantage for a middle tier ship especially one you like. Your biased attitude and lack of rational thought is to be expected. Please continue putting people down who dont agree with your insane view on how you want all ships to have everything and be the same. Maybe one day people like you will get to ruin the game just enough that you can stand around in a circle angrily stroking each others egos all by yourselves. Until that time if you want balance an fairness in combat go back to CQC or better yet go play some other mindless FPS.

Until you can read my posts and understand them I doubt that anything you try to say on the topic will have any actual value.

 

[SheepDip82]

So let's summarise.

The Python isn't getting a fighter bay. Just like the Clipper.

Just because you've "checked the game files" and see nothing - doesn't mean they aren't already modelled. A quick google image search yeilds plenty of results showing ship internals on damaged ships and the like, and FD have previously stated interiors are already planned/modelled (and this is also why ships take time to produce). You can't possibly claim to know the opposite based on your investigations.

Deal with it.

Edit - I should add, that most of the posters in this thread agree with FD's position.

 

[Devari]

The Python isn't getting a fighter bay. Just like the Clipper.

The issue here isn't just the fact that the Python and Clipper aren't getting fighters. It's the reasons why certain ships are getting them, and other's aren't, which is going to cause game balance issues.

Just because you've "checked the game files" and see nothing - doesn't mean they aren't already modelled. A quick google image search yeilds plenty of results showing ship internals on damaged ships and the like, and FD have previously stated interiors are already planned/modelled (and this is also why ships take time to produce). You can't possibly claim to know the opposite based on your investigations.

So let me get this straight. FD couldn't even get Horizons out on time, and when we finally got Engineers it was a buggy, imbalanced mess that wasn't even properly sorted out with their final 2.1.05 patch. And yet your suggesting that they've got fully-modelled ship interiors, just waiting for us to step into?

Mmmmmkay. Sure. Yeah, that sounds totally reasonable.

Deal with it.

I am. By purchasing an Anaconda that can launch fighters, which will likely become the new OP meta once 2.2 launches.

 

[rrobes]

Devari: Yet they have no interiors whatsoever except for the cockpits...

I beg to differ, due to a graphic display anomaly, I did once see the inside of my Python while approaching the ship from the stern in my SRV. It appeared to be finished, mainly an open space with finished walls. So I think FD is ahead of the game on this, just not ready for prime time.

 

[Devari]

Devari: Yet they have no interiors whatsoever except for the cockpits...

I beg to differ, due to a graphic display anomaly, I did once see the inside of my Python while approaching the ship from the stern in my SRV. It appeared to be finished, mainly an open space with finished walls. So I think FD is ahead of the game on this, just not ready for prime time.

I've seen similar glitches, mostly in the external camera debug mode or when clipping into my ship in the SRV, and I haven't seen anything like this so far. I've certainly never seen anything to suggest they have a fully designed interior, you were likely seeing the interior "walls" along the hull sections. If anyone can find screenshots or 3D renders with evidence to the contrary however I would certainly be interested in seeing it.

 

[Thetele]

Python is the best ship to do missions, best ship to trade to outpost, amazing mining ship, not best but good combat ship, good piracy (against npc) ship, jump range is good and really benefits from engineers. Also python can be fitted so it can do pretty much any activity in game well or better than many other ships.

Also python is cheap to outfit and rebuy is low.

Keelback and fgs cost less than python and are much worse ships, not many people use them. But fighters are buff for those. Those ships were designed to get fighters and are weak ships without fighter. And i think the python will still be much better ship than keelback or fgs with their fighters and much more versatile than cutter, corvette, anaconda or type-9. There is reason why python is one of the most popular ship and lack of fighters won't remove that fact.

Also npc don't have fighters so if you just want to fly python nothing will change.

 

[Daffan]

Because it will also make the Anaconda, Corvette and Cutter overpowered. If the fighters are "balanced" for those ships there won't be any problem putting them on a Python, especially given that the Python has to give up a much higher proportion of its cargo space to do so.

Nobody cares about cargo space in combat

Secondly, just because fighters are on bigger ships doesn't make them overpowered - the python has a lot going for it that the big ships dont. Smaller, faster, medium pads, agility etc etc Big ships are garbage for PvP 90% of the time

 

[Devari]

Nobody cares about cargo space in combat

Secondly, just because fighters are on bigger ships doesn't make them overpowered - the python has a lot going for it that the big ships dont. Smaller, faster, medium pads, agility etc etc Big ships are garbage for PvP 90% of the time

Did you read the discussion where I explained in detail what the Python can use it's internal space for as an alternative to using a fighter bay? If it isn't used for a fighter bay it will be used for SCBs or HRPs.

Large ships aren't "garbage" for PvP at all. Corvette and Cutter are currently the best combat ships at the moment, either firepower/shields for the Corvette or speed/shields for the Cutter. If it wasn't for the OP heat meta and the (very limited ammo) torpedoes they would be unstoppable, and the heat meta needs a massive nerf.

 

[Kizbot]

Other than the cockpit spaces, ships are empty hulls in the game. You can check this yourself using RenderDoc to see how the ships are modelled internally. Other than the cockpits, they aren't.

That's not what Sheepdip meant, It's been mentioned several times that FD have already modelled the internal layout for the ships, ready for when they include walking about ships, that part of the model is just not in the game yet. Knowing they were planning on adding the ability to walk around the ship in a later update, the design team would have drawn up the internal layout during the ships concept > 3d model stage. That feature is not in the game yet though, so makes no sense to render invisible polygons which is why the hull is empty at the moment like you say when the view clips throught the ship. Would be far to risky and cause unforseen problems to only give the internal layout consideration years later when it becomes visible.

 

[Cynaqq]

Alright, I solved it!

No need to redesign the fighters, Python itself or the internal fighter bays. The key word here is internal.

FD should implement a roof rack for the Python (or any ship with the necessary roof real estate and enable the strapping of a single fighter on there. It'll be uncovered, yes but the shield generator can shield that too.

Proof of concept here:

 

[bubbabenali]

Yeah, give the most versatile ship in the game another goody, what can totaly go wrong?