Serious proposals on how to reconcile the Anaconda WITHOUT DIRECTLY NERFING IT. (+Jump range)

[ErichZann]

I just checked ED shipyard and you are factually wrong.

Hull hardness:

FDL: 405

Corvette: 666

Cutter: 720

Anaconda: 945

You don't even know what hull hardness is or where to look, good job *thumbs up*

Frontier were fools to ignore the Conda the first time around. These people blindly defending their broken ship don't seem to comprehend that as long as the Anaconda remains how it is in relation to the big ships that no other ship comparable or equivalent to it will ever be made. No explorer will ever be better, no passenger ship will ever be worth the money, no combat ship will ever live up to its potential, and no trade ship will be able to compete with its jump range.

Explorer: Might be true, depends on preferences, many people also prefer the Asp or DBE.
Combat: The Corvette is better in most situations, and especially where it matters (PvP)....
Trading: The Cutter is superior in trading and also has a nice jump range when fully ladden. You know, an Anaconda full of cargo cant jump 70 LYs, right? T9 also has much more cargo now, there it depends on the range....

So yeah, keep it coming with your one-sided "arguments"

 

[Shinji Ikari]

You don't even know what hull hardness is or where to look, good job *thumbs up*

Is it some sort of hidden value?

ED shipyard also lists the three types of resistances which are the same for all ships.

 

[ErichZann]

Is it some sort of hidden value?

ED shipyard also lists the three types of resistances which are the same for all ships.

No, its not hidden, check the denfense stats panel in the game instead of Coriolis.

And yeah, independent of that, I can agree that the Anaconda has a bit too many hull hitpoints, that could be reduced. But it's not the god ship many people in here try to make it.

 

[RamirezKurita]

I just checked ED shipyard and you are factually wrong.

Hull hardness:

FDL: 405

Corvette: 666

Cutter: 720

Anaconda: 945

That's hull integrity, not hull hardness. They are two separate values. Integrity is basically ship HP, damage reduces it; Hardness is basically damage resistance against low calibre projectiles, with each weapon having a certain penetration value.

The 'Vette, Cutter and FDL have 70 hardness, while the 'Conda, T9 and Python have 65. Small difference that doesn't really mean anything, but it's still there. Railguns, PAs and all huge hardpoint weapons all have enough penetration to ignore even the 70 hardness ships,

 

[Shinji Ikari]

No, its not hidden, check the denfense stats panel in the game instead of Coriolis.

And yeah, independent of that, I can agree that the Anaconda has a bit too many hull hitpoints, that could be reduced. But it's not the god ship many people in here try to make it.

That's hull integrity, not hull hardness. They are two separate values. Integrity is basically ship HP, damage reduces it; Hardness is basically damage resistance against low calibre projectiles, with each weapon having a certain penetration value.

The 'Vette, Cutter and FDL have 70 hardness, while the 'Conda, T9 and Python have 65. Small difference that doesn't really mean anything, but it's still there. Railguns, PAs and all huge hardpoint weapons all have enough penetration to ignore even the 70 hardness ships,

Thanks for clarification.

 

[crushdepth]

Is it some sort of hidden value?

ED shipyard also lists the three types of resistances which are the same for all ships.

I don't think official values have been published, but people have worked it out through experimentation. Have a google there's a couple if lists floating around.

Basically it reduces weapon damage, mainly for small weapons IIRC.

 

[Mengy]

Is it some sort of hidden value?

ED shipyard also lists the three types of resistances which are the same for all ships.

The Anaconda has more armor points than every other ship except for the T10, but it's hull hardness is less than the Cutter, FDL, Corvette, and T10. Armor is basically hit points and hull hardness is basically physical resistance to damage.

That said though it is very odd that the Anaconda with it's super light 400T hull mass has more armor than much heavier combat ships.

 

[ManRightChea]

Explorer: Might be true, depends on preferences, many people also prefer the Asp or DBE.
Combat: The Corvette is better in most situations, and especially where it matters (PvP)....
Trading: The Cutter is superior in trading and also has a nice jump range when fully ladden. You know, an Anaconda full of cargo cant jump 70 LYs, right? T9 also has much more cargo now, there it depends on the range....

So yeah, keep it coming with your one-sided "arguments"

None of your supposed rebuts to me are anything but subjective nonsense. Yet you act like you just provided a ton of facts to me while willingly avoiding the point. Honestly watching people try to justify the Anaconda is similar to watching a drug addict try to explain why they aren't a junkie.

It doesn't matter if the Conda won't jump 70 light years full of cargo if that jump range is still superior to any trade ship that is fully laden. The one class of ship that has every right to have a good jump range. Every exploration ship will still be outclassed by a ship that pretends to be multi-role, yet it has the highest DPS, military slots, and can equip a fighter hangar. Your preferences for combat aren't what matters, I never mentioned PvP. The fact is that a combat fit Anaconda will have a ton of armor advantage and still has better jump range than the Cutter or Corvette.

The Anaconda still represents the regression of humanity within the lore. If the other ships aren't buffed, it will mean that humanity stopped progressing. Even 400 years later the combined effort of the Federation and Empire could still not create a ship better than a 400 year old freighter. This is the current active lore.

I don't care if my arguments are one-sided as long as they are accurate. However people like you just move goalposts, because you already know how broken the ship is and have nothing else to say that would be of any value. So maybe try to learn something other than ad hominem, try to find counterpoints that actually have some semblance of factual information. I'm not interested in your playground level temper tantrums.

 

[V'larr]

It has already been stated that FDEV know that the Annie is OP and that it's too late to nerf it without a spit storm.....

I'm sorry, Fdev, but oh my god that is stupid.

It is never too late to nerf something that you, as a developer, know is OP, and that you community also knows is OP. There is no such thing as "off the table".

You are manning the controls of the game, you are at the helm, you are responsible for the health and well-being of the game, so ACT LIKE IT for Braben's sake.

I mean come on, you've been happy to stick to your guns with crew XP and permadeath, why the heck not apply that here??? Ugh.


@OP: ALL of this boils down to:

The Anaconda needs a nerf.

or "buff everything else".

a.k.a. Sink ourselves even further down the Power creep balance-out-the-window hole we've been sinking into over the past couple years and make the galaxy smaller (relative to our speed of interstellar travel) *yet again*. We've had more than plenty of that, all of which I personally see as having been totally unecessary, so I really don't see why we need to keep adding to it.

Using Engineers as a bandaid is shoddy and creates at least as many new problems as it might solve. I hate how Engineers is & has been treated as a bandaid to other issues with the game - ones that, without Engineers, remain unfixed and often even with the bandaid are still a problem, so I'm against seeing it happen again here.

 

[PiLhEaD]

Rather than pursue this seemingly endless race to the bottom, where everything has to be made harder, slower, ever yet more painful, let me suggest an alternate solution:

Improve all other ships such that any one ship's alleged unbalanced advantage is now not so advantageous.

As Cyndi Lauuper almost sang, 'Commanders just wanna have fun!'.

 

[crushdepth]

Filthy corvette pilots, I shall smite thee with my +5 Anaconda of Unfair OP Lightness. Take that!

 

[Old Duck]

A thought popped into my head recently, and while others may not agree with my logic, it makes me happy so I'm sticking with it. It used to bother me that the Conda's sensors have a mass of 160 tons. I mean, that's nuts! Especially since they are no better than a Sidewinder's sensors IIRC. Trying to make sense of this, I came to imagine the sensors being part of what we visualize as the hull, yet not technically the hull. There is a precedent for this IRL - the sonar dome of a nuclear submarine.

So what does this mean? The overall "shell" that is the stock Anaconda is actually 560 tons. Granted, this is still significantly less than the Type-9, but it's more than the Type-7, and I don't find it so implausible. Still a bit too light, yes, but not as ridiculously light as before.

Anyway, just something to think about

 

[John Xenir]

Out of curiosity: has Frontier actually acknowledged they'll do anything about ship balance post-3.0?

 

[Watcher]

Out of curiosity: has Frontier actually acknowledged they'll do anything about ship balance post-3.0?

Not that I know of but I'm absolutely sure they keep an eye on ship utilisation and how the various ships balance out between each other. They've shown a willingness to make tweaks in the past and I'm sure they will continue to do so in the future.

 

[Lily from anim.o.v.e]

If credits and engineering wouldn't be a horrible grind, "nerfing" it wouldn't be an issues because people could go and do other stuff quickly not feeling a huge painfull loss.
But is it truly OP? or are cutter & co just lacking?

why does the annie have a better PD than the cutter? or reverse why has the cutter less.
Why does the annie have more first class passangers than the beluga? or why has the beluga less?
Why .......

see you can change the angle of view. The annie is a well feelling all around ship. it has many internals, making it the only true multipurpsoe because you can slap in a discovery scanner WITHOUT having to waste a whole class of space.

so why not buff some others to give them better dedicated roles while the annie keeps the allorund role?
Also, the Annaies popularity, is it because it is op, or because it is not behind a huge grindwall of MONEY AND RANK?

 

[Mengy]

Out of curiosity: has Frontier actually acknowledged they'll do anything about ship balance post-3.0?

Sandro has talked about possibly buffing the Asp Scout, but that's it really.

 

[CMDR KRITIKOSK8]

Here is my serious proposal,

Anaconda is op and everybody knows it. That is why condabois are so fiercely defending against nerfs.

I am a balancetard. Either pull the other big ships in line with the conda or make the condas hull mass something that makes sense.

It does make sense. It is built from light-weight but strong material, like pro carbon bikes. Let's Nerf all carbon bikes instead, because it's op. Every one(even in roleplay) can have a conda. Y think it's op? Buy one. Fit as y like. The ships don't need to be equal. This is life( or a space based game for many) and things are not equal in life,nor fair too. That type of argument is like communist ones. Let's bring them all to equality, but put everyone in misery in the process.

 

[RagingxPenguin]

Filthy corvette pilots, I shall smite thee with my +5 Anaconda of Unfair OP Lightness. Take that!

Let me know how that goes. Seeing as hull tanking in a large is still an utter joke even with 5000 hull.

 

[CMDR KRITIKOSK8]

The Anaconda has more armor points than every other ship except for the T10, but it's hull hardness is less than the Cutter, FDL, Corvette, and T10. Armor is basically hit points and hull hardness is basically physical resistance to damage.

That said though it is very odd that the Anaconda with it's super light 400T hull mass has more armor than much heavier combat ships.

There's the passive and reactive armor concept too don't forget that. Tanks nowadays are lighter and have more hull(aka armor)

 

[Cmdr Delmonte[VR]]

Corvette 'NEEDS' to be what it should be, a Corvette! Jump range etc are what they are but the two small hardpoints should be medium IMO
and one large or two medium on the fore the deck. (Love seeing the anaconda guns in front of me )

It should also be the only ship capable of two fighters controlled by AI, this thing should be feared, but a wing of smaller more manoeuvrable ships will still be able to take it on.

For now, i tend to use my Annie as the jump range is a bonus and in terms of weapons power there is very little in it to make paying millions in transfer
or hours in flight to use my Corvo, just my 10 credits of debate o7

From Wiki A corvette is a small warship. It is traditionally the smallest class of vessel considered to be a proper (or "rated") warship