Engineers Query: Does Emissive improve turret & gimbal tracking? Thermal Shock? 'Fire at will' mode?

[V'larr]

So I've been scouring reddit & google searches for a day now without any concrete result, just hearsay and passing anecdotes, for information on precisely how the Emissive special effect impacts the tracking of gimballed and turrets, particularly at long range.

I'm wondering if anybody here happens to know? (Anything to get out of having to experiment and resource-grind on my own... )

And given that signatures are directly related to heat level, does Thermal Shock (or an array of weapons with that effect) also have a similar effect?

Lastly, I read somewhere that turrets on 'fire at will mode' lose the jitter...is that true or no?

edit: And what about emissive as it relates to seeking missiles/torpedos?

Video comparisons would be super cool.

 

[Nero Tacitus]

I haven't tested it personally, but I recall reading enough solid evidence regarding the mechanics of tracking to conclude that nothing improves targeting, including emissive.

AFAIK, the tracking of gimballed/turreted is simply a binary mechanic; if you have a lock and the target is in weapon range, the weapon(s) will fire, with a predetermined amount of random jitter. Emissive doesn't alter this mechanic, it simply applies a debuff to the target creating a minimum level of heat the target must produce, regardless of engaging silent running or using a heat sink. As long as the target is producing sufficient heat to maintain detection at the given range, emissive does nothing.
As this effect doesn't 'raise' the heat of the target, it only enforces a kind of 'heat floor', I can't see a world in which it would impact long range detection. The target would be producing the same amount of heat, so emissive would again only prevent it dropping due to heat sink/silent running usage.

This seems to make sense, both mechanically and from a balance perspective. If emissive improved tracking, it would be absolutely mandatory for combat ships (which I've never heard anyone argue. Corrisve, yes, emissive, no). This would also apply to thermal shock, which was only popular when it was overpowered, and that quality had nothing to do with tracking. There were also rumblings a while ago about making sensor grade influence tracking angle. I don't recall emissive etc coming up in the debates regarding tracking mechanics.

As for turret mode, as I don't use them I can't say, but I'd be extremely surprised if anything removed jitter, especially a mode. Fire at Will and Fire Forward are simply firing modes, they would have no impact on the accuracy of the targeting software (logic =/= game design, yes, but still).

 

[V'larr]

I haven't tested it personally, but I recall reading enough solid evidence regarding the mechanics of tracking to conclude that nothing improves targeting, including emissive.

AFAIK, the tracking of gimballed/turreted is simply a binary mechanic; if you have a lock and the target is in weapon range, the weapon(s) will fire, with a predetermined amount of random jitter. Emissive doesn't alter this mechanic, it simply applies a debuff to the target creating a minimum level of heat the target must produce, regardless of engaging silent running or using a heat sink. As long as the target is producing sufficient heat to maintain detection at the given range, emissive does nothing.
As this effect doesn't 'raise' the heat of the target, it only enforces a kind of 'heat floor', I can't see a world in which it would impact long range detection. The target would be producing the same amount of heat, so emissive would again only prevent it dropping due to heat sink/silent running usage.

This seems to make sense, both mechanically and from a balance perspective. If emissive improved tracking, it would be absolutely mandatory for combat ships (which I've never heard anyone argue. Corrisve, yes, emissive, no). This would also apply to thermal shock, which was only popular when it was overpowered, and that quality had nothing to do with tracking. There were also rumblings a while ago about making sensor grade influence tracking angle. I don't recall emissive etc coming up in the debates regarding tracking mechanics.

As for turret mode, as I don't use them I can't say, but I'd be extremely surprised if anything removed jitter, especially a mode. Fire at Will and Fire Forward are simply firing modes, they would have no impact on the accuracy of the targeting software (logic =/= game design, yes, but still).

So the jist of this is, you don't know for sure either, eh?

 

[Nero Tacitus]

So the jist of this is, you don't know for sure either, eh?

Well, only way to know for sure is to test it yourself. I mean, you could get lucky and someone could come along and unequivocally state yes or no, but how could you be sure they're telling the truth....?

Better safe than sorry.

 

[Bunkerkind Anni]

wouldn't that be the perfect topic for Kornelius Briedis?

 

[Kzak]

AFAIK the Emissive effect just makes the target easier to spot for your sensors, to the point that dropping a heatsink and having 0% heat will have no effect, nothing more.

 

[Morbad]

AFAIK, the tracking of gimballed/turreted is simply a binary mechanic

This is not the case.

Heat signature plays a big part in how well gimbals track. You can see this while fighting a silent running opponent, or one who has used a heatsink. Even if they are resolved enough for you to target because they are firing at you, your gimbals will be limited to a very small tracking arc, often only the size of the targeting circle around the reticule itself.

Go to the half-way point of this video:
[video=youtube;Qq9TDEvg-tU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qq9TDEvg-tU[/video]

Both of those FASes are silent running nearly the whole fight and I am using four gimbaled cannon. You can see how narrow my tracking arc is even when they are resolved enough for me to target...I have to be within ~5 degrees or so of the lead indicator. If they weren't silent, the tracking arc would be essentially my whole FOV.

I'm less certain about how turrets are affected as they seem to have their own independent sensor systems.

AFAIK the Emissive effect just makes the target easier to spot for your sensors, to the point that dropping a heatsink and having 0% heat will have no effect, nothing more.

Also not the case.

Emissive definitely improves gimbal tracking against very cold targets and reduces missile lock time/enables missile lock.

And given that signatures are directly related to heat level, does Thermal Shock (or an array of weapons with that effect) also have a similar effect?

Thermal shock will not directly increase the sensor signature of a target and thermal shock against a silent running foe won't make them resolve any differently or improve weapon tracking/lock.

However, it still adds heat, which will increase the signature of non-silent targets and reduce the time other targets can remain silent.

Lastly, I read somewhere that turrets on 'fire at will mode' lose the jitter...is that true or no?

I'm pretty sure fire-at-will turrets still have some jitter. They are also are still vulnerable to chaff/dispersal effects. However, they seem to resolve targets independently of main sensors, making silent running and TLB less effective.