They don't seem OP in my limited experience. I'm in a Cobra doing assassination missions. if I'm not careful and an anaconda takes me to 0 shields, I can't even use the thing until my shields reactivate, which then means 4 pips to sys to speed it up ... etc. Also, the shield cell only recharges over time, it's not instant. In one fight I was at one shield bar, I used a cell, while under fire, and I was taking enough damage that the shield never got beyond 1 bar before the charge ran out. Perhaps there's an issue with the power curve of higher rated shield cells, or in other words maybe the top end units are recharging shields too fast. But from where I'm at, a mid range Cobra with around 1 million CR in upgrades, they seem perfectly fine and not OP at all.
Shield Cells OP
- Thread starter Miimis Maks
- Start date
Well, then I suppose the onus is to suggest an alternative.
Without shield cells, the complaint will be that relatively smaller ships -- and that could mean a Cobra versus an Anaconda -- all the way up the food chain have no chance of fleeing combat in which they are outmatched.
That to me is the greater evil to combat.
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I don't think there's such a thing as ''no chance''... there's a lot of things that you can do, or mistakes you can exploit, to get the upper hand, even in a stock Sidewinder. And the main use of shield cells will never be poor Sidewinders running away from evil pirates, I'm pretty sure of that.
Well it didnt seem to be a critical problem for the almost-year we played before they added shield cells. An anaconda is slower than all the smaller ships bar the hauler AFAIK.
I suppose you believe no alternative is necessary. Fine. We disagree.
The opposite; we need an alternative to what I think is becoming the omni-survival tool.
Evil pirates shooting at you because you will not surrender? Shield cell.
Your enemy cutting through your shields because he/she outmanuevered you? Shield cell.
Your enemy cutting through your shields because you are facing them and they have better weaponry than you? Shield cell.
Stupid system authority trying to stop you from righteously scooping your victim's silver canisters? Shield cell.
Your enemy cutting through your shields because they have an Anaconda with turrets and you have an Eagle? Shield cell.
Station guns? Shield cell. Enemy rammed you to weaken your shields? Shield cell. Your enemy spent 5 missiles to soften up your shields? Shield cell.
I made it a point throughout Alpha and Beta to test the Sidewinder to its limits. I found, based on that experience, that the shield cell bank was the one thing that gave the Sidewinder a fighting chance as a solo combat ship. I never succeeded, mind you, taking on players in bigger, badder ships. Not once. That said, I would hate to come across in my current Cobra, say, three Sidewinders that were comparably equipped to what I was flying. Killer bees.
At earlier iterations, I found the shield cell bank to be essential to being able to get out of trouble I didn't want in the first place. Prior to that, my experience in the Sidey was simply getting blown up a lot by bigger, badder ships, and very quickly at that.
It was important from my perspective to test the game in a mismatch set. I knew bigger, badder ships would have better upgrades and be more powerful, so the test was to see how good the starter ship could go. It wasn't until the shield cells that the starter ship felt survivable and worth upgrading.
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Which is no alternative. Okay, you want them gone. Got it. Duly noted.
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Hyperbole. Shield cells are neither blatantly overpowered nor game breaking.
I would say the game would be broken without them. Cells allow combat to be possible. Without them it would be short and unpleasant for anyone besides the guy with the biggest guns/ship.
That would be a terrible direction to go in. Right now nearly any ship is at least viable and somewhat survivable. Without cells, fights would be over before than even began for most players.
I can see some want the game to be completely hardcore, but that's just not a direction I would be able to play in. Combat is quite challenging as is.
I'm sure this is really about PvP, which can never be balanced, because someone always loses in PvP, and they always call for nerfs because of it.
This is really sounding like a "Rock is fine, Nerf scissors, signed Paper" type of issue at this point.
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Sounder Deeps
Banned
Good post. I'm not huge either way but from a gamer perspective if I don't consider NOT fitting an item, it should probably be looked at. Cells are a no brainer to me. Never even really considered it, should just be built in stock lol.
My goodness, how tedious, you might have to wait for your lasers to recharge and go in for another salvo! Where's an energy bomb when you need one?
I tested the above to the death over a hundred times. The shield cell for the starter ship was the difference between life and death.
The only time I've used them was in an unarmed L6 keeping pirates at bay. Perhaps if they were mapped to a weapon trigger and drew power like a weapon, they would require a little deftness in their use and give the attacker a chance. If you took them for combat then you'd have to sacrifice a weapon slot too maybe, so they'd be more like a weapon in their use.
That's kind of the problem. It's the difference between life and death a lot too much.
That's an interesting thought.
What if it took up an utility slot?
I think I suggested this earlier, but another possibility would also be to redo the cells so that using one refills your shield equal to the amount that the energy currently in your SYS capacitor would refilll your shields with ordinary regeneration. I think that would be interesting.
I probably haven't been using my Shield Cells correctly. I still kept getting blown up so I don't think they are really that invincible imho...
- OldSchoolPlayer
That's what I think. They should be expensive and single use, so using them would hurt a little, be a last resort before losing your shields, not a "Shields down? L0Ln0pe!" joke.
I love em, and I've always got one on board, I stacked them once but even I thought that was a bit over the top, removed it felt dirty. There'ye a life saver if you ever find yourself on the nasty end on a high end Python.
They should stay in the game, but I agree they should be limited to one bank per ship, and drastically up the cost of ammo and possibly reduce the total charges. At least you'll be forced to decide what Class slot to sacrafice for the module at least, and have to make a tactical call when to use one if it's truely a limited resource.
Not so sure on the cooldown, shouldn't really be an issue if theres limited stores.
Saying that it's balanced because everyone can use it is ludicrous. I really hope the proponents of that excessively weak argument understand this.
Just because something is usable by everyone Does NOT make that module balanced relative to the other potential usable modules. When everyone uses shield injectors for combat instead of things like chaff packs or whatever else it's clearly for a good reason, ie. it's too strong compared to alternatives. That makes it, by definition, unbalanced.
Because we can all use something that's overpowered does not make it less overpowered. It really isn't a difficult thing to understand. Please, stop making that argument, and attempt to come up with something sensible.
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Nah bro, equip a chaff pack. That would be SO MUCH BETTER than a shield cell. Obviously, the chaff pack is too powerful because no one would ever use it over a shield cell. Balance.
Just because something is usable by everyone Does NOT make that module balanced relative to the other potential usable modules. When everyone uses shield injectors for combat instead of things like chaff packs or whatever else it's clearly for a good reason, ie. it's too strong compared to alternatives. That makes it, by definition, unbalanced.
Because we can all use something that's overpowered does not make it less overpowered. It really isn't a difficult thing to understand. Please, stop making that argument, and attempt to come up with something sensible.
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Nah bro, equip a chaff pack. That would be SO MUCH BETTER than a shield cell. Obviously, the chaff pack is too powerful because no one would ever use it over a shield cell. Balance.
LOL thank you for illustrating exactly why the shield cell is overpowered. Please, continue typing and prove my point.
And....what? You sound like one of those "nobody really wins" type people. Most of us, when we lose in a reasonable fight, understand what mistakes we made and attempt to improve ourselves so we win next time. Just because I lost an uphill fight does not mean I call for nerfs.
However, when I take a fight and lose because I'm not using an overpowered module (shield cell) I call for nerfs to the shield cell because it is obviously far superior to all alternatives.
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Sounds like someone got butthurt cause he got smashed and could not pew pew a pc enemy and started to cry nerf shieldz cezzzllzz 111!1!1!!1omg
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Just stop it, you all coffee table game designers
You've become too use to modern MMOs. Not every module needs to balanced to force tradeoffs and choices in a given module class. It's ok if there's a (perceived) best choice.
Also, it's early days. It's quite possible what everyone thinks is the best module right now will change as player tactics change. There was a recent article on Super Smash Brothers Melee about a month back showing how the character rankings have changed over the years. They've changed a lot and continued to change over time. The funny thing? The game has never been patched. It's exactly the same as it was when it was released 12 years ago.
http://forrestthewoods.com/unbalanced-design-of-super-smash-brothers/
Think about that. People are looking at the exact same game for 12 years an still discovering new strategy, new tactics. Given that, I think it's a bit early (it's just day 2) to go mucking about with things. I would be very grateful if, unlike many MMOs, Elite Dangerous was more or less the same game 10 years down the line. It's got a certain charm to it that need not be remove through overzealous tweaking.
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